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M9 Sample DNG (higher ISO)?

nameBrandon

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nameBrandon

nameBrandon

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Hi there, I'm looking into picking up a M9 or M-E (and possibly an M 240, depending on cash flow). Right now I'm trying to determine if higher ISO shots from the M9 will be usable for me, and I haven't found any sample DNG's on the web anywhere at ISO 800+.

 

I've read that shooting at ISO 640 and pushing in post is probably a better method for achieving quality low light images, so if anyone has an underexposed ISO 640 image that I could push that would be helpful as well.

 

Does anyone have a few they could upload/share, or perhaps even point me to some existing samples with working links?

 

Thanks. :)

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tobey bilek

tobey bilek

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I tried it, people I know tried it, and can see no difference . Both in camera and computer are electronic push.

 

The way to make any camera/image look better at higher ISO is making an image at required ISO, any way you wish, make a duplicate layer in PS, apply noise reduction, which will soften the image, then make an edge mask to confine the NR to non edge areas of the photo. Details are retained. Noise is softened. Adjust the mask with black, white, & grey brushes as required.

 

Advanced Sharpening and Noise Reduction in Photoshop

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jaapv

jaapv

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I tried it, people I know tried it, and can see no difference . Both in camera and computer are electronic push.

 

The way to make any camera/image look better at higher ISO is making an image at required ISO, any way you wish, make a duplicate layer in PS, apply noise reduction, which will soften the image, then make an edge mask to confine the NR to non edge areas of the photo. Details are retained. Noise is softened. Adjust the mask with black, white, & grey brushes as required.

 

Advanced Sharpening and Noise Reduction in Photoshop

 

Or use the excellent noise reduction of ACR.

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CaptZoom

CaptZoom

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Another thing that may be of some concern for you regarding the M9/M-E are skin tones. Under some circumstances, the M9 adds odd red hues to skin (lips) that's a pain to deal with. You can do a search here to see examples. For me, it's not a big issue. But it may be one for you. I don't know if the M240 exhibits the same effect.

 

I've had varying degrees of success with restricting capture ISO to 640 and pushing in post.

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nameBrandon

nameBrandon

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Another thing that may be of some concern for you regarding the M9/M-E are skin tones. Under some circumstances, the M9 adds odd red hues to skin (lips) that's a pain to deal with. You can do a search here to see examples. For me, it's not a big issue. But it may be one for you. I don't know if the M240 exhibits the same effect.

 

I've had varying degrees of success with restricting capture ISO to 640 and pushing in post.

 

Thanks, I'll research that. Disappointing to hear, but not a deal breaker. I spent years dealing with Canon's red-channel bias on their 5D line so luckily it's something I'm proficient at fixing in post. Good to know though!!

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CaptZoom

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Thanks, I'll research that. Disappointing to hear, but not a deal breaker. I spent years dealing with Canon's red-channel bias on their 5D line so luckily it's something I'm proficient at fixing in post. Good to know though!!

 

 

I should iterate that the behavior is only occasionally exhibited by the M9 and it's applied in odd patches not uniformly. It's different from what the 5Ds did (I migrated from a 5Dmkii).

 

Good luck with your research and purchase. The M9/M-Es are awesome cameras (though at times a bit quirky). And as far as I can tell, the M240 builds on the M9's strengths. If I were getting into Leica RF today, I would seriously consider the M240 over the M9 (more accurate RF, weather sealing, better high ISO, ability to use the camera even if the RF is out if alignment).

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nameBrandon

nameBrandon

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I should iterate that the behavior is only occasionally exhibited by the M9 and it's applied in odd patches not uniformly. It's different from what the 5Ds did (I migrated from a 5Dmkii).

 

Good luck with your research and purchase. The M9/M-Es are awesome cameras (though at times a bit quirky). And as far as I can tell, the M240 builds on the M9's strengths. If I were getting into Leica RF today, I would seriously consider the M240 over the M9 (more accurate RF, weather sealing, better high ISO, ability to use the camera even if the RF is out if alignment).

 

Thank you! I think in a perfect world, I'd definitely grab the M240, but it all comes down the money in the end. Right now I'm looking at the M9/M-E and a decent 35 or 50 mm lens. If I went the M240 route, I'd have to step down on the lens side, and go with a lesser lens. It's all a balancing act, unfortunately.

 

I still have my Fuji kit (probably sell the x100s, but stil have the X-T1 + lenses), so for higher ISO situations, I'd probably stick with the Fuji. Right now, I'm focusing on the M9/M240 being street, mainly.. maybe some vacation usage, but it wouldn't be the only camera in the arsenal.

 

I am looking forward to seeing some higher ISO dng's though, just to get a feel for exactly what I'd be working with.

