a week with the M240 and pretty disillusioned‎

[Peter H]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

...

 

My pro photographer friend was right. See my separate thread on the subject.

 

- Marc

 

I'd be interested to read it but I can't find it. Would you tell me what it's called and where it is please, or provide a link?

 

Many thanks.

[mwilliamsphotography]

I'd be interested to read it but I can't find it. Would you tell me what it's called and where it is please, or provide a link?

 

Many thanks.

 

I just uploaded it ... my wife called me to breakfast before I had finished.

 

It is titled " M240 Color ... Oh, oh!"

 

- Marc

Edited November 23, 2013 by fotografz
Typo

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[drdannn]

Yes, three different ones to date. We will see how this #4 camera behaves. Due to major surgery I have used it very little with my R lenses. That will now change.

 

Based on a Leica contact who met me while in the Solms showroom (the same day CS said they had never heard of the lockup/dimming issue) the guy said he had one lockup and changed EVF and never had it again.

 

I brought two with me on that trip (just in case) and sadly both behaved similarly.

Here's the deal on the EVF ( my experience). I have tried a couple and consulted with the Leica store in Los Angeles. I have experimented with the EVF extensively and here's what it does: 1. When you look thru the EVF and you are NOT touching the shutter button, it gives you a bright view of the frame and a great way to focus just as if you are looking thru a window with no exposure compensation no matter what your camera is set at. 2. When your camera is in manual exposure mode ( and less pronounced in Auto mode, but still there) and you push the shutter button half way down, the EVF gives you an accurate preview of what your exposure is going to look like, i.e. if you are over-exposed the EVF is going to look that way when the shutter button is half way pressed. 3. If at any time you are looking thru the EVF, you can push the "info" button and an exposure scale will show up on the bottom of the screen. If you are not touching the shutter button your view will look like you are still looking thru a window in real time, but the exposure scale on the bottom of the screen will show you if you are over or under exposed no matter what. Then if you push the shutter button half way down, the preview you see will be your actual exposure should you press the shutter button to take the frame. Pushing the shutter button half way down will exactly mimic the exposure scale when the info button is pressed. 4. The "lock up" can be avoided easily, i.e. If you take a picture and immediately push the shutter button all the way down again, the EVF will lock up for several seconds ( not good), but the way around that is to immediately push the shutter button down HALF WAY. By doing this, in about 1/10th of second, you will see the EVF switch to real time and the exposure scale will once again be on the bottom of the screen , and you will immediately be able to release the "lock up" and can take another frame on the spot by pushing the shutter button down the rest of the way. If you do not have the "info" button pushed you will still see a switch immediately from "lock up" to real time. Try it and see. --- I hope I have explained this so it is understandable by all. If not, please let me know and I will try in different way. The EVF is a great tool if used as intended. All the best! DF

[drdannn]

Here's the deal on the EVF ( my experience). I have tried a couple and consulted with the Leica store in Los Angeles. I have experimented with the EVF extensively and here's what it does: 1. When you look thru the EVF and you are NOT touching the shutter button, it gives you a bright view of the frame and a great way to focus just as if you are looking thru a window with no exposure compensation no matter what your camera is set at. 2. When your camera is in manual exposure mode ( and less pronounced in Auto mode, but still there) and you push the shutter button half way down, the EVF gives you an accurate preview of what your exposure is going to look like, i.e. if you are over-exposed the EVF is going to look that way when the shutter button is half way pressed. 3. If at any time you are looking thru the EVF, you can push the "info" button and an exposure scale will show up on the bottom of the screen. If you are not touching the shutter button your view will look like you are still looking thru a window in real time, but the exposure scale on the bottom of the screen will show you if you are over or under exposed no matter what. Then if you push the shutter button half way down, the preview you see will be your actual exposure should you press the shutter button to take the frame. Pushing the shutter button half way down will exactly mimic the exposure scale when the info button is pressed. 4. The "lock up" can be avoided easily, i.e. If you take a picture and immediately push the shutter button all the way down again, the EVF will lock up for several seconds ( not good), but the way around that is to immediately push the shutter button down HALF WAY. By doing this, in about 1/10th of second, you will see the EVF switch to real time and the exposure scale will once again be on the bottom of the screen , and you will immediately be able to release the "lock up" and can take another frame on the spot by pushing the shutter button down the rest of the way. If you do not have the "info" button pushed you will still see a switch immediately from "lock up" to real time. Try it and see. --- I hope I have explained this so it is understandable by all. If not, please let me know and I will try in different way. The EVF is a great tool if used as intended. All the best! DF

Just want to add another tidbit: Be careful -- In the menu, first page, DO NOT SELECT, "advanced" in the menu item titled,"Light Metering Mode". Leave it on "CLASSIC". If you select advanced you are telling the camera to be in live mode all the time, even when you are not using the live mode screen or the EVF!!! If you select "advanced" the LOCK UP will occur even when you are not using the live screen or the EVF and you will have to wait a couple of seconds before you can shoot another frame! Now lets go to the "Set" menu. There is a sub menu called, "Exposure Metering" and by touching the right side of the info button you get 3 choices: 1. center-weighted 2. multi-field. 3. Spot. THESE SETTINGS ARE ONLY FOR LIVE VIEW; live view meaning the live view screen, or the EVF. If, however, you have selected, "advanced" in the "menu" screen, saying it again, the camera thinks it is in live view mode all the time and will lock up between exposures even if you are not using the EVF or live view screen; strange but true.

