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Johannes Knightworth

Interesting M8 Review ....

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Hi Johannes, this is already being discussed here http://www.leica-camera-user.com/leica-m8-forum/22950-interesting-blog-posting-leica-m8-pro.html in the M8 forum.

 

I am no die hard Leica chap - the M8 is the first one I have owned and it sometimes drives me nutty - but this review is such utter piffle, so utterly missing what it is that the M8 actually does in terms of end-result, that the 'reviewer' should just take it down and go away in shame. What total, complete, tripe!

 

Tim

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Now now Tim, say what you feel, don't hold it back ;-)

 

I tend to agree, what did he take, 90 shots?

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utter piffle

Tim--

What a perfectly apropos description!

 

Hey, c'mon! You mean the first thing you check on a camera ISN'T the angle from which you can clearly see the LCD? You can't be discreet if you can't chimp unnoticed.

 

Utterly piffluous indeed!

 

--HC

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In his first half review he talked about the lenses he used, but they were not Leica lenses, right, weren't they other brands?

 

Mike

http://www.mikeadams.org

 

I'm sorry to say Mike that I never made it to the first half - the 'teaser' for it he presented in part two was, shall we say, less than enticing...

 

I had a metaphor in mind but it was crude!

 

Tim

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Tim--

What a perfectly apropos description!

 

Hey, c'mon! You mean the first thing you check on a camera ISN'T the angle from which you can clearly see the LCD? You can't be discreet if you can't chimp unnoticed.

 

Utterly piffluous indeed!

 

--HC

 

ROFL!

 

And I thought that they had recently shown chimpanzees to be highly intelligent...

 

:-)

 

t

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The podiastris window shot says it all to my mind. Secondly I am getting tired of all the crap about Leica snobbery. I drive a Subaru Impreza if I were looking for status symbols I would drive something with a lot more cache... as Tim says "piffle". I found the M8 is a digital rangefinder camera not a status symbol that I totally enjoy using. If wanted a status symbol camera hell I would not have sold my 5D.

 

The M8 is what it is. It produces excellent digital files - and it took ME far more than 90 frames to understand it. Mike Johnson is a writer and a good a one at that. His blog is often interesting and some cases unrelated to photography and worth reading - good for him. But seriously - this so called review is a bit of joke.

 

Best to all. Terry.

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Before reading the review be sure to put on your steel capped boots; regrettably the reviewer drops many names and one's likely to hit your feet.

 

It's amazingly easy to write a damning review when you're predisposed not to like a product. Achieving balance is a little more difficult.

 

This is just a poor review.

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Sigh. It's just so silly. I mean, the guy shoots less than a gig of pictures. Then says his XTI is as good.

 

Less than piffle, really. If I could get the same results out of my 5d / 1ds2, don'tcha think I would?

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This review has the feel of a guy who writes articles for airline magazines. The depth of technical knowledge seems pretty abysmal. One gets the impression he was determined to knock the M8, no matter how good it was. Testing it with a 20 year old Rokkor lens says it all. I have had Leicas since the late 1950's and I certainly see no difference in the build quality of the M8. Yes we all know that the colour balance is work in progress but that was inevitable once Leica had decided not to put IR or anti-aliasing filters in front of the sensor. I think with the profiles we are now getting for C1, most of the forum is getting pretty comfortable with the colour balance we can achieve. I wonder if he gets his Canons free?

 

Wilson

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Grumbling here in the back of the choir? Cmon, let's get over it. Even Johnston is sounding apologetic in his answers to the comments which flood in, congratulating him on his brave stand.

 

scott

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A brief recap, lest I cause any more gall bladder* attacks than I apparently already have:

 

• It was just a brief user report. I said that. I didn't use the camera for very long. I said that too.

• It was just my opinion. I said that several times.

• I mentioned again and again that there are perfectly logical reasons for using M8s, and I can understand why people would want to use them. I actually meant that. The fact that I'm not personally covetous of them myself was not meant as a crossbow bolt straight to your heart, and it will not kill you.

• There were two parts to my user report. One was "pro" (arguments for) and one was "con" (arguments against). When you fail to read the "pro" part and then skip past the positive comments in the "con" part, then that is going to skew your overall impression toward the negative. That is not my fault; that is your fault.

• Similarly, if you don't read the posts yourself, but get all your information about what I said via rumor, then you are also to blame for misimpressions.

• Last I heard, nobody made me the god of cameras and decreed that my opinion should get carved on stone tablets and obliterate all past and future judgments. In other words, relax.

• No, the example pictures were not Great Art. In fact, most of them kinda sucked. (It rained the whole damn week.)

 

But I have a question for you guys. If you're so secure about the choice you made, then why are you so terribly threatened by a couple of blog posts?

 

Mike J.

 

*bile, geddit?

