don daniel Posted July 25, 2014 Share #81 Posted July 25, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) The third lock-up was the one whereby the shutter seemed to go through half a cycle - it didn't re-cock. Pulled the battery to reset the camera. Two days ago I had such a lock up using latest firmware .15, rangefinder modus, doing small series, not extensively, temperature: about 20 degrees Celsius, classical metering mode. Sandisk Extreme Pro 8GB. I had to pull the battery to bring the camera back to work. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 25, 2014 Posted July 25, 2014 Hi don daniel, Take a look here Anyone figure out why the 240 freezes up?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
FlashGordonPhotography Posted August 2, 2014 Share #82 Posted August 2, 2014 Had my first lock up a couple of days ago. But I think it was partly my fault as I'm fairly sure I bumped the EVF as I was trying to push the button on it. So I think the camera got an iffy connection. I did change lenses without powering off (something I usually avoid), so I'll never be 100% it was the bump that didi it Gordon. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delnevo Posted August 2, 2014 Share #83 Posted August 2, 2014 My Leica M (240) froze on three occasions. I believe it was a combination of using the single shot (S) mode too fast, in combination with a relatively slow SD card (40mb/s). I was able to recreate 'the freeze' when shooting too fast on 'S' mode. However it was less easy to create the freeze when I changed to a faster (95mb/s) card. I now only use 95mb/s cards, and try to shoot more slowly or change to 'C' (continuous mode). My default is to use 'S' (single shot) mode, and I try not to shoot so fast. Having 'trained' myself, and with the safe-guard of a faster card, I have not had any re-occurrence of camera 'freeze'. I experienced this issue during a period of relatively constant ambient temperatures and am not aware of any temperature related effects. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nick932 Posted August 4, 2014 Share #84 Posted August 4, 2014 I have so far replaced three cameras for this crashing issue and another two for other reasons. I have never made more than 200 images on each before the camera got frozen. Leica claims that is the SD card. This is the poorest excuse that exists. Is the camera that writes to the card; is the Leica software and hardware that is very very very badly implemented. It has been the worst camera that I have ever crossed in my life but you can get gorgeous images. What an irony. Five out of Five all faulty. How do you deal with this guys? 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted August 4, 2014 Share #85 Posted August 4, 2014 I have so far replaced three cameras for this crashing issue and another two for other reasons. I have never made more than 200 images on each before the camera got frozen. Leica claims that is the SD card. This is the poorest excuse that exists. Is the camera that writes to the card; is the Leica software and hardware that is very very very badly implemented. It has been the worst camera that I have ever crossed in my life but you can get gorgeous images. What an irony. Five out of Five all faulty. How do you deal with this guys? At the outset, let me emphasize that what I say is with the greatest respect for you. I would not enjoy your ordeal. From the outside (where I am) it would seem the one common element is you. Leica software and cameras are abundant in the wild, mainly working well. Logically I would be closely looking at how you use the camera, what settings, how rapidly you shoot, do you chimp while the card is still writing, that sort of thing. What Leica said about your card may be right. Have you tried a different one? All these test are the quickest and cheapest way, short of returning to Leica. I don't have any other suggestions. I hope someone else can do better for you. Five! There has to be a clue there. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 4, 2014 Share #86 Posted August 4, 2014 Sorry for this bad experience but i've never got the least lockup problem i must say. I shoot 90% in classic and single shot modes and use fast cards only though... What card(s) have you been using if i may ask? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted August 4, 2014 Share #87 Posted August 4, 2014 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) I have so far replaced three cameras for this crashing issue and another two for other reasons. I have never made more than 200 images on each before the camera got frozen. Leica claims that is the SD card. This is the poorest excuse that exists. Is the camera that writes to the card; is the Leica software and hardware that is very very very badly implemented. It has been the worst camera that I have ever crossed in my life but you can get gorgeous images. What an irony. Five out of Five all faulty. How do you deal with this guys? Have you asked Leica to provide you with a card that works with your next copy of the M? Just a thought. Another thought. Please let Leica observe you how you use and break their cameras. That should give you and them some clues, I would think. Edited August 4, 2014 by k-hawinkler 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted August 4, 2014 Share #88 Posted August 4, 2014 Five out of Five all faulty. How do you deal with this guys? First off, we ask to see the receipts of all five returns... and then we start from there. Are you game? 