[jaapv]

Not so strange - the camera needs to read the exposure data off the sensor in advanced mode, so the sensor must be active with the shutter open.

[algrove]

Thanks Dan. I am not referring to the black out delay between shots. Thanks as I use all the methods you describe so thoroughly.

 

The lockup I am talking about is a real serious lockup which occurs while using the EVF and where the camera becomes inoperable requiring battery removal or off/on cycle (at best) is required to restore the camera to an operable state. Sometimes the record light remains steady on and will not go out until after battery removal.

 

Worst case scenario is where after getting the camera back to functioning then the EVF will no longer be at normal brightness, but maybe less than half strength ASA brightness is concerned. Only after two or three off/on cycles will the EVF get back to normal operating brightness as it was before lock-up.

 

Between many M240 I have taken over 15k images and this has repeatedly happened on all cameras I have used. And yes, I use the EVFa lot especially when using R lenses.

[Peter H]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I've been lucky apparently. Never once had any sort of lock-up in many thousands of photos with and without the EVF in use. It appears to be more of a problem with QC than actual design, though a better design might obviate the QC issue I suppose.

[jaapv]

Same here, I only had the temperature-related ones. It may be due to the way the camera is used. I have my preview set to "press shutter" or whatever they call it because I dislike the EVF blackout. I prefer the frozen view, which disappears rather quickly to be replaced by the live view as the camera processes..

Thus I press and hold the shutter button for a moment - always- and I never have these lockups.

Edited November 25, 2013 by jaapv

[drdannn]

Not so strange - the camera needs to read the exposure data off the sensor in advanced mode, so the sensor must be active with the shutter open.

Hi, I wonder why then it is even in the menu. When using live view or the EVF I can change the metering to any of the 3 choices located in the "set" menu. So why even have the choice in the "menu" as to 'classic or advanced', and why would anyone want to have the sensor active with the shutter open when not using live view or EVF? Do you have any idea? Thanks, Dan

[drdannn]

Thanks Dan. I am not referring to the black out delay between shots. Thanks as I use all the methods you describe so thoroughly.

 

The lockup I am talking about is a real serious lockup which occurs while using the EVF and where the camera becomes inoperable requiring battery removal or off/on cycle (at best) is required to restore the camera to an operable state. Sometimes the record light remains steady on and will not go out until after battery removal.

 

Worst case scenario is where after getting the camera back to functioning then the EVF will no longer be at normal brightness, but maybe less than half strength ASA brightness is concerned. Only after two or three off/on cycles will the EVF get back to normal operating brightness as it was before lock-up.

 

Between many M240 I have taken over 15k images and this has repeatedly happened on all cameras I have used. And yes, I use the EVFa lot especially when using R lenses.

 

Hi, Thanks for your input. That is quite a problem you are describing. A big problem! My camera is not doing that, YET. If it starts happening I guess my camera needs to go back to Leica Service, right? Just curious, how have you come to use so many 240 cameras? And so many images? Looking forward to your reply. Dan

[drdannn]

I've been lucky apparently. Never once had any sort of lock-up in many thousands of photos with and without the EVF in use. It appears to be more of a problem with QC than actual design, though a better design might obviate the QC issue I suppose.

Hi Peter, I have not had the problem either. I just got my 240 a week ago and have used live view and evf. Maybe the QC got better with the recently delivered cameras? Who knows! Dan

[drdannn]

Same here, I only had the temperature-related ones. It may be due to the way the camera is used. I have my preview set to "press shutter" or whatever they call it because I dislike the EVF blackout. I prefer the frozen view, which disappears rather quickly to be replaced by the live view as the camera processes..

Thus I press and hold the shutter button for a moment - always- and I never have these lockups.

Hi Jaap, I remember where to find the shutter release setting on the m9, but cannot find it in the menu or set in the 240. Can you describe how I can find it? Thanks much, Dan

[jaapv]

Hi, I wonder why then it is even in the menu. When using live view or the EVF I can change the metering to any of the 3 choices located in the "set" menu. So why even have the choice in the "menu" as to 'classic or advanced', and why would anyone want to have the sensor active with the shutter open when not using live view or EVF? Do you have any idea? Thanks, Dan

The shutter is closed in classic mode. The camera is a bit quicker that way, hence the choice when not having LV and EVF. The choice is there all the time to enable you to preset the measuring mode the camera will revert to when removing the EVF I suppose. (Does it ?).