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A $25 digital Timex will almost certainly keep better time than a Tourbillon Breuget - which would you rather have?

 

It is hardly surprising that people get hot under the collar when someone calls into question their judgement about a very expensive purchase and says they would have done better buying something a tenth the price.

 

Yes the little Canons are good - I use an Ixus 850IS myself as my back-up camera but I don't get 1/10th satisfaction using it that I get from either my M8 or my 1953 IIF.

 

Wilson

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A brief recap, lest I cause any more gall bladder* attacks than I apparently already have:

 

• It was just a brief user report. I said that. I didn't use the camera for very long. I said that too.

• It was just my opinion. I said that several times.

• I mentioned again and again that there are perfectly logical reasons for using M8s, and I can understand why people would want to use them. I actually meant that. The fact that I'm not personally covetous of them myself was not meant as a crossbow bolt straight to your heart, and it will not kill you.

• There were two parts to my user report. One was "pro" (arguments for) and one was "con" (arguments against). When you fail to read the "pro" part and then skip past the positive comments in the "con" part, then that is going to skew your overall impression toward the negative. That is not my fault; that is your fault.

• Similarly, if you don't read the posts yourself, but get all your information about what I said via rumor, then you are also to blame for misimpressions.

• Last I heard, nobody made me the god of cameras and decreed that my opinion should get carved on stone tablets and obliterate all past and future judgments. In other words, relax.

• No, the example pictures were not Great Art. In fact, most of them kinda sucked. (It rained the whole damn week.)

 

But I have a question for you guys. If you're so secure about the choice you made, then why are you so terribly threatened by a couple of blog posts?

 

Mike J.

 

*bile, geddit?

 

 

Brave of you to pop up here and the gesture is appreciated. To take your last question first: I'm not aware that any of us went for your throat on your blog. We were grumbling amongst ourselves. I personally don't bother contacting people who don't 'get it' outside of this and one other forum because the M8 gives me an advantage over other photographers that I may not like to share too widely ;-)

 

Now to the rest: the problem is, if you have a website called theonlinephotographer and you publish a review on it, especially in two parts, it implies that you want the material contained thereon to be more than 'just your opinion.' It implies that your opinion is in some way well-informed enough to be called a review and published widely.

 

That places certain requirements on you, should you wish to build and retain credibility. One is to test the equipment effectively (i.e. in some way rigourously and using lenses that are recommended for use with it) and the other is to write up your findings accurately and interestingly and in a manner which provides the reader with a useful take on the object under review.

 

Instead we get (and I quote) the following kinds of piffle:

 

Simply Daft Piffle : "the entry-level Canon I compared it to is better, never mind the more expensive models."

 

Aunt Sally Piffle: "The M8 is a luxury product, and consequently there's quite a premium to pay for it. Presumably, buyers like that about it."

 

Inaccurate Piffle: "it's a decent but not great digital camera, bettered by average DSLRs in both operability and, to a lesser extent, image quality. "

 

Ill-informed Piffle : "my experience so far is that digital de-emphasizes the importance of optics to the final result."

 

Self-Aggrandising Piffle Intended to Establish Credentials for Writing Review: "Nick's a studio pro, but since he was on his own time he happened to be wearing a sparkling mint M6 around his neck. We were outside the Leica booth, where Ralph Gibson was signing books. Nick hadn't heard about pre-focusing, so I was telling him about it."

 

Missed Opportunity to Make At Least One Valid Criticism Piffle: "the default white balance (is) good."

 

There are a LOT of VERY good photographers on this forum and a large number of them have given up on their pro-level digiSLRs as a direct result of their exposure to the M8. Many others, like me, have never owned a Leica before and have no interest in its exclusivity value. We use it because, warts and all, it produces amazing results, results better than our CaNikons, for those of us who have bothered to learn how to use it.

 

You don't seem like a bad guy at all, really, but you write in a manner which uses a headline self-deprecatory tone as a way of selling the tacit proposition that you're qualified to make the judgements you attempt. You are clearly not and you might mislead people in the process. Why bother?

 

Tim

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Thanks Tim - that brought a smile to my face.

 

Wilson

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Guest stnami

Now tashley out of the trenches and don't get yout knickers over this, Terry can see the humour here and ain't ruffled. Best thing is pull out your sword and shoot the "bugger", but your aim must be true.

Basically he didn't like the camera you hated his blog boomm boom swish swish:cool:

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Now tashley out of the trenches and don't get yout knickers over this, Terry can see the humour here and ain't ruffled. Best thing is pull out your sword and shoot the "bugger", but your aim must be true.

Basically he didn't like the camera you hated his blog boomm boom swish swish:cool:

 

 

Boom boom indeed...

 

There's a terrible problem with the British sense of humour, which is that people rarely realise when you're trying to be funny (William did).

 

Or maybe it's just me...

 

;-)

 

Tim

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