peterv Posted October 16, 2014 Share #1 Posted October 16, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) I've been playing with a couple of T DNG's that are availble around the web and I was wondering why there are no profiles for the T lenses in Lr. Does any know? The M and S profiles are downloaded automatically and I would expect the same for T lens profiles. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 16, 2014 Posted October 16, 2014 Hi peterv, Take a look here Lightroom support for T lenses. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
peterv Posted October 18, 2014 Author Share #2 Posted October 18, 2014 Strange that this question did not get any replies, but I see now there were some typos, so here's my question once more: I've been playing with a couple of T DNG's (which I like a lot) that are availble around the web and I was wondering why there are no profiles for the T lenses in Lightroom? Does anyone know? The M and S profiles are downloaded automatically and I would expect the same for T lens profiles? If the lens corrections are applied under the hood automatically, than why does the T have a system, different from M and S? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbealnz Posted October 18, 2014 Share #3 Posted October 18, 2014 Peter. Only thing I can think of is that the camera and lenses are too new. In the fullness of time, with subsequent LR updates, the profiles should become available perhaps? Gary 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thighslapper Posted October 18, 2014 Share #4 Posted October 18, 2014 (edited) The lens corrections are written into the DNG file by the camera (opcodes) and automatically applied by LR. There is no need for further LR profiles. This was the subject of a lot of moans and groans initially about the optical quality of the zoom in particular ...... as users that had other RAW developers which did not apply the additional DNG info noted quite marked barrelling and the fact that the images were larger as they had not been corrected and cropped. There is software correction applied in camera for almost all lenses used in this sensor format ...... as fully correcting optically would result in much larger and more expensive lenses. This facility only exists in the current version of DNG (1.3) and the older M and S DNG formats require additional LR profiles to do this ..... .... and if you ever add a new T lens to the camera you will get a 'Loading lens firmware profile' message the first time you use it ...... which gives the game away .... Edited October 18, 2014 by thighslapper 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted October 18, 2014 Share #5 Posted October 18, 2014 This facility only exists in the current version of DNG (1.3) and the older M and S DNG formats require additional LR profiles to do this ..... Strictly speaking Leica has used DNG 1.3 before – the M (Typ 240) for example identifies the DNG version as 1.3. Only it doesn’t use the option of writing opcodes to the files that was introduced in that version. The current version of the DNG spec is 1.4, btw. 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterv Posted October 18, 2014 Author Share #6 Posted October 18, 2014 Many thanks for your replies, guys! What I find a bit intriguing, is that Lr doesn't let the user know that the lens profiles are being used. Personally, I have nothing against software corrections, it's just that I'd like to be able to see in the lens correction panel whether corrections are being applied or not. And also I'd like to be given the option to turn them on or off manually. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petster Posted November 30, 2014 Share #7 Posted November 30, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hmm... I was wondering as well why I do not have any profiles in LR. So I found this thread and I am still wondering. I guess my DNGs from the T in Lightroom do not have a lens correction, but the JPGs have. See the comparision between the jpg and the dng. Any ideas? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted November 30, 2014 Share #8 Posted November 30, 2014 Lightroom always applies the lens corrections as prescribed in the DNG files. Having said that there are still small differences between a JPEG created by the camera and a DNG file developed in Lightroom, due to the different algorithms used etc.. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bencoyote Posted November 30, 2014 Share #9 Posted November 30, 2014 Strictly speaking Leica has used DNG 1.3 before – the M (Typ 240) for example identifies the DNG version as 1.3. Only it doesn’t use the option of writing opcodes to the files that was introduced in that version. The current version of the DNG spec is 1.4, btw. There is an interesting article in LFI 3/2011 about profiles: "Now it is a little bit delicate for a camera systems manufacturer to offer digital correction of optical weaknesses, especially when - as in the case of Leica - one promotes the S lenses offer perfect results without digital aid. This certainly is a little side blow to competitors of which some do explicitly bank on the aid of software. Thus for Leica the question simply was whether or not they should take the opportunity for digital corrections, as presented on a silver platter by Adobe or not." So I think that Adobe out of deference to the egos of all manufacturers not just Leica doesn't quite make it explicit that software correction is being done when it is specified in the DNG by the lens manufacturers. The required optical precsion for M lenses must be higher because they don't know if someone is going to use it on a film where no digital correction can be applied or on a digital camera. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanJW Posted December 1, 2014 Share #10 Posted December 1, 2014 LR may not show the built in profile but ACR does: Look at the bottom. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/235615-lightroom-support-for-t-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=2718868'>More sharing options...
