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jmteno76

Pogue Review of the Leica T

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:confused:That was certainly not what I was expecting, I was expecting it to work within its own closed network.

Anyway, let's look at the bright side, at least this system avoids the constant irritation of having to choose between the connections Phone-camera and your main network Hmmm...

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Jaap was expecting that the app doesn't require any (WiFi) connection. That's wrong. All these apps require some sort of underlying connection channel (WiFi, Bluetooth, NFC, ...) to be established first, before the app can talk to your camera.

These days this is often implemented in a completely transparent manner so you don’t necessarily notice you are using WiFi at all. Like when you use AirDrop for wirelessly exchanging files between any two Macs, without joining an existing WiFi network or even manually establishing a WiFi connection first. Underneath this functionality relies on WiFi, of course.

 

Ideally, connecting a camera to a smartphone or computer should be just as simple and transparent.

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See my post from 12-05:

 

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-t/331492-t-app-question.html#post2691819

 

Wifi it is, wifi it was....

 

On my car the app has a simple WiFi connection with the car and works flawlessly in a little network. I cannot imagine Leica going for a different setup.

The only drawback is that an iPhone cannot prioritize networks according to the app chosen, so one will have to switch between the wifi connection with the camera and one's other (home) network for other applications manually.

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Jaap was expecting that the app doesn't require any (WiFi) connection. That's wrong. All these apps require some sort of underlying connection channel (WiFi, Bluetooth, NFC, ...) to be established first, before the app can talk to your camera.

 

If your Canon camera internally provides the WiFi access point functionality, like some other WiFi-enabled cameras do, you can connect to that anywhere. No need for other access points in that case. The camera itself acts as the access point and the iPhone connects to that network created by the camera, as it would connect to other access points.

 

However, the Leica T does not have that feature, and requires some external access point that it (the camera) and the iPhone both can connect to. We have to see if the workaround with the iPhone itself acting as an access point (in personal hotspot mode) enables communication between the app and the local WiFi network created by the iPhone in that mode.

 

That's really just very disappointing.

I suppose I should have investigated further before purchasing as that is a feature I really want. It's not going to make me cancel my order. I guess I will just hope this is a feature that can be added later via a firmware update and just wait? Or just live without it... But I will say, even though I've used cameras before having this feature, after having that functionality in my current one it will be hard to be without it. It really is very useful!

 

And like somebody said above, I'm not about to give up my unlimited iPhone data plan just to be able to tether to get the app to work in the wild.

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All this sounds to me as if Leica has been trying to go cheap on this one. Either they could not or would not buy the necessary hardware on the open market. Or they couldn't obtain or didn't want to pay for the rights to implement the necessarry software, or their software developers couldn't make it work in a manner that most have come to expect (easy WiFi connection, NFC*) in 2014.

 

I would find the lack of a modern interface especially disappointing/deceiving for a camera that tries to look on the outside like an ultra modern smart phone/touch-device.

 

But who knows, maybe the functionality will come in a future firmware update.

 

* I know that iOS doesn't have NFC yet, but that's not the point.

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All this sounds to me as if Leica has been trying to go cheap on this one.

It doesn’t get cheaper if you don’t implement ad hoc mode. Of course it takes some development time but Leica needs to pay their in-house developers anyway.

 

I know that iOS doesn't have NFC yet, but that's not the point.

Indeed iOS support is not the point as iPhones and iPads are missing the required hardware for NFC. Apple doesn’t want to support NFC so they don’t.

Edited by mjh

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That's really just very disappointing. I suppose I should have investigated further before purchasing as that is a feature I really want. It's not going to make me cancel my order. I guess I will just hope this is a feature that can be added later via a firmware update and just wait? Or just live without it... But I will say, even though I've used cameras before having this feature, after having that functionality in my current one it will be hard to be without it. It really is very useful!

 

And like somebody said above, I'm not about to give up my unlimited iPhone data plan just to be able to tether to get the app to work in the wild.

Well, as long as MJH tells us there might be a workaround in the setting up of an iPhone hotspot, I suppose it is more or less OK. But elegant it is not.

Why should you have to change your data plan? Wifi Hotspot is just a setting in the iPhone menu.

 

There are also Mobile MiFi personal hotspot devices on the market now - I just happened to buy one today to get around the lack of cell coverage in my house.

 

Have a look at the Vodaphone R206.

Edited by jaapv

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Why should you have to change your data plan?

I gather his data plan explicitly rules out tethering. Carriers can be funny that way.

