CE junk 'printed' on T?

[andybarton]

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This is another diversion. Of course any of these are possible with any product, and if there is no 45-minute video showing extensive labor implying that labor is performed in the place written on the camera, no problem.

 

Where in the video does it say that the polishing is done in Germany? (I have to say that I have better things to do than watch a 45 minute video of someone polishing some aluminium, so I confess that I haven't watched it.)

 

You seem to have been disappointed by an assumption that you have made. If it upsets you so much, sell the camera and buy something else

Edited September 3, 2014 by andybarton

[Guest badbob]

I find it surprising to buy something for the location of the factory. Surely one buys products for what they are?

You'll probably find that most Cuckoo Clocks are made from parts sourced from everywhere over the world. At least your aluminium block is produced in an old-established factory owned by Leica and not in a sweatshop in some forsaken part of the world.

It is hardly Leica's fault that you fantasised that the body was made in Germany. The were quite open about the location of their factories for decades.

 

Again, none of those clocks was heavily promoted as made where printed on clock, with a lavish video.

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[Guest badbob]

Where in the video does it say that the polishing is done in Germany? (I have to say that I have better things to do than watch a 45 minute video of someone polishing some aluminium, so I confess that I haven't watched it.)

 

You seem to have been disappointed by an assumption that you have made. If it upsets you so much, sell the camera and buy something else

 

As I said, I'm very customer-centric, and you're obviously not, and you keep changing the subject. I'm not disappointed in my T - I'm disappointed by an obvious deception.

[andybarton]

A third diversion. Were these heavily promoted as made elsewhere?

 

These are not diversions. These are further examples of how the world works these days.

 

In accordance with all the laws of the EU, as has been pointed out to you previously, the Leica T camera is "Made in Germany". There is no deception here. Some components are made elsewhere in Europe (including in Leica's own factory in Portugal) and, shock horror, Japan, but enough is done to the camera, in Germany, to make it a German product, entitled to be engraved "Made in Germany"

 

Where do you think that the T lenses are made? What does the engraving say?

 

Being a customer of Arcam from 25 years ago, and since, I would have been delighted had the box said "Made in England". It didn't. I have lost precisely no sleep over it.

[Guest badbob]

These are not diversions. These are further examples of how the world works these days.

 

In accordance with all the laws of the EU, as has been pointed out to you previously, the Leica T camera is "Made in Germany". There is no deception here. Some components are made elsewhere in Europe (including in Leica's own factory in Portugal) and, shock horror, Japan, but enough is done to the camera, in Germany, to make it a German product, entitled to be engraved "Made in Germany"

 

Where do you think that the T lenses are made? What does the engraving say?

 

Being a customer of Arcam from 25 years ago, and since, I would have been delighted had the box said "Made in England". It didn't. I have lost precisely no sleep over it.

 

OK - how's this, from Leica (example by me):

"Dear Leica customer, please watch our lengthy, way over-the-top video showing extensive and expensive hand-work creating the Leica T body, and note that this body is made in Germany".

 

Oops!

[andybarton]

Or...

 

"Dear Leica customer, please watch our lengthy, way over-the-top video showing extensive and expensive hand-work creating the Leica T body, and note that this body is made in Germany partly from components made or finished elsewhere".

 

I really, seriously cannot see any problem with making a camera in Germany from components and assemblies made elsewhere, in accordance with the laws that govern this kind of thing, such that a "Made in Germany" engraving can be put onto the bottom of it.

 

Where are the lenses made? I bet it doesn't say "Made in Germany" because, according to dpReview, they are made in Japan.

Edited September 3, 2014 by andybarton

[erl]

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I worked in electronics retail in Los Angeles/Beverly Hills for 7 years, and I can tell you without any doubt that they do care, and care a lot. You're not the prototype Leica T customer, who has a small budget like me, and doesn't already have all that "other stuff".

I don't care if they care, or not. The point is, if they do, they must exercise due diligence before making earth shattering decisions.

 

As for my budget, I would bet one of my Leica's it is smaller than yours. The question is really how one apportions the disposable part of one's pension, at least in my case.

[erl]

I had the M4-2 and M6, and am quite familiar with Portugal as well as Canadian lenses. But neither of those was accompanied by a 45 minute labor-intensive video.

Be careful watching those videos, or you will go blind!

[mjh]

I had the M4-2 and M6, and am quite familiar with Portugal as well as Canadian lenses. But neither of those was accompanied by a 45 minute labor-intensive video.

Oh my, what has this video done to you? (Probably it is a good thing I never watched it.)

[andybarton]

I had the M4-2 and M6, and am quite familiar with Portugal as well as Canadian lenses. But neither of those was accompanied by a 45 minute labor-intensive video.

 

Bearing in mind the M6 dates from 1984, well before anyone thought that making a 45 minute promo video was a good idea (not sure that it is even today, but...) that's hardly surprising.