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 4, 2014 Share #89 Posted August 4, 2014 (edited) Seems like Nick932's camera was replaced two times because of sensor spots and one time because it was in used condition. The two remaining replacements were due to camera lockups if i understand well. I may be missing something though as he states that three replacements were due to crashes in post # 84 above. Edited August 4, 2014 by lct 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted August 4, 2014 Share #90 Posted August 4, 2014 Watch out Rick I have receipts of all 7 I have purchased (or was it 8) and finally gave up replacing mine in the hopes things would get better. I have kept two and thanks to you and others who beta tested the latest FW things are decidedly better. 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted August 4, 2014 Share #91 Posted August 4, 2014 Seems like Nick932's camera was replaced two times because of sensor spots and one time because it was in used condition. The two remaining replacements were due to camera lockups if i understand well. I may be missing something though as he states that three replacements were due to crashes in post # 84 above. It would be nice to know what are the official details before we dive in and give help or thoughts about his issues. I'd like to see the repair slips or return information especially from Leica, if there is any. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted August 5, 2014 Share #92 Posted August 5, 2014 I will never forget last summer in August talking with CS Solms about this issue. The gentleman told this is the first he had ever heard of the problem of freeze ups. He's also the same guy that told me there was no problem with cable release fittings when early this year Leica NJ had me send an M240 in for replacement of the shutter since there was an issue with some of the releases having been over chromed or whatever. After that meeting my respect for Leica CS hit rock bottom especially since my first APO50 came back from them after 3 months and Leica NJ could not even get it to focus nor mount correctly. You DO NOT get away with telling me to my face that I am imagining an M240 problem when there is clearly one. I made things better by emailing any and all top management in Germany and the US to let them know my experiences. Some issues were corrected immediately and others later. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted August 5, 2014 Share #93 Posted August 5, 2014 (edited) Lou, I don't know if your frustration in your post is directed at me, but the guy in Solms was out of the loop or they were thinking they could blow you off. Because, in August we were testing the new beta and reporting that the freezes with the EVF made the the whole thing unusable. As we have spoken about this before, someone knew about this when you visited Solms. Look on the brighter side, compared to our RX1 which has never had an update and when it crashes it tries to reformat your SD card (pictures and all) unless, you pull it and save it from the camera. Some Leica owners have no idea how frustrating some other cameras can be. Since the ver. 1.5 FW update I haven't had a freeze except on real low battery when turning the camera on... so really not a freeze. Haven't had a chance to test it in hot weather like last year in southern Europe. In Seattle we are in the 80's and low 90's. Nothing like southern latitudes. Are you having any more freezes down south where you are? The problem with these antidotal reports is that we don't know the details. Like, when did this take place? This recent report is from a user that returned 2 cameras because they were delivered with dust on the sensor. A year ago we all knew about the freezes. After the 1.5 ver, so far, I'm doing ok with my M after this update. Edited August 5, 2014 by RickLeica 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Warwick Posted August 5, 2014 Share #94 Posted August 5, 2014 Had first freeze up today after about 500 images. Only thing that was remarkable was I think I'd crudely switched on the camera, so that it was not perfectly on "S" but was nudged just very slightly towards the "C" setting. Not sure if that in itself will cause a freeze? Battery out and all fixed itself. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted August 6, 2014 Share #95 Posted August 6, 2014 (edited) Lou, I don't know if your frustration in your post is directed at me, but the guy in Solms was out of the loop or they were thinking they could blow you off. Because, in August we were testing the new beta and reporting that the freezes with the EVF made the the whole thing unusable. As we have spoken about this before, someone knew about this when you visited Solms. Look on the brighter side, compared to our RX1 which has never had an update and when it crashes it tries to reformat your SD card (pictures and all) unless, you pull it and save it from the camera. Some Leica owners have no idea how frustrating some other cameras can be. Since the ver. 1.5 FW update I haven't had a freeze except on real low battery when turning the camera on... so really not a freeze. Haven't had a chance to test it in hot weather like last year in southern Europe. In Seattle we are in the 80's and low 90's. Nothing like southern latitudes. Are you having any more freezes down south where you are? The problem with these antidotal reports is that we don't know the details. Like, when did this take place? This recent report is from a user that returned 2 cameras because they were delivered with dust on the sensor. A year ago we all knew about the freezes. After the 1.5 ver, so far, I'm doing ok with my M after this update. Rick-My post has nothing to do with you at all. I was strictly talking about CS Solms and those conversations with them. If it was known by Leica, then yes they were either out of the loop or blowing me