M7 DX reader

[MachineGun]

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Hi

I have been looking online for a M7 to possibly buy.

How can I tell which DX reader the camera has if it is not stated?

Is it possible to tell by looking at the camera?

What is the difference?

Thanks

MachineGun

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[doubice]

The only way to tell is if you can peak into the film cassette compartment of the camera - there is no other way. The older DX reader has metal, spring loaded pins that make it somewhat difficult to remove the cassette.

 

The optical reader is exactly that - an optical reader which barely, if at all, touches the film cassette.

 

I would not worry about which reader the camera has; the last time I checked, Leica was offering the exchange for the optical reader at N/C. My M7 went to new Jersey who shipped it to Solms - this would have been about 2 years ago. Total time involved about 2 - 3 months if memory serves me right.

 

Cheers,

 

Jan

[piblondin]

The only way to tell is if you can peak into the film cassette compartment of the camera - there is no other way. The older DX reader has metal, spring loaded pins that make it somewhat difficult to remove the cassette.

 

The optical reader is exactly that - an optical reader which barely, if at all, touches the film cassette.

 

I would not worry about which reader the camera has; the last time I checked, Leica was offering the exchange for the optical reader at N/C. My M7 went to new Jersey who shipped it to Solms - this would have been about 2 years ago. Total time involved about 2 - 3 months if memory serves me right.

 

Cheers,

 

Jan

 

 

Two or three months without your camera--mine took 2.5 months--is not insignificant. I would totally factor the optical reader or lack thereof into my willingness to pay for a used M7.

[andybarton]

If you have the reader changed, Leica will check your camera over at the same time.

 

The optical reader is not without its faults or issues, especially if you like to set your ISO manually, which will leave an LED flashing in the viewfinder. This may or not be an issue for you.

[erl]

My M7 still has its original spring loaded reader. Never had a moments problem with it. My POV is "if it aint broke, don't fix it!" Especially if it means 'losing' it for 3 months.

 

Wait until you have a problem, which may never happen.

[thrid]

My M7 still has its original spring loaded reader. Never had a moments problem with it. My POV is "if it aint broke, don't fix it!" Especially if it means 'losing' it for 3 months.

 

Wait until you have a problem, which may never happen.

 

Same here. I have an early M7 (circa 2006), also with the spring loaded reader. I've put hundreds of rolls through it without a hitch. I've also never had a problem with the reader giving erroneous DX readings.

 

Yes, the cartridge will no longer just drop out entirely on it's own, but we are talking about having to expend an effort of a trivial amount more to retrieve it.

[erl]

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Also, when in precarious situations (I do go there) I really don't want the precious exposed film just 'dropping out' if my hands are otherwise engaged.

Reloading the M7 in 'Neptune's Window' down in Antarctica comes to mind.

[aballard]

Just went through this process in buying a new to me M7. I learned that you can see the physical difference between the two dx readers if you peer (did this on ebay pictures) into the cartridge loading chamber and see that the readers either protrude a bit into the chamber or are flat (optical) After awhile it's easy to see the difference although the number of these little pieces of metal on the side of the chamber seems similiar in number.

I ended up buying one with a number in the 33200...numbers. I'm not sure of the year, maybe someone else knows as these numbers seem almost to be a mystery requiring extended google searches. I'm guessing it was around 2009 or so. Hope this helps.

[Cedric Agie de Selsaeten]

Just went through this process in buying a new to me M7. I learned that you can see the physical difference between the two dx readers if you peer (did this on ebay pictures) into the cartridge loading chamber and see that the readers either protrude a bit into the chamber or are flat (optical) After awhile it's easy to see the difference although the number of these little pieces of metal on the side of the chamber seems similiar in number.

I ended up buying one with a number in the 33200...numbers. I'm not sure of the year, maybe someone else knows as these numbers seem almost to be a mystery requiring extended google searches. I'm guessing it was around 2009 or so. Hope this helps.

 

The M-7 I bought is of the second type. i.e. with Infra Red Led DX readers. The two R-8s I bought have the electrical (golded) contact DX reading systhem as with the first M-7 issue.I don't like nor do I trust so called automatic DX ISO settings, be it with contacts covered with gold or IR Leds. Some say the IR leds can fog IR sensitive films. Another thing I dislike is that all these changes make it impossible the use the former Leitz full metal Leitz cassettes of wich I have quite al ot. They are verry usefull f.ex with 100 ft bulk film etc.

Regards & good luck.

Cedric

[erl]

The M-7 I bought is of the second type. i.e. with Infra Red Led DX readers. The two R-8s I bought have the electrical (golded) contact DX reading systhem as with the first M-7 issue.I don't like nor do I trust so called automatic DX ISO settings, be it with contacts covered with gold or IR Leds. Some say the IR leds can fog IR sensitive films. Another thing I dislike is that all these changes make it impossible the use the former Leitz full metal Leitz cassettes of wich I have quite al ot. They are verry usefull f.ex with 100 ft bulk film etc.