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I'll throw this into the pot of weak evidence supporting wild speculation......

I created a wifi hotspot on my android phone, and connected my iPad to it. By digging into the entrails of my phone, I could see that it recognised my iPad as a device on its network.

I don't have the 3G iPad, and so it seems iOS will not allow me create a wifi hotspot on my iPad.

However, if I did have the 3G iPad, or if I had an iPhone, my experiment implies that my device would be able to "see" the Leica T on its local network and, if so, the T app on my device ought to work as it should. I.e. you could set up a link in the wild away from any fixed network.

 

All this is, of course, just fun to talk about until the penny drops heads or tails on 24th!

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I gather his data plan explicitly rules out tethering. Carriers can be funny that way.

 

For the most part correct. In the US, AT&T has tethering but you must change your data plan to get that functionality. For early iPhone adopters we are grandfathered into unlimited data as long as we don't change plans. So, some of us have not added tethering to our phones (I also think it also costs $20/month).

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I gather his data plan explicitly rules out tethering. Carriers can be funny that way.

 

Correct. AT&T in the US means no tethering without giving up your unlimited data plan. They'll have to pry that one out of my cold dead hands!

There are ways around it with jailbreaking etc but that is not something I am interested in.

 

It does bring up the question though of the exact usefulness of this app. So I can remotely control my camera at home. Or if I'm in a spot where I can use their wifi. But that's it? Otherwise no remote triggering of the camera? Again, that's just disappointing... I guess it will be time to get creative and come up with workaround solution.

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Correct. AT&T in the US means no tethering without giving up your unlimited data plan. They'll have to pry that one out of my cold dead hands! There are ways around it with jailbreaking etc but that is not something I am interested in.

 

It does bring up the question though of the exact usefulness of this app. So I can remotely control my camera at home. Or if I'm in a spot where I can use their wifi. But that's it? Otherwise no remote triggering of the camera? Again, that's just disappointing... I guess it will be time to get creative and come up with workaround solution.

 

Yeah the more I think about this the dumber it is. If you need to use the personal hotspot functionality it seems like overkill. The functionality is meant for (personal hotspot) to share a cellular signal and in this use case we really don't need the cellular data we only need the wifi portion of the functionality.

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What about folks who just need an old fashioned cable release....the app is supposed to be a remote for shutter release.

 

I guess they can use timer. Not a substitute for remote shutter but at least takes care of one use case of cable release (reduce camera shake for long exposure).

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Alright, it seems T could have implemented it differently (like some other cameras)

 

BUT

 

If most users (Android and iPhone) are able to setup personal hotspots then why this (lack of wifi infrastructure in T) becomes an issues.

 

Speaking for myself, I am ok since I have iPhone as well.

 

...am I missing something?

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Alright, it seems T could have implemented it differently (like some other cameras)

 

BUT

 

If most users (Android and iPhone) are able to setup personal hotspots then why this (lack of wifi infrastructure in T) becomes an issues.

 

Speaking for myself, I am ok since I have iPhone as well.

 

...am I missing something?

 

You don't seem to have read the thread: plenty of people have data plans that don't allow for personal hotspots.

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I guess they can use timer. Not a substitute for remote shutter but at least takes care of one use case of cable release (reduce camera shake for long exposure).

 

 

Look upstream in the thread.

 

 

 

Sent from my Etcha-sketch.

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You don't seem to have read the thread: plenty of people have data plans that don't allow for personal hotspots.

 

Charging for phones and data varies per country. Let's amend that to "a fair number in the USA "

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I went back and read the thread

... I stand corrected. when I tried to enable personal hotspot from my iPhone (which had unlimited data plan), it asked me to contact my wireless provider. It seems it needs to be enabled by the carrier.

 

So when is T going to be fixed?

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Charging for phones and data varies per country. Let's amend that to "a fair number in the USA "

 

Most plans in the UK do not allow tethering (or "hotspot" capability) by default. I suggest that you don't extrapolate from your personal experience to draw any conclusions about the availability of this option.

 

Even assuming that it'll work – and I don't think the app will work in the way hoped for with the iPhone in hotspot mode (as I speculated in this thread a couple of weeks ago) – it's a pretty ludicrous workaround for gaining a cable release and JPEG downloader.

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Surely amongst us resourceful and connected ladies and gentlemen somebody could get some information about what does and what doesn't work with the wifi connection of the T? I see reviews everywhere but this simple thing can't be explained by somebody?

Or is there some intent behind the cloudyness of information on this point?

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