Winedemonium Posted May 7, 2014 Share #1 Posted May 7, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Not officially, but at Hong Kong "street prices", the 0.95/50 Noctilux is discounted about 20% below US retail, while the 2/50 APO Summicron is inflated about 20% over US retail (actually making the APO cash-dearer to buy). I want both. Indulgent I know, but this combination gives quite a lot of versatility and quality at this well-used focal length. I currently use the 1.4/50 Lux, which I don't intend to sell until long after I have the other two and can decide if it is 'redundant' for me (I'm not presuming it is, as all three seem to render differently and have their own strengths). So, the question is, do I enjoy the discount on the Noctilux, or pay the premium on the APO? I have a feeling I will get more use out of the APO. On the other hand, if I am patient, I should be able to get one at the normal, full US-retail price. This is a very very first world problem I know! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 7, 2014 Posted May 7, 2014 Hi Winedemonium, Take a look here 50mm Nocti and APO at same new price. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
k_g_wolf ✝ Posted May 7, 2014 Share #2 Posted May 7, 2014 Get the NOCT - in case you really need it - and wait for the reduction of the SUMMICRON-ASPH. It will come for sure. Selling way above what LEICA calculated for a current product is weird. I would not talk to a dealer any more who would try this on me. Black markets are made by crooks. Bst GEORG Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winedemonium Posted May 7, 2014 Author Share #3 Posted May 7, 2014 Well Hong Kong is probably the very definition of a black market nation state! There are no barriers to market here, and no sales tax. The items coming in by the import agent are sold at prices about 10% higher than in the US through the Leica boutiques. I do buy from them from time to time to support them, as they have given me helpful advice. However, they charge high prices to deal with the extraordinary retail rents they have to pay in places like IFC Mall and Times Square (HK). Meanwhile a lot of Leica traders here buy from European sources, and sell genuinely new products that can be registered with Leica, putting the customer under warranty. If you need to deal with a warranty issue, Leica's official importer will handle it - but charges for the privilege (as I understand it) if you didn't buy from them. Fair enough. I wouldn't call the traders crooks. But Hong Kong is a rather severe example of the free market. Free markets cut both ways (as this 50mm choice bears out). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winedemonium Posted May 7, 2014 Author Share #4 Posted May 7, 2014 ...and thanks for helping clarify this in my own mind. I've just pulled the trigger on the Noctilux. So the long wait now for the APO is probably a good thing! My first lens for the Leica M was the 1.4/35 FLE which I bought second hand in February 2013. Today I could buy a new one in Hong Kong for more than 10% less than I paid second hand. I don't regret that as the lens is terrific and I have gotten a lot of use out of it. But with Leica, patience is definitely a virtue! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomasis7 Posted May 7, 2014 Share #5 Posted May 7, 2014 how much is that for both lenses in $? I'm very happy with Summitar 2.5 and it is probably best lens in overall. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill W Posted May 7, 2014 Share #6 Posted May 7, 2014 Good plan on the Noctilux. I have 4 50's myself. There are folks on the forum that own several Nocitlux plus other 50's. I like the 50 and have multiple bodies so I can justify owning more that one....... Only one Noctilux for me though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winedemonium Posted May 7, 2014 Author Share #7 Posted May 7, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Good plan on the Noctilux. I have 4 50's myself. There are folks on the forum that own several Nocitlux plus other 50's. I like the 50 and have multiple bodies so I can justify owning more that one....... Only one Noctilux for me though. Did you settle on the 1/50 or the 0.95/50? I like both. The character is quite different. I've met collectors here in HK (mad mad collector base here) who talk about the four versions of the 1/50 (excluding of course 1.2/50 and 0.95/50). One Guy I go to for advice feel the colour is quite different between vI and vIV, with the last version showing a look closer to the ASPH. Of course the optical formula is the same. I can see that I may end up with a 1/50. But I don't know. Limited use and big $$$. I can see why people would have both though as they draw differently. how much is that for both lenses in $? I'm very happy with Summitar 2.5 and it is probably best lens in overall. The 0.95 Noctilux is around $8750 and the 2/50 APO is around $8900, both new. In the end I couldn't justify the price hike on the APO, nor ignore the discount offered on the Noctilux. I will wait for the APO to come down to list price level. I like the Summitar. It was the very first Leica lens I bought. It is quite sharp stopped down, in the centre, and the bokeh is that super swirly kind, which can be used to artistic effect with some backgrounds. Ergonomically I found it tricky to focus (position, and my copy had fairly stiff close focus). A cool lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill W Posted May 7, 2014 Share #8 Posted May 7, 2014 My Noctilux is the .95 and I find it is easier to focus than the previous model that I owned for a period and sold it several years ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted May 7, 2014 Share #9 Posted May 7, 2014 The price shift reflects the shift in status perception... