M9 + Zeiss ZM: 21 or 25 mm??

[profus]

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Hi everybody,

 

I need a piece of advice:

 

I want to buy a wide lens to my M9. I already have 50 Lux + 35 Cron. No budget for Leica wide, but I heard those two Zeiss are rather good on M9...

 

Any experiences?

I can buy 4 years old 21/2.8 in an "as new condition" for ca. 150€ less then completely new 25/ 2.8 ( with warranty )

 

I am also a bit worried if 21mm could be too wide for me...?

 

Any thoughts?

 

Tnx

[01af]

Both Zeiss lenses are really good—but the Biogon 25 mm ZM is spectacularly good ... at least according to hearsay (never tried it myself).

 

Anyway—there's a significant difference between 24/25 mm and 20/21 mm. A 24 mm lens (on 35-mm format) is the widest wide-angle. A 21 mm is the longest super-wide-angle. Wide-angle lenses have angles-of-view between 60° and 90°; super-wides are wider than 90°. Why is this important? For some reason, it does make a difference.

 

Generally, a 24 mm is really wide but pictures will look mostly natural still. Pictures taken with a 21 mm (or wider) will always have a surreal touch to them. Depending on your subject and your intentions, this surreal flavour may be welcome or objectionable.

 

You can get that surreal super-wide impression with 24 mm, too, if you're pushing it ... and you can get natural-looking 21 mm shots when you're careful. It's not impossible—but doesn't come naturally either.

 

So if you want to shoot just somewhat wider than 35 mm in a laid-back or documentary style and don't want your lens to constantly add something to your pictures on its own (as super-wides tend to do) then better get a 24 or 25 mm lens. If you want to get artsy and flashy and have something significantly different from your 35 mm lens then go for 21 mm.

[Keith (M)]

I have the 21mm f2.8 + Zeiss viewfinder and have been exceedingly pleased with the results from my M9. Some examples can be seen here. Hopefully you will be able to glean some idea of just how wiiiiide a view it gives!

[sdk]

Both are very good on the M9 resolution-wise, though the 25mm is better in the corners. The 25mm is probably a better companion to a 50mm lens. In terms of color color casts on my M9-P both lenses show some problems even with Zeiss’ recommended choice of manual selected lens corrections in the M9 menu. But then again I notice some uneven color with all my Leica wideangles on auto lens correction too. I’m very sensitive to color, and notice even a slight color cast that would not bother most people. Fortunately the Adobe DNG Flat Field Plugin for Adobe Lightroom can correct any problems using a reference shot of a pure white subject (I use a piece of opaque ⅛” thick white plexiglas cut to the size of a credit card).

[Einst_Stein]

I had exactly th same question here about a year ago. I ended up with 25mm, I'm extremely happy with it. However, now I think 21mm will be the better choice.

 

I decided on 5mm for the following reasons:

 

1. External view finder is not absolutely necessary for 25mm. I can peek around the M9 view finder which pretty OK for composition.

2. 21mm has non-monotonic distortion at about 1/3 of the edge. If you can find the distortion chart, you will see the worst distortion is not at the edge.

3. 21mm seemed too wide for me. I think 25mm is already very wide, why wider?

 

However, after a year's use, this is my experience:

1. 25mm is one of the most used lens on my M9 for traveling, far more than 35mm and 50mm.

2. For traveling in most Europe cities, due to the narrow street and lead rom between me and the architecture, 25mm is not wide enough. I have to tilt the lens upward to capture the main theme I wanted. The results are not pleasant to me. I need to correct the perspective on PS, but due to the horizon leveling error, it's very difficult. I found if I had 21mm, I won't have to tilt to much.

3. For indoors, 25mm is simply not wide enough. 21mm should be better, maybe even 15~18mm. I found my appetite for wide angle is much wider than I thought.

4. by the way, although external view find is not absolutely required for 25mm, I found it's much more pleasant to have use it. I have a Voigtlander 90 degree external view finder, which can be 25mm, 21mm, 18mm by switching the interchangeable object lens.

 

Overall, I think 25mm is too close to 28mm. For close distance architecture or indoors, 21mm is the way to go.

 

But what about the original concerns?

1. External view finder: I almost always have the 90 degree external view finder on the hot shoe. It's not bothering at all to move my eye between the M9 view finder and the external view finder. Yes, I have to focus with M9 OVF and compose with the external OVF.

 

2. What about the non-monotonic distortion? well for me, the distortion due to the human operation error (tilting but with horizontal leveling error) is far more severe. The lens design is not a problem at all. YMMV, especially you have the habit of using the tripod and have perfect leveling.

 

3. 25mm is enough? 21mm is too wide? For outdoors nature or mountain hiking, maybe, but not for indoors or city-scape or architecture. No, I was wrong.

[algrove]

Depends on your needs and shooting style. We are all different. For me, I would go for the 21, but I feel the 21 SEM the best small 21 right now.