off. If blowing me off then they deserved the ire of my emails. I am merely explaining what happened to me before you started beta testing last summer of 2013. Remember that the first FW update was not about freezing, but was mostly directed toward color and other items. Maybe your guy knew of the problems from your comments, but somehow he was not communicating this everywhere else in Leica. Remember the German mentality is NOT to rock the boat so he probably just stuck to his FW upgrade on color for the time being back then and tabled the lock up issue for later. Yes, I occasionally get lock ups now, but I am using the EVF almost all the time. I hate it when on tripod and I have to remove nearly everything to put battery in and out, as you full well know. The lockups are way less frequent thus summer than last summer. I was thinking you were in Europe in September last year one month after my Solms visit where you told Leica that the EVF was unusable due to lockups. Edited August 6, 2014 by algrove 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted August 6, 2014 Share #96 Posted August 6, 2014 I was thinking you were in Europe in September last year one month after my Solms visit where you told Leica that the EVF was unusable due to lockups. Right, I was reporting this to Leica a month after you went to Solms, during the beta test for the color problems. I think at that early point in time the freezes with the EVF were all just unfolding. My communication with Leica (about EVF freezes) came after your visit to the Leica Solms factory customer area. It was after your visit that our beta-contact at Leica stated that it was identified as a temp problem and a FW fix would come in the next update (which took forever). You were just at Solms before Leica knew about the problem or were ready to acknowledge it... even though you demonstrated it to them. Anyway, the problem is much better and that is a step in the right direction for Leica. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheshireCat Posted August 6, 2014 Share #97 Posted August 6, 2014 The thread subject is clear: can we know why the 240 keeps freezing up also with the new firmware ? In other words, why is my $7000 camera defective ? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erl Posted August 6, 2014 Share #98 Posted August 6, 2014 (edited) The thread subject is clear: can we know why the 240 keeps freezing up also with the new firmware ? In other words, why is my $7000 camera defective ? Possibly for one of the reasons why a camera of any value can be defective. Nothing to do with $$$'s. There is apparently a defect. It must be addressed. Currently I am addressing a similar problem with my expensive printer. I know it is pointless worrying about what it cost, despite my neighbour telling me his cheap printer has never given any trouble. Right now I am address the problem of getting a deadline out, regardless of whether the techy can fix mine in time or not. I have stopped calling myself a photographer. Instead I am now a TroubleShooter. In other words, I focus on delivering, rather than complaining about the problems. Edited August 6, 2014 by erl 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted August 6, 2014 Share #99 Posted August 6, 2014 My second M240 (the first was replaced as Leica damaged it during the lug repair, so it continually took movies) has been a paragon of reliability and I think I only have had one freeze, which I was fairly sure was due to a dodgy SD card, which I threw away. SD cards are so cheap nowadays, it is just not worth messing about with SD Formatter on a card which has had an issue. The risk of losing a day’s shooting is not worth the £19 that I can get a Lexar Pro 16GB class 10 600x card for. Compared with my early M8, which before it had a new electronics suite put in by Leica, would freeze up pretty much at least once every day, the M240 has been a huge advance. I only use either SanDisk 95mb/s or Lexar 600x cards, which have never been used in other cameras. I found that swapping cards between my M8 and M9, even with reformatting in camera every time, gave rise to problems, so all my cards are now marked with the camera they relate to. Wilson 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
acordes Posted August 6, 2014 Share #100 Posted August 6, 2014 My second M240 (the first was replaced as Leica damaged it during the lug repair, so it continually took movies) has been a paragon of reliability and I think I only have had one freeze, which I was fairly sure was due to a dodgy SD card, which I threw away. SD cards are so cheap nowadays, it is just not worth messing about with SD Formatter on a card which has had an issue. The risk of losing a day’s shooting is not worth the £19 that I can get a Lexar Pro 16GB class 10 600x card for. Compared with my early M8, which before it had a new electronics suite put in by Leica, would freeze up pretty much at least once every day, the M240 has been a huge advance. I only use either SanDisk 95mb/s or Lexar 600x cards, which have never been used in other cameras. I found that swapping cards between my M8 and M9, even with reformatting in camera every time, gave rise to problems, so all my cards are now marked with the camera they relate to. Wilson May be it is really related to the SD card. I had lock ups several times, changed to SanDisk Extreme Pro SDXC 64GB 95 MB/s to increase the startup time. Since that time I never had a lockup. (Change of SD card was already with the old FW, for ~1 or 2 Months, and now with the new FW is still ok) Hope it'll stay like that. (NOT using EVF, nor LW) 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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