[jaapv]

Hi Jaap, I remember where to find the shutter release setting on the m9, but cannot find it in the menu or set in the 240. Can you describe how I can find it? Thanks much, Dan

 

Autoreview ---> Rel. Button Pressed. One redundant "p"Sorry.

Edited November 26, 2013 by jaapv

[thighslapper]

I've been lucky apparently. Never once had any sort of lock-up in many thousands of photos with and without the EVF in use. It appears to be more of a problem with QC than actual design, though a better design might obviate the QC issue I suppose.

 

Ditto and I've had mine since the fist appeared in early March.

 

EIther the 'unaffected' are consistently using their camera in a different way or our cameras have more robust electronics that don't trip whatever function locks the firmware ......

[algrove]

Hi, Thanks for your input. That is quite a problem you are describing. A big problem! My camera is not doing that, YET. If it starts happening I guess my camera needs to go back to Leica Service, right? Just curious, how have you come to use so many 240 cameras? And so many images? Looking forward to your reply. Dan

 

Dan

At this juncture Leica has not released a fix for this issue which seems to come from system overheating mostly while using the EVF. Recent emails with Leica have indicated just that-no fix yet. It is rather disturbing.

 

I bought every camera I have used. Due to the weather being colder for me these days my current M has not yet had the lockup problems and has not been used much at all due to an operation. On all other M240 cameras that had the problems, the issue seemed to manifest itself after many heat cycles which makes me wonder if there is some heat sensor that is not so robust when exposed to constant heat, either from camera use and/or from ambient temperatures and in multiple heat cycles.

 

I spent 2 hours this last August with CS Solms trying to get answers and their reply was "the problem did not exist for them". Many others have had this problem and some have relayed their dismay to Leica and probably many more have not informed Leica that their camera also has heat lockup issues. Where many do not contact Leica about heat lockups, it may continue to lead Leica to think that it is a unique problem with only a handful of cameras.

[woorob]

Mine locked up on me [again] yesterday -- while shooting at 9 (nine) degrees F. The lock-up issue is not always caused by high ambient temps. I am going to try Jaap's "Rel. Button Pressed" suggestion to see if that makes a difference. The lock-ups are not a big deal to me, just a bit bothersome.

[Stealth3kpl]

Here's the deal on the EVF ( my experience). I have tried a couple and consulted with the Leica store in Los Angeles. I have experimented with the EVF extensively and here's what it does: 1. When you look thru the EVF and you are NOT touching the shutter button, it gives you a bright view of the frame and a great way to focus just as if you are looking thru a window with no exposure compensation no matter what your camera is set at. 2. When your camera is in manual exposure mode ( and less pronounced in Auto mode, but still there) and you push the shutter button half way down, the EVF gives you an accurate preview of what your exposure is going to look like, i.e. if you are over-exposed the EVF is going to look that way when the shutter button is half way pressed. 3. If at any time you are looking thru the EVF, you can push the "info" button and an exposure scale will show up on the bottom of the screen. If you are not touching the shutter button your view will look like you are still looking thru a window in real time, but the exposure scale on the bottom of the screen will show you if you are over or under exposed no matter what. Then if you push the shutter button half way down, the preview you see will be your actual exposure should you press the shutter button to take the frame. Pushing the shutter button half way down will exactly mimic the exposure scale when the info button is pressed. 4. The "lock up" can be avoided easily, i.e. If you take a picture and immediately push the shutter button all the way down again, the EVF will lock up for several seconds ( not good), but the way around that is to immediately push the shutter button down HALF WAY. By doing this, in about 1/10th of second, you will see the EVF switch to real time and the exposure scale will once again be on the bottom of the screen , and you will immediately be able to release the "lock up" and can take another frame on the spot by pushing the shutter button down the rest of the way. If you do not have the "info" button pushed you will still see a switch immediately from "lock up" to real time. Try it and see. --- I hope I have explained this so it is understandable by all. If not, please let me know and I will try in different way. The EVF is a great tool if used as intended. All the best! DF

 

I'm drawn to Leica cameras for their simplicity

Pete

[Guest Gilgamesh]

Having not read the whole set of replies but as a big critic of the M240, and owning several D700's and D800e's I can tell you the Leica files with Leica glass are VERY SPECIAL.

 

I import into LR5 and you may want to consider PhotoMechanic 5 too, but even in Bridge, they are different to the Nikon's RAW files. Firstly, straight out of the camera, the RAWs need next to no adjustments, colours can be a little off, but as a general rule, they are outstanding files.

 

I tested the D800e with the 50mm f1.4G against the 50mm f1.4 and the M240 Leica.

Unfortunately I therefore had to buy the M240 based on the flies alone.

 

That test cost me over £10,000 after buying 4x lenses and the M240.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M