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tobey bilek

tobey bilek

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Or use the excellent noise reduction of ACR.

 

Make the dup layer a smart object and you can bring it back to ACR, do NR, then go back to PS.

 

While good, it still softens the image. Just click the eyeball to click the dup layer on/off and you can see it if there is significant reduction.

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nameBrandon

nameBrandon

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Is there a Leica dealer near you? If so, why not take a SD card with you and take some snaps?

 

Definitely! Apparently I have a pretty good one, Tamarkin Camera here in Chicago. I just need to give them a call and discuss what I'm looking for (m9/lenses, etc..) and set up a time to head over there in the coming weeks. There's also Central Camera, but they're not exclusively focused on Leica, so it's a hit or miss as far as inventory.

 

I was just hoping I might be able to find a few DNG's for download on the web, and while I found 2-3, they were all at ISO 160 or so. Just hoping to be a little more informed before making it to the store.

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nameBrandon

nameBrandon

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Email me and I'll send you some files.

 

 

Thank you both very much.. This is incredibly helpful!! :)

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DigitalHeMan

DigitalHeMan

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Fwiw, I normally restrict my shooting to 1000 ISO and am happy with the results. However this past week I was shooting in a low light situation and used 2000 ISO. Whilst the results are grainy in the under exposed areas, they are a nice grain, especially when converted to black and white.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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tomlianza

tomlianza

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Hi,

My own experience with the m9 at high ISO has been universally disappointing. I own a number of the Fuji X cameras and they all perform better in my opinion at higher ISO. I shot some test shots with my x100 and the M9/35mm summicron. I rendered the raw images to 24X36" prints and showed them to a group of photographers. Without a loop, there was confusion about which image was "better", with a loop, the x100 consistently beat out the M9 at ISO's greater than 1000. I will run some more serious tests with xPro1 and the xT1 this summer vs. the M9. I have had some outstanding results with the M9 in sunlight with the tri-elmar (early version, 28-50-35). That is a combination that really works well for me. I was actually able to detect some moire' in some old wood at very high magnification. The M9 is a fine camera, but I think that it is a bit long of tooth with respect to the internal image processing. There is something magical about holding a Leica (I have an M9,M6 and M2), but when it comes to quick image acquisition at higher ISO the Fuji's might be a better bet, particularly with Leica glass.

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nameBrandon

nameBrandon

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Hi,

My own experience with the m9 at high ISO has been universally disappointing. I own a number of the Fuji X cameras and they all perform better in my opinion at higher ISO. I shot some test shots with my x100 and the M9/35mm summicron. I rendered the raw images to 24X36" prints and showed them to a group of photographers. Without a loop, there was confusion about which image was "better", with a loop, the x100 consistently beat out the M9 at ISO's greater than 1000. I will run some more serious tests with xPro1 and the xT1 this summer vs. the M9. I have had some outstanding results with the M9 in sunlight with the tri-elmar (early version, 28-50-35). That is a combination that really works well for me. I was actually able to detect some moire' in some old wood at very high magnification. The M9 is a fine camera, but I think that it is a bit long of tooth with respect to the internal image processing. There is something magical about holding a Leica (I have an M9,M6 and M2), but when it comes to quick image acquisition at higher ISO the Fuji's might be a better bet, particularly with Leica glass.

 

Thanks for sharing that! I've got some 24x36 printed from a Canon 5D Mk I so I'm not a stickler when it comes to 'print purity' and I doubt I'd ever get out a loupe to look at a print that large, but I appreciate someone doing it and sharing the results. :)

 

I have to say, I've been pretty impressed with what I've seen in the few sample DNG's I've been able to look at, up to, and including, ISO 1600.

 

A properly exposed image at those levels comes off pretty solid. Under-exposed images or images with a lot of shadows at 1600+ seem to have some issues, most of which seem survivable with enough time in post (FWIW, I'm using Capture One Pro, and the NR seems to work pretty well). ISO 2000 seems to border on unusable in many instances so i think I may just forget it exists.. :)

 

I think the sensor and the image processor certainly show their age with respect to higher ISO noise, but I'm definitely not buying the camera for low-light/high-iso performance. There are plenty of cameras that are great in that area if that was my main concern, but I really just wanted to get an understanding of what situations the m9 might fail in before spending the ~$3500 or so. :)

 

I think for my uses the m9 will work well, and for those other times, I still have the Fuji X-T1 and some faster glass as a backup. I'll definitely look into adapters for the M-mount glass I plan to pick up, it'd be useful to be able to move between the systems and have a consistent lens lineup.

 

Thanks again for commenting on your print experience!

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Henry Fool

Henry Fool

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Very helpful both this and the M8 versions - I have to compliment your taste in vinyl and literature too.

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