Survey: Would you buy the new Leica T?

[edwardkaraa]

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When the M gets a touchscreen interface you will be left trying to get used to it. I myself will be used to it by the end of this year if not sooner.

 

When the M gets a touchscreen, that would be the last M model Leica will ever make. Mark my words.

[brunom]

Sorry, mate the R system is dead, because it would be so expensive to make that it would be stillborn in terms of sales - Mr. Stefan Daniel's (aka Leica's) own words in a meeting with forum members. They had a group of developers look into it for a couple of years and that was their unequivocal conclusion. Thus they switched to developing the S system.

 

On top of that Leica doesn't even have the tooling, body or lenses, any more, so it would be a completely new system. It didn't make commercial sense in the time that the (D)SLR ruled the market, in a time like this that DSLRs are a dwindling species it would be commercial suicide.

 

Hi

 

I see what you are saying but the point I originally made was that Leica should resurrect or re-engineer the DMR, to be used with existing R8/R9 bodies, and the fact that some years ago development was deemed to be a non starter doesn't mean it would/will always be that way.

 

I remember back in the day, when Leica was about to pull the plug on the M cameras, which probably made some sense then - but I bet it is so glad it didn't

 

If {?] they no longer have the facility to manufacture new R8/R9 bodies then that is a [ not insurmountable ] challenge, but even selling only new DMRs, made in small batches or to order ] would bring in cash, which after all is the name of the game for a small manufacturer ?

 

Bruno

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[rosuna]

I love it for the following reasons:

 

1. Small camera and lenses.

2. Touch screen display.

3. Unibody.

4. Exquisite design of the system and complements.

5. High level image quality.

 

Regarding the point 5, this camera will bring IQ only available in professional equipment a few years ago. The same goes for Fuji o Sony, of course, but my point is the quality surpasses any rational needs for sharing or printing.

 

The body has a reasonable price but the lenses are really expensive in comparative terms.

[rosuna]

When the M gets a touchscreen, that would be the last M model Leica will ever make. Mark my words.

 

I strongly disagree.

 

It will be a wonderful M, very similar to a film M. Reduced to the essence.

[dkCambridgeshire]

I was considering purchase but now I'm not so sure it's the best non-M camera platform for M lenses.

 

dunk

[edwardkaraa]

I strongly disagree.

 

It will be a wonderful M, very similar to a film M. Reduced to the essence.

 

How can it be similar to a film M, when we need to put our greasy fingers everywhere on the screen in order to do simple tasks?

 

I think it would be better to remove the screen altogether if you need film M experience.

 

How about voice command, or hand hovering over the screen?

[algrove]

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The M will have a touchscream interface by the end of the year?

 

I certainly hope not. The trouble with computer products is it's up to "users" (even the term devalues people) to "be left trying to get used" to them, rather than being designed to be simple and intuitive in the first place. Often they are crammed with features merely to show how clever the programmers are, and they just get in the way with all the modes and menus. Granted, the T interface is by all accounts very clear, but it is not the only way forward for product design.

 

When the X Vario was released, Leica was saying how similar it was to the M in its design. Part of a family. The T is a clear break and obviously appeals to some. But simple, proven analog controls still have many advantages, even in the digital age, for all kinds of products. Fuji and even Nikon have introduced cameras whose controls are similar to the earliest Barnack Leicas! I would far rather have tactile shutter and aperture controls than have to press an LCD, especially in bright light.

 

Let's have a choice.

 

I only was saying by buying the T then I will be used to a touchscreen Leica by years end because I will have been using the T for a while by then.

[dkCambridgeshire]

How can it be similar to a film M, when we need to put our greasy fingers everywhere on the screen in order to do simple tasks?

 

I think it would be better to remove the screen altogether if you need film M experience.

 

How about voice command, or hand hovering over the screen?

 

Old fashioned and slow … the future is 'chip implant' enabling 'thought transference' activating camera settings

 

dunk

[rosuna]

How can it be similar to a film M, when we need to put our greasy fingers everywhere on the screen in order to do simple tasks?

 

The photographic controls are exposure time and aperture. Those are the two only photographic controls in a film M. They belong to a wheel and ring.

 

I can understand the presence of another direct physical control for exposure compensation, or maybe ISO, with another wheel.

 

All remaining parameters are computer parameters (play, delete, format, protect, wifi, etc. ) and they should be hidden in a photo camera.

 

Two different environments (the photo camera, the computer), two different interfaces, one physical, tactile, another one virtual.

 

See the absurdity of the current interface: physical controls interacting with a passive screen for basic computer-related operation, when you have the possibility of an active screen.

 

The Canon 5D MIII has 20 buttons and 3 wheels...

[earleygallery]

ISO on a future M with touchscreen could be via a digital version of the film reminder dial on my M2 - turn it with the tips of two fingers. That would be quite cool!

[edwardkaraa]

ISO on a future M with touchscreen could be via a digital version of the film reminder dial on my M2 - turn it with the tips of two fingers. That would be quite cool!

 

But it's possible to do that on the M9, on a real physical wheel

[edwardkaraa]

The photographic controls are exposure time and aperture. Those are the two only photographic controls in a film M. They belong to a wheel and ring.

 

I can understand the presence of another direct physical control for exposure compensation, or maybe ISO, with another wheel.

 

All remaining parameters are computer parameters (play, delete, format, protect, wifi, etc. ) and they should be hidden in a photo camera.

 

Two different environments (the photo camera, the computer), two different interfaces, one physical, tactile, another one virtual.

 

See the absurdity of the current interface: physical controls interacting with a passive screen for basic computer-related operation, when you have the possibility of an active screen.