 

I bet that the German-ness of the M4-2 was part of the promotion of the camera back in the 70s, though, even if it was made 4,000 miles away

[jaapv]

OK - how's this, from Leica (example by me):

"Dear Leica customer, please watch our lengthy, way over-the-top video showing extensive and expensive hand-work creating the Leica T body, and note that this body is made in Germany".

 

Oops!

 

Have you as ascertained that the video is made in Germany? Otherwise it is useless Portuguese rubbish...

You missed the worst part though. The Aluminium block is possibly cast in Angola....

Edited September 3, 2014 by jaapv

[Manoleica]

Have you as ascertained that the video is made in Germany? Otherwise it is useless Portuguese rubbish...

You missed the worst part though. The Aluminium block is possibly cast in Angola....

 

Methinks to much coffee. Moderator in Moderation...............

[pop]

OK - how's this, from Leica (example by me):

"Dear Leica customer, please watch our lengthy, way over-the-top video showing extensive and expensive hand-work creating the Leica T body, and note that this body is made in Germany".

 

Oops!

 

I think this nicely shows your dilemma. You let your expectations get the better of you. You make up your own ads.

 

In fact, that boring video warns you several times not to watch it as it will most likely bore you to tears. It does not say to watch the lengthy way over-the-top video. Also, I have not found any place within or without the video where they say the body was made in Germany. You made that up, too.

[jaapv]

Methinks to much coffee. Moderator in Moderation...............

Which German brand coffee do you advise?. Mind you, the coffee must be grown in Germany....

 

And please read my signature...

[Manoleica]

Which German brand coffee do you advise?. Mind you, the coffee must be grown in Germany....

 

And please read my signature...

 

sori buddy, ima nouveau rich.. no education, made mi dough selling used pots n pans

 

coffee. I suggest:- Duke's German Shepherd...

[Lee Martin]

We had the same troll issue with the G star D Lux that apparently was not a rebadged Panasonic? If it was ever going to be a concern as to what was made and where having seen the sticker, then you could have asked the staff in the store as of course they would have given you the absolute factual truth as to what was made where and by whom.

 

I'm afraid that I haven't committed all previous comments to memory Bob and I'm happy to be corrected but I thought you had been a Leica customer long term and had a large amount of older bodies and assorted lenses.

Edited September 3, 2014 by Lee Martin

[Guest badbob]

We had the same troll issue with the G star D Lux that apparently was not a rebadged Panasonic? If it was ever going to be a concern as to what was made and where having seen the sticker, then you could have asked the staff in the store as of course they would have given you the absolute factual truth as to what was made where and by whom.

 

I'm afraid that I haven't committed all previous comments to memory Bob and I'm happy to be corrected but I thought you had been a Leica customer long term and had a large amount of older bodies and assorted lenses.

 

Argumentum ad Nauseam works well here - just bury the pesky customer with all of these non-sequiturs, yes?

 

I speak in this case for customers who are basically being lied to. Yes, I have the T and other Leicas, but I for one don't take that as an opportunity to abuse other customers.

 

This is a customer issue, so address the *customer* please and stop with the abuse.

 

Simple scenario for those who don't get it: First time Leica customer, or customer who has had a Panasonic-Leica only. This customer sees that an interchangeable-lens Leica, made in Germany, is now available and is perfect for him and his budget of under $4000.

 

This customer watches the entire 45-minute video (I did) and sees the extensive (and expensive) hand work performed on the very basic Leica T body, a body "made in Germany".

 

When the customer is finished watching the fundamental work performed on the "made in Germany" body, he rightly assumes that that work is performed in Germany.

 

But people who have a mind to be deceptive turn on the customer, contrary to all customer-centric practice that I'm aware of, and accuse the customer of being wrong, or worse.

[Guest badbob]

I think this nicely shows your dilemma. You let your expectations get the better of you. You make up your own ads.

 

In fact, that boring video warns you several times not to watch it as it will most likely bore you to tears. It does not say to watch the lengthy way over-the-top video. Also, I have not found any place within or without the video where they say the body was made in Germany. You made that up, too.

 

The video was made to watch, warnings or no. If you believe that Leica made the video as a joke or a scam, and does not really do that work, maybe you should consult a lawyer.

[Guest badbob]

Oh my, what has this video done to you? (Probably it is a good thing I never watched it.)

 

As far as I know it's an official Leica video. Are you suggesting that Leica is lying to its customers?

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[andybarton]

Argumentum ad Nauseam works well here

 

That's the funniest thing you've written today

 

 

When the customer is finished watching the fundamental work performed on the "made in Germany" body, he rightly assumes that that work is performed in Germany.

 

 

Leica rightly say that the CAMERA is made in Germany. Show us anywhere where they claim that the aluminium body shell is made in Germany.

 

Given that the lens is the most important part of a camera, and that's made in Japan, where someone spends the best part of an hour polishing really isn't the issue. Further, I wonder whether the polishing part is the fundamental part of the body.

 

As far as I know it's an official Leica video. Are you suggesting that Leica is lying to its customers?

 

Michael isn't, but you are.

 

Bob. Why not start a class action suit against Leica for their "obvious deception" if you and your other duped friends feel so strongly?