50mm - Leica vs. Voightlander (am I crazy?)

[Jakobben]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Hi

 

I'm eagerly awaiting my first Leica (ordered the M in the beginning of July in San Francisco). Since then I have been trying to decide on a lens to get. I want to go with a one-lens system for the first good amount of time, and will probably get a 50mm.

 

I rented an M-E with a 50mm summicron an really liked the lens. However, looking at photos online taken with the new Nokton f1.5 from Voightlander I'm not so sure. The Nokton has a creamer (twirly / classic) bokeh and larger aperture - it is also way cheaper, and I hear the build quality is about as good as the summicron. Basically the only things pulling me towards the Leica is that I've tried it (and loved using it), and that it is a Leica...

 

I hear the poor man pays twice for gear (realizing that the cheaper alternative is not good enough). I can afford either one, but I think I prefer the look of the Nokton files. Am I crazy to go for that one over the Leica lens? The money I save could also go towards a 28mm Elmarit at some point...

 

Thanks!

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[CaptZoom]

I have the LTM version of the Nokton. I would not say the build quality to be on par with the Leica 50mm 'cron, which is not say the lens is lacking quality. To the contrary, the Nokton's proved to be quite resilient. It's my go to lens when I'm part of the partying rather than the outsider documenting. And as an added bonus, the image quality is superb. Strictly speaking, the IQ isn't on par with the Leica 50mm 'lux, but it isn't far off; it certainly isn't thousands of dollars off. I've used the the 50mm 'cron. It is a fantastic lens. But I haven't used it extensively. I couldn't get myself to part with my Ziess 50mm planar. The 'lux and Nokton, I use often. I don't think I could choose one over the other. So I cast my vote for the Nokton. That being said, the 'cron's diminutive size is its biggest advantage and shouldn't be discounted.

 

PS. That little Elmarit is outright theft in Leicaland. I can't believe Leica still sells it at the price that they do.

[-Lss-]

I can afford either one, but I think I prefer the look of the Nokton files.

Sounds like your answer is right there. Get what you prefer. If you don't end up liking it for whatever reason, you can then go with the Summicron. You shouldn't lose much money, since the Nokton in M mount is still scarce in the second-hand market.

[Jakobben]

Thank you very much for the input, CaptZoom.

 

The Zeiss 50mm Planar also looks interesting, but it doesn't have the rendering of the Nokton from the tests I've seen.

Regarding the sizes, the Nokton and the Summicron should be about the same size... 2.1" x 1.8" (Nokton) vs. 2.1" x 1.7" (summicron).... Do they feel much different in terms of size?

 

The fact that the sub 1k Nokton is "almost" as sharp as the 4k lux just makes the Nokton more tempting.

 

PS. I agree - 2195 USD for an f2.8 28mm lens is not cheap. But the small size makes it really tempting (does not block the viewfinder like the 28mm Ultron from Voightlander). Don't know about the 28mm zeiss Biogon...

[Ecar]

I've been using the Nokton on the M240 lately and really like it, but I wouldn't part with my v2 and v4 Summicrons, nor with any of the other 50's I own.

Do as your heart says: you are going to have a single lens, so you must enjoy using it and the pictures you get. You can't go wrong with either.

Don't want to confuse things further, but another one you may want to throw into the mix for its unique rendering is the Zeiss Sonnar 50/1.5.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

I have the LTM Nokton which is very similar, optically, to the new one. I have a hold on a new one as well. The new one feels much better built compared to my highly abused original. At least as good as my Sumarit 90 and close to my 135APO. The focus ring is small but grippy. i shot with one for an hour and it took me 30 mins to get the feel of it. The focus is really nicely damped (better than the "sloppy" original. The files are lovely. It does have a bit more tendency to purple fringing than the Lux or Summicron. I have no issues fixing the occasional showing in Lightroom and it's gone by f4. Mostly the bokeh is very lovely but occasionally I'll get something very jittery. It's rare, but it happens. I don't know if the lux suffers here as well although I suppose most lenses will show jittery bokeh on occasion.