AlanJW Posted December 1, 2014 Share #11 Posted December 1, 2014 And if you are wondering what happens when you click on the little i, here is what ACR will tell you: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/235615-lightroom-support-for-t-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=2718870'>More sharing options...
peterv Posted December 1, 2014 Author Share #12 Posted December 1, 2014 Thanks Alan, if LR would only display this useful message, there would not have been any reason for me to start this thread. Oh well, I learned about DNG verions, which is nice to know. Thanks everyone! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petster Posted December 2, 2014 Share #13 Posted December 2, 2014 Thanks Alan and I must agree with Peter that it would help if LR is showing such info as well. Anyhow, I am still wondering which of the profiles, JPG or DNG profile, is the better one. The differences between the pictures are quite obvious. Maybe I should shoot a test chart and check for myself. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterv Posted December 2, 2014 Author Share #14 Posted December 2, 2014 Hey Pete, congrats on your new Leica T! You didn't sell your S2, did you? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petster Posted December 3, 2014 Share #15 Posted December 3, 2014 Hey Pete, congrats on your new Leica T! You didn't sell your S2, did you? Am I mad? Nope! But honestly the T is my wifes camera. So I am as happy as she is. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterv Posted December 3, 2014 Author Share #16 Posted December 3, 2014 Thanks, good to know Wish you and your wife lots of good light for both cameras! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterv Posted March 24, 2015 Author Share #17 Posted March 24, 2015 Pardon me for reviving this old thread, but I thought this might be of interest to T users, and for future reference. I just came across this article by Lloyd Chambers: diglloyd: Adobe Camera Raw Now Shows that a Built-in Lens Profile is Applied It seems now, as of the recent update to Adobe Camera Raw 8.8.0 (397) Lr does show that an automatic lens correction is applied, like ACR already did as described above. Cheers, Peter 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 26, 2015 Share #18 Posted October 26, 2015 The lens corrections are written into the DNG file by the camera (opcodes) and automatically applied by LR. There is no need for further LR profiles. This was the subject of a lot of moans and groans initially about the optical quality of the zoom in particular ...... as users that had other RAW developers which did not apply the additional DNG info noted quite marked barrelling and the fact that the images were larger as they had not been corrected and cropped. There is software correction applied in camera for almost all lenses used in this sensor format ...... as fully correcting optically would result in much larger and more expensive lenses. This facility only exists in the current version of DNG (1.3) and the older M and S DNG formats require additional LR profiles to do this ..... .... and if you ever add a new T lens to the camera you will get a 'Loading lens firmware profile' message the first time you use it ...... which gives the game away .... Thank you for this detailed information as I had exactly this question. So no separate profiles needed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bencoyote Posted October 28, 2015 Share #19 Posted October 28, 2015 (edited) By the way In the JPG vs DNG above that looks to me like the difference that I see between the "Embedded" Camera profile and the "Adobe Standard" profile. The blues are much more vibrant and the luminosity of the orange is lower. You may want to check when you are using LR that you are using the "right" camera profile. As a side note, I used my ColorChecker Passport and generated a custom profile for the T and it matched the "Embedded" profile very very closely. Barely distinguishable. The M was a bit further off, the Olympus E-M1 was way out with "Camera Natural" being the closest, the TG-4 wouldn't even profile until I shot with an EV-1. (It said that one of the channels was clipping.) So of the 4 digital cameras I have, the T had the most accurate default color profile. And "Adobe Standard" was way off for all of them. Edited October 28, 2015 by bencoyote Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 28, 2015 Share #20 Posted October 28, 2015 (edited) So are we saying that it is unnecessary to Enable Profile Corrections for the T and T lenses? I find this confusing, as someone else says click on Make, Leica shows the M etc but not the T. Separately the EXIF shows correctly the T and the lenses I have. I should also say I am only a few days into using Lightroom, after being with Aperture since it came out, so I may be missing things here. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited October 28, 2015 by Guest Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/235615-lightroom-support-for-t-lenses/?do=findComment&comment=2915717'>More sharing options...
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