ivohula Posted May 22, 2014 Share #1 Â Posted May 22, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) What has been changed in this lens so it is "Optmized" What do we know about the new Macro Adapter? I was about to buy the older version, but now will wait for information about the new lens and adapter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 22, 2014 Posted May 22, 2014 Hi ivohula, Take a look here Whats New about Macro M 90mm/4 Lens. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
chrism Posted May 22, 2014 Share #2 Â Posted May 22, 2014 I think that the new aspect is that you can still focus to infinity with the adaptor in place; you don't have to dismount the lens and turn it over. Without the adaptor it does the usual focussing range, but no macro. The adaptor also doesn't have goggles, presumably relying on live view in the M240 to show what you will get in the macro range. Â I don't use the M240, so I'll be sticking with the older version. Â Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedaes Posted May 22, 2014 Share #3 Â Posted May 22, 2014 What has been changed in this lens so it is "Optmized" What do we know about the new Macro Adapter? I was about to buy the older version, but now will wait for information about the new lens and adapter. Â Interesting question and we may need to wait for Reid et al to test. The "optimisation" may be for digital sensor M's.. as the previous version pre-dated the digital cameras and no update was ever claimed as far as I know. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted May 22, 2014 Share #4 Â Posted May 22, 2014 My guess is that the lens + new adaptor is "optimized" (with adaptor) to cover the dual ranges. Previous to the adaptor the lens was only "optimized" for distance not macro unless you purchased it with the goggles. I think we are getting into more Leica marketing speak. Â As an aside, I was using my 90/4 this past weekend and using the goggles taking pictures of a honey bee nest. I was using the LCD screen and live view because, I had a flash in the shoe. I found it impossible to get good focus using the rear screen. I removed the flash and used the EVF and found it just as difficult to get good focus or to determine the DOF using focus peeking. Trying to judge focus just using the EVF as a ground glass-type screen didn't work well either. Â Eventually, I just reverted to the RF which was far superior to any of the above and just used the LCD screen for framing. Then, the problem became trying to take pictures the moment the bees flew from the hole in the hive. The shutter delay from the live view wasn't fast enough to react and I was blacked-out for the next shot. Â Eventually, I turned the screen off and just went back to good old RF shooting with the goggles. I really thought I would get the adaptor and utilize the LV of the M240, but I found LV focusing was not as good as I imagined. Â Hold on to your goggles. I believe there is still a place for the goggles and I found them to be superior to just an adaptor which has no RF focus option. After all, the goggles were the intended design of this sub-optimum approach to macrophotography. Â Realistically, a DSLR system is still more advantageous. I still think the 90/4 Macro Elmar's strength is as the best compact daylight travel and portrait lens. And, for me, I'm just really not much of a Birds & Bugs photographer, so that is just fine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul J Posted May 22, 2014 Share #5 Â Posted May 22, 2014 In Wetzlarian, there is no literal translation for "Optimisation" but closet is something like "Geben Sie uns Ihr Geld" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulsydaus Posted May 22, 2014 Share #6 Â Posted May 22, 2014 The tech specs are up now for the new lens (german language version only). The lens is all but identical to the current lens. The only modification of note appears to be a slightly larger aperture dial, presumably solving an ergonomics problem with the current lens when the hood is mounted. The other differences are so minor it's not worth mentioning (such as 10 grams weight difference). The optical design and MTF performance is identical. Hopefully they sell the new adapter separately... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxnoy Posted May 22, 2014 Share #7 Â Posted May 22, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) The tech specs are up now for the new lens (german language version only).The lens is all but identical to the current lens. The only modification of note appears to be a slightly larger aperture dial, presumably solving an ergonomics problem with the current lens when the hood is mounted. The other differences are so minor it's not worth mentioning (such as 10 grams weight difference). The optical design and MTF performance is identical. Hopefully they sell the new adapter separately... Â I hope you are right! The existing 90 is a wonderful lens. I sure hope that we'll be able to buy the adapter separately. Â The next amazing thing would be if the adapter would maintain rf coupling when the lens was in the collapsed position. That would be amazing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erudolph Posted May 23, 2014 Share #8 Â Posted May 23, 2014 ...Hopefully they sell the new adapter separately... Â They will. I've ordered the adapter this morning. It seems like a pretty nifty idea. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxnoy Posted May 23, 2014 Share #9 Â Posted May 23, 2014 They will. I've ordered the adapter this morning. It seems like a pretty nifty idea. Â Did they quote you a price? Â There is a bit more info at Tamarkin Camera here. States that its optically identical. Considering that that adapter is also meant to be used with other lenses, I am not holding out much hope for RF coupling when the 90 is collapsed. Guessing evf-only. Â I can see why they made 'ergonomic changes'. When the current 90 collapsed, the aperture ring is covered and can't be turned and is also thinner than the back part of the lens. Just a pain if you were to use it collapsed. Also, the barrel turns freely unless it's locked in full uncollapsed extension (to enable you to flip the aperture dial to the macro side) so you have to grip the front of the lens to turn the aperture ring. Â Looks like the aperture ring on the new one is always exposed and I bet that the barrel doesn't turn anymore. Makes sense. But also looks like the way they made the aperture ring always exposed is by just making it wider, keeping the lens from collapsing as much as the previous one by a couple millimeters -- see here. If that's really the case, the infinity focus at collapsed may not work as seamlessly with the older lens because their 'collapsed' state is a different distance from the sensor :-(. Â Tamarkin is quoting $3650 for the new kit. I'll probably stick with the existing one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantice Posted May 23, 2014 Share #10 Â Posted May 23, 2014 The news is quite exciting~ Upgrade can either have impacts of (1) making older version more valuable, or (2) continue on as the standard, like 50mm iteration. Leica is one of the rare company that produces (1) quite likely. Â Personally I welcome new changes if it makes image taking experience more convenient and enjoyable, even if it means I need to dump the 1 yro 90/4 I just got last year. Â However I will strongly agree on waiting and to see if the new version lives up the hype, (like the IQ of greater extension to 1:2) or if they introduce more problems. Â I do hope the new design can better seal the internal elements from dust; it is one of my dirtiest lens consider how strong the sucking power of focusing/de-collapsing and unlike front and rear, it cannot be cleaned overtime without taking it apart. I also wish the new adapter system will not alter the simplicity of the original by trading inconvenience for more complexity, and become more confusing in the field... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted May 23, 2014 Share #11 Â Posted May 23, 2014 Tamarkin is quoting $3650 for the new kit. Â I wonder if that's just for the lens, excluding adapter, as the current kit sells for $4150. Very un-Leica-like, but the price appears to include everything based on the description. Â Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantice Posted May 23, 2014 Share #12  Posted May 23, 2014 I wonder if that's just for the lens, excluding adapter, as the current kit sells for $4150. Very un-Leica-like, but the price appears to include everything based on the description. Jeff  I would guess this is normal, as newer adapter is merely an variable extension tube without the high precision glass and the rangefinder coupling of the goggle.  This lens is one of my personal most practical lens so I'm really curious about the changes; the more I look, the more I'm curious about how it work:  New with tube: A non-couple system from infinity to 1:6 like the old one when retracted, with macro of 1:6~1:3 with no distance scale went extended (+ need to re-position focus scale), and with macro of 1:3~1:2 when rotating the vario-tube.  Old with Goggle: Unmount-mount; once done it is a limited 1:6~1:3 macro lens with RF couple and correct distance scale.  The new benefit IMO is functionality - a non-RF system that can retract for normal use, and extend for macro use, plus extra extensions. It will be nice if the bare lens itself has some optical optimizations like coatings, etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick_S Posted May 23, 2014 Share #13 Â Posted May 23, 2014 The question for me is whether the new version will correctly mount-upside down with the existing close-focus goggle attachment -- does it have a second distance scale on the underside? Otherwise, users of M cameras without live view will be better off with the previous version. Â Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxnoy Posted May 23, 2014 Share #14 Â Posted May 23, 2014 4150 included the macro adapter and the angle finder. Maybe the angle finder is what makes the difference in price. Â Anyone get quotes on just the new adapter? Â I am betting that the lens is identical to the previous one mod the aperture ring wider than main body, anti-rotate when collapsed, and no distance scale on the other side. Evf is their story for macro now. Â No changes to optics or mechanics otherwise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantice Posted May 23, 2014 Share #15  Posted May 23, 2014 The question for me is whether the new version will correctly mount-upside down with the existing close-focus goggle attachment -- does it have a second distance scale on the underside? Otherwise, users of M cameras without live view will be better off with the previous version.  Nick  Without trying the item and look at just the photos, the answer seems to be Yes and No. It looks like it will fix without any intrusions, but look at the photos of our blog HERE, there's no engraving at the right of front angle image, and the engraving stops at 0.8m at the back image.  So my guess is that there's no distance scale at the back because there's no distance engraving on the focusing barrel. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted May 23, 2014 Share #16 Â Posted May 23, 2014 If it's optically identical I think I'll stick with my current version. Â I use macro so rarely that it is a non-issue. With respect to the redesigned aperture ring I now use my lens with the 2.8/50 hood as it's so much more compact and I have never had a flare issue with this lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted May 23, 2014 Share #17 Â Posted May 23, 2014 Hi There The Macro adapter is helicoid, which is great for variable work - of course it must be used with live view - even when focusing to infinity with the lens collapsed. Still, that's probably a good thing with a 90 anyway. Â It's also really good using the macro adapter with other M lenses (especially wide angle lenses where you can focus really close). Like a variable length OUFRO in fact. Â So - to summarise 1. macro adapter attached: ... with the lens collapsed it has the normal focus range to infinity - but you need live view ... with the lens extended you can focus down to 1:2 2. without the macro adapter ... it's just like the current 90 (same formula) 3. macro adapter on other lenses ... works really well with live view allowing you to focus all lenses closer. Â It's a great combination, and a great lens (long acknowledged as such). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
microview Posted May 23, 2014 Share #18  Posted May 23, 2014 Leica Mayfair (London) quotes prices as lens £2250, adapter £550 (Vat inclusive). Available separately it would seem. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
microview Posted May 23, 2014 Share #19  Posted May 23, 2014 If it's optically identical I think I'll stick with my current version.  Rick Leica's experience quoted above suggests rangefinder focusing is preferable to using EVF – assuming the new lens itself is not optically far superior…… However, good to be able to buy the new 90 f4 collapsible on its own for those who don't have one. See also Tim Ashley's observations on the current version. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted May 23, 2014 Share #20 Â Posted May 23, 2014 Important to know that this new adapter can be used with any M lens. There are no 'eyes'. Of course you need Liveview. Maximum magnification here was quoted as 1:2 with the new 90. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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