 

I am very pleased with the central sharpness of the Nokton, even wide open. But I shoot mainly people. The corners sharpen up around f5.6. I'm only upgrading for the better build quality and 0.7m focus distance. I get no focus shift and I particularly like the contrast of the Nokton.

 

just my 0.02

 

Gordon

[rramesh]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

While you are trying out 50mm lenses, don't forget the Summarit. It's a gem of a lens.

[jaapv]

 

I can't believe Leica still sells it at the price that they do.

Nor I - it is one of the best 28 mm lenses ever built with incredibly good corner performance and an amazingly small size. It is -quality-for-money- maybe the best buy there is in the Leica lineup. As such it fits very well into the underrated Summarit line.

 

@ OP. Don't look at names on the lens. Go of the lens that you like best and that fits into your budget. Offhand I cannot think of a disappointing M lens.

[CaptZoom]

The first thought that occurred to me was regarding the significantly smaller size of the summicron in comparison to the CV 50/ 50 Lux. But I haven't used on in over a year, so I could be wrong. Also, the new Nokton may be smaller than the LTM version. I've not handled it, so I can't say.

 

The Planar definitely has it's own signature and it's different from the Nokton. Which you prefer, is a personal preference type thing and there's really no right or wrong answer. However, excepting bokeh and DoF (when applicable), other lens characteristics start disappearing with post processing. So when you see images online, you've got to be critical of what work was done to the image when comparing lenses.

 

I haven't used the CV 28mm Ultron, but I hear its a fantastic lens. One of the reasons CV can charge less for their lenses is due to lower quality control. If possible, go to the dealer and try out multiple copies of each lens; pick the best one. You can also order multiple copies of the same lens, keep the best one, return the rest.

 

Thank you very much for the input, CaptZoom.

 

The Zeiss 50mm Planar also looks interesting, but it doesn't have the rendering of the Nokton from the tests I've seen.

Regarding the sizes, the Nokton and the Summicron should be about the same size... 2.1" x 1.8" (Nokton) vs. 2.1" x 1.7" (summicron).... Do they feel much different in terms of size?

 

The fact that the sub 1k Nokton is "almost" as sharp as the 4k lux just makes the Nokton more tempting.

 

PS. I agree - 2195 USD for an f2.8 28mm lens is not cheap. But the small size makes it really tempting (does not block the viewfinder like the 28mm Ultron from Voightlander). Don't know about the 28mm zeiss Biogon...

[Dannybuoy]

I've gone the 50 Nokton route. I liked it but it was big and heavy. The screws around the barrel would loosen regularly. It rattled a bit when they're loose. The soft look was fine for portraits but lacked the tack sharp look I was after for other styles of shooting. I was basically hankering after a Leica; namely a Summilux Asph. I traded in a heap of my Leica gear for the Lux and haven't looked back. The Nokton felt like a toy lens in comparison. Absolutely no regrets getting the Leica and have no 'upgrade' plans. The Nocti doesn't interest me. Depends on your budget, but go for the best you can afford. I've learnt this the hard way many times. My mantra is 'buy cheap and you'll buy twice'. This is very much applicable in Leica land :-) Good luck deciding.

[Ecar]

I've gone the 50 Nokton route. I liked it but it was big and heavy. The screws around the barrel would loosen regularly. It rattled a bit when they're loose. The soft look was fine for portraits but lacked the tack sharp look I was after for other styles of shooting. I was basically hankering after a Leica; namely a Summilux Asph. I traded in a heap of my Leica gear for the Lux and haven't looked back. The Nokton felt like a toy lens in comparison. Absolutely no regrets getting the Leica and have no 'upgrade' plans. The Nocti doesn't interest me. Depends on your budget, but go for the best you can afford. I've learnt this the hard way many times. My mantra is 'buy cheap and you'll buy twice'. This is very much applicable in Leica land :-) Good luck deciding.

 

Are we talking about the same Nokton 50/1.5 here?