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMJ Posted May 7, 2014 Share #10 Posted May 7, 2014 Have a Noctilux 0.95 & Apo Summicron already but been wondering about the 50mm Summilux (I like 50mm). Does anyone have all 3 lenses? The Noctilux & Apo Summicron are so different despite being 50mm I just wondered what the Summilux could bring to the party? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbl Posted May 7, 2014 Share #11 Posted May 7, 2014 I have all three and use all three of them pretty regularly. Out and about, the f/2 unless I think I'll be inside. Summilux or Noct in my house, Noct at night. One thing to me is that when I shot with my Canon stuff you often had to choose between optical quality (L lenses) and size. Sometimes you want less weight, sometimes you don't need f/1/.4. The Leica glass is so good you can have both. Admittedly at the cost of money. I also once went to Hawaii with 3 50mm lenses and Tri-X and had a blast. I forced myself to do black and white in Hawaii which was great creatively. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomasis7 Posted May 7, 2014 Share #12 Posted May 7, 2014 The price shift reflects the shift in status perception... Good to see trend of bokeh weaning off. now the new trend is sharpness! Sharpeh? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sillbeers15 Posted May 8, 2014 Share #13 Posted May 8, 2014 Yes. I did my search and found Hong Kong to be a great place to buy Noctilux lens new. Even the grey imported prices in Singapore are far apart. Not used Noctilux, not any other Leica lens has such a great deal available in Hong Kong.... Partially due to the strong Singapore dollar and weak Hong Kong dollar exchange,... I purchased my set late last year while my family and I took our year end vacation in Hong Kong and had baged a net savings of USD$3200 against the Leica Store prices back home in Singapore! I'm not a 50mm guy, so APO has no attraction on me. For me Noctilux is a great portrait and speciality application lens. 35mm Lux ASPH is used as my all round standard lens while 21mm Lux ASPH is my standard wide lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbl Posted May 8, 2014 Share #14 Posted May 8, 2014 I've bought three lenses from HK dealers via eBay and always been happy. Fwiw. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveclem Posted May 8, 2014 Share #15 Posted May 8, 2014 Good to see trend of bokeh weaning off. now the new trend is sharpness! Sharpeh? If we're still talking Hong Kong perhaps that should be Shar Pei ? Taxi! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winedemonium Posted May 8, 2014 Author Share #16 Posted May 8, 2014 Good to see trend of bokeh weaning off. now the new trend is sharpness! Sharpeh? I'm not sure we can read a trend into this. Just supply and demand. APO is in very low supply compared to demand - it's the newest lens and supply - as is well known - was halted while the flare issue got sorted. I would predict that in two years this lens will be below list in the HK grey market. It was the same 18 months ago with the 35 FLE and now that lens is below list here. Whatever gets announced at Photokina will be next. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbl Posted May 8, 2014 Share #17 Posted May 8, 2014 I'm not sure we can read a trend into this. Just supply and demand. APO is in very low supply compared to demand - it's the newest lens and supply - as is well known - was halted while the flare issue got sorted. I would predict that in two years this lens will be below list in the HK grey market. It was the same 18 months ago with the 35 FLE and now that lens is below list here. Whatever gets announced at Photokina will be next. I tend to agree. Many dealers I've talked to have said they've only gotten one ever or the like. Remember a few years back when the 50 Summilux ASPH was in incredible short supply and was going for 10% over list around the internet? Same deal probably. -jbl Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted May 8, 2014 Share #18 Posted May 8, 2014 You can never have too many 50's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan.y Posted May 9, 2014 Share #19 Posted May 9, 2014 Tangential story: At the Leica store in Times Square last week, I heard the following conversation-ender delivered by a store clerk to a Mainland Chinese shopper (who, presumably, tried to bargain, which would be kind of hilarious): "Well, if the problem for you is price, then I can't help you." I suspect nowdays not many stores in HK can afford such exquisite customer service, especially not to the Mainland Chinese who do much of the shopping here. Right as the shopper left defeated, I entered with my pretender A7R and Voigtlander 35/1.2 II, felt self-conscious and insecure, and consequently (though also due to genuine curiosity) took out my newly purchased Summilux 75/1.4 to compare it to the Apo 75/2 in the display cabinet. My girlfriend asked why they don't have the Lux. Immediately, the same helpful clerk (who was hovering around us and perhaps thought the question was addressed to him) informed us that my lens is "old. We no longer sell it." Edit: Actually, come to think of it, the clerk himself probably suffers from a kind of post-colonial pretender syndrome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbl Posted May 9, 2014 Share #20 Posted May 9, 2014 You can never have too many 50's. This is true. When the 50 APO was introduced, someone on the forum said something to the effect of “yeah, just what Leica needed, another good 50.” True, but, man, what a lens. -jbl Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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