 

The Canon 5D MIII has 20 buttons and 3 wheels...

 

As far as I'm concerned, if you give me 2 extra dials for iso and EC, you can remove the screen completely.

[CaptZoom]

So...no control over lens profile or in camera SD card formatting or manual WB or Exp Bracketing or many other useful (though maybe seldom used) features for you? Would each if these functions need a separate button or dial?

[edwardkaraa]

So...no control over lens profile or in camera SD card formatting or manual WB or Exp Bracketing or many other useful (though maybe seldom used) features for you? Would each if these functions need a separate button or dial?

 

Please do not misinterprete my words. I said I'm against the touchscreen. I have no problem with the current screen nor with the current analog dials.

 

I am just responding to Mr. rosuna's claims that a touchscreen will make the M reminiscent of M film cameras.

 

I am saying if given the choice between touchscreen or no screen, I would rather have no screen at all. Or no camera.

[CaptZoom]

Please do not misinterprete my words. I said I'm against the touchscreen. I have no problem with the current screen nor with the current analog dials.

 

As far as I'm concerned, if you give me 2 extra dials for iso and EC, you can remove the screen completely.

 

I am just responding to Mr. rosuna's claims that a touchscreen will make the M reminiscent of M film cameras.

 

[/b]I am saying if given the choice between touchscreen or no screen, I would rather have no screen at all. Or no camera.[/b]

 

 

Understood.

 

Would you be opposed the M series retaining it's current layout and buttons (M240) and having a touch screen?

 

For the record: I yet to like a touch screen on a camera that I've use, but that's not reason enough to believe it can't be implemented successfully. I have not handled the T.

[edwardkaraa]

Understood.

 

Would you be opposed the M series retaining it's current layout and buttons (M240) and having a touch screen?

 

For the record: I yet to like a touch screen on a camera that I've use, but that's not reason enough to believe it can't be implemented successfully. I have not handled the T.

 

Honestly yes, I would be radically opposed to the M having a touchscreen, even if it retains its current layout. The touchscreen gathers huge amounts of grease and finger prints. It becomes almost unusable in damp weather or when slightly wet. But most importantly, it's quite at the opposite side of the M philosophy, simple, mechanical, tactile experience. Like you I've yet to like any device with a touchscreen. Even my smartphone, if I could find a current model with a traditional keypad, I will switch without hesitation. Unfortunately it's impossible to find one (except maybe a blackberry).

[CaptZoom]

Honestly yes, I would be radically opposed to the M having a touchscreen, even if it retains its current layout. The touchscreen gathers huge amounts of grease and finger prints. It becomes almost unusable in damp weather or when slightly wet. But most importantly, it's quite at the opposite side of the M philosophy, simple, mechanical, tactile experience. Like you I've yet to like any device with a touchscreen. Even my smartphone, if I could find a current model with a traditional keypad, I will switch without hesitation. Unfortunately it's impossible to find one (except maybe a blackberry).

 

 

Thanks for explaining your position- it is what I was trying to understand.

[Rick]

No. I am not the intended demographic for this camera and will not buy it. I learned with the A7r I had for a month that I am a M photographer and I would rather spend roughly $5K+ for the T-system on one of the new M lenses that are being introduced in September at Photokina in Cologne (28/1.4 or the 35/2.0 ASPH).

 

Yes. I would buy the T if I were looking for APSc. I finally demo'd the T last Thursday. It is a great APSc camera with what I am sure are killer lenses. For a certain demographic this is going to be as good or a better image maker than any other APSc camera. Pretty much all of the APSc camera images look about the same to me... with the exception of the M8 with its larger sensor + M lenses.

 

At base ISO it is hard to beat the M8 with M glass. Buying a M8 gets you into the system, which means you are starting your collection of M glass. Makes more sense to me to go that route if, you plan on being a RF shooter.

 

Lastly, my RX1 is FF and has an incredible sensor and f2.0 lens. It is smaller and produces a 35mm FOV image and can probably be cropped to about 70mm FOV and still produce a better image than the T with its 18-56mm lens. So, for a small PAS like the T, I'd rather stick with my RX1 for now. The RX1 is going to be a sought after classic more than I believe the T will be.

 

I am not sour on the T like some posters and wish Leica success with this camera.

Edited May 12, 2014 by RickLeica

[lenicolas]

So...no control over lens profile or in camera SD card formatting or manual WB or Exp Bracketing or many other useful (though maybe seldom used) features for you? Would each if these functions need a separate button or dial?

 

Three buttons/wheels on the camera : speed, iso and shutter.

Two rings on the lens : focus and aperture.

 

All the functions you mention would be set via WiFi/Bluetooth on a smartphone with an app, or via a simple display (think canon or Nikon's top displays) hidden underneath the base plate.

 

Next to the "busy card writing" led on the back there would be two extra leds that blink when the shot you just made has clipped highlights or blocked shadows.

 

Then I'd be perfectly happy to live without a screen, but I expect the camera to be lighter, and smaller (not bigger than an M6, possibly smaller).

 

Hell, this could even have a Dx sensor or a x1,3 crop and be the digital CL a few of us have been dreaming of.

 

sent from a phone with auto-correct.

Edited May 12, 2014 by lenicolas

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[CaptZoom]

^

Setting a custom WB or setting exposure bracketing (especially for rapidly changing/developing situations) would require either syncing the camera to a mobile device or removing the base plate, changing settings, and reattaching the base plate?

Seems a bit too time consuming and/or awkward. I suppose the camera mentioned above would be a special purpose camera for an already niche group of photographers.