I think the OP may have the latest version in mind (the modern replica in M mount of the Prominent version). I have the chrome one and it doesn't feel like a toy lens at all...

That being said, the Summilux IQ is indeed a notch or two above - but so is also its price, which I understand is the reason why the OP isn't considering it.

[jankap]

+1, dannybuoy

I bought a used Lux.

Jan

[Guest Marc G.]

I would consider the 50 Summarit instead of the 50 Summicron and add a Zeiss Planar. These are the reasonable choices (together with the new 50 Nokton). Given all 3 lenses (and having shot with 2 of them) I would take the Summarit any day. YMMV

[Stealth3kpl]

I own the 15/4.5 and 25/4 color skopar which I use on my gxr. They're fine lenses. In the past I've owned the 35/2.5 and the 35/1.2. When it comes down to it I enjoy the feel and look of the Leica lenses. If I didn't own the 50 summicron I would consider the zeiss. However, I believe the summicron is lighter and smaller than the zeiss. Ergonomically, I can focus my summicron with the side of one finger as it's smooth as butter. I like the look of the voigt 50/1.5, and considered it to replace my 50 lux asph, but I suspect I'll miss my lux. I don't feel I need to be looking over my shoulder at the various offerings from voigt and zeiss.

Pete

[sfage]

Thank you very much for the input, CaptZoom.

 

The Zeiss 50mm Planar also looks interesting, but it doesn't have the rendering of the Nokton from the tests I've seen.

Regarding the sizes, the Nokton and the Summicron should be about the same size... 2.1" x 1.8" (Nokton) vs. 2.1" x 1.7" (summicron).... Do they feel much different in terms of size?

 

The fact that the sub 1k Nokton is "almost" as sharp as the 4k lux just makes the Nokton more tempting.

 

PS. I agree - 2195 USD for an f2.8 28mm lens is not cheap. But the small size makes it really tempting (does not block the viewfinder like the 28mm Ultron from Voightlander). Don't know about the 28mm zeiss Biogon...

 

You might check out my thread in R lenses. I have a field test with a 50 cron R and a Rollie 50 planar. Personally, I think the Planar wins.

[TomB_tx]

I have the LTM version of the CV 1.5, as well as the current Summicron and Planar 50s. I'd rate them basically equivalent optically, with different strong points. I use the Summicron most on my M9, but the Nokton on my M5, where the extra size balances well. I like the Planar in tricky lighting situations where flare may be an issue with the others.

You should be happy with any one of them - too much comparing just leads to empty bank accounts.

[BerndReini]

From what I've seen in on the web, the Nokton's pronounced purple fringing would drive me nuts in everyday situations for color photography. Go with a summicron or a Zeiss f2.

[CaptZoom]

Dude, fixing purple fringing takes one click (occasionally the use of a slider).

 

As you know, the internet reports tend to exaggerate (though not willfully). Getting a lens to show fringing, the lens fringing in typical use (different for each photographer), and how often the lens shows fringing are three separate things.

 

Regardless, to each his own.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[TomB_tx]

On the issue of fringing, here's a quick comparison of my 2012 Summicron, Zeiss Planar ZM, and LTM Nokton 1.5 of a lamp that always excites fringing on its bright "portholes." These are all at f2.0 - handheld across a dim room.

Summicron at f2.0:

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

Then the Planar at f2.0:

 

And the LTM Nokton at f2.0:

 

Then finally the Nokton at f1.5, which is not fair comparison because the other lenses can't even open to 1.5:

[Dannybuoy]

Good one Jan. I think the used Lux will do you proud. Is it the Asph version?

 

I'm not knocking CV lenses at all. I own the 15mm 4.5 and just bought a used 35 1.4 SC. I own a 35 Cron Asph so some might think I'm mad for buying a 35 Nokton. I love the Cron but it's a bit too clinical for some of the shots I take. I want a little more light and some soft, classic look too. It was also a bargain so why not :-)

 

Enjoy it