Regards & good luck.

Cedric

Both my R8 and M7 have the gold contacts for DX reading. Over I dont know how many years or 1000's of ft of film, not a problem. I use both pre packaed and bulk film. If you dont like DX codes, set ISO manually. Its easy. Your metal reloadables should work manually.

[MachineGun]

If you have the reader changed, Leica will check your camera over at the same time.

 

The optical reader is not without its faults or issues, especially if you like to set your ISO manually, which will leave an LED flashing in the viewfinder. This may or not be an issue for you.

 

 

Well I have decided that I would rather have a Leica MP that the M7 and I am looking to find a reasonably priced one.

Thanks to all for the help.

MachineGun

[MachineGun]

Well I have decided that I would rather have a Leica MP that the M7 and I am looking to find a reasonably priced one.

Thanks to all for the help.

MachineGun

 

Can anyone tell me what year did the MP change the film speed dial to include both ASA and DIN numbers?

Thanks

MachineGun

[chris_livsey]

Both my R8 and M7 have the gold contacts for DX reading. Over I dont know how many years or 1000's of ft of film, not a problem. I use both pre packaed and bulk film. If you dont like DX codes, set ISO manually. Its easy. Your metal reloadables should work manually.

 

Just browsing and came across this. The earlier poster referred to "Leitz full metal Leitz cassettes" these , code IXMOO, will definitely not work in the M7 or the MP the film chamber is insufficiently large to accommodate them. Setting the speed manually is not relevant. The later M6 baseplate also does not have the required opening mechanism but that can be swopped from an earlier M body and they will then work.

[erl]

Just browsing and came across this. The earlier poster referred to "Leitz full metal Leitz cassettes" these , code IXMOO, will definitely not work in the M7 or the MP the film chamber is insufficiently large to accommodate them. Setting the speed manually is not relevant. The later M6 baseplate also does not have the required opening mechanism but that can be swopped from an earlier M body and they will then work.

Thanks Chris.

I was not aware that the Leitz metal cassettes were even coded. That alone should not stop them working, but the fact you raise about their size is the 'stopper'.

 

I an wondering why they were not made to a 'standard' size.

[chris_livsey]

Thanks Chris.

I was not aware that the Leitz metal cassettes were even coded..

 

They are not coded, but I suppose you could fit the sticky bar codes you can buy but that is no use because of the physical size issue.

 

That alone should not stop them working, but the fact you raise about their size is the 'stopper'.

I an wondering why they were not made to a 'standard' size.

 

The cassettes were to a standard size. The screw series used a metal cassette called a FILCA (Model that will not fit the M series. The M series IXMOO is backwards compatible and will fit both M and LTM cameras. The difference is around 2.2mm. That is why a commercial cassette will fit a LTM but will not be perfectly aligned, this can be "fixed" by using a spacing washer.

 

The non-standard size is the M7 chassis not the IXMOO cassette !!!

 

To accommodate the DX code reader they reduced the size of the chamber. Commercial cassettes of course will fit, but it is tight. Intentionally so, because the early version relied on metal contacts to read the code and with no door to apply pressure it was the fit that ensured contact. With the tolerance of the commercial cassettes there was, politely, poor reliability. They changed to IR readers, thus meaning you can't use IR sensitive film in the M7 !! This increased the reliability. But the reduced space meant the IXMOO was just too large, or actually just about small enough to go in but almost impossible to to get out again without damage to the code readers. The baseplate changed at this time to stop people trying to use an IXMOO it is presumed. The flat locking plate will not open an IXMOO. They made one plate so the M6 later models had it as well even though they could take an IXMOO.

 

The MP has the same shell as the M7 so the reduced space for the DX reader is there but not used. The MP will therefore also not fit the IXMOO but will shoot IR film.

 

(Pedantically I should say the M7 will shoot IR film, but it will be fogged !)

 

Nikon did something similar. The Nikon rangefinder also had a re-usable cassette, if you think IXMOO's are in short supply try finding some of those, this was also compatible with the Nikon F SLR. The F2 however was physically different and required a "new" cassette which only fits the F2. The F3 onwards will not accept either.

 

Robot, Zeiss and Canon and no doubt others made re-loadable cassettes as well, and a Birmingham company (UK) made a universal cassette, the Shirley Wellard. Anecdotally because they were based in the Shirley district and it was "well 'ard" to design.

 

For completeness I should add the "Reporter" 250 exposure cassette KOOBF and the very early Type D or IA coded KASAM. The KASAM requires a different base plate again which will not open a FILCA, this was for the very early LTM.

 

The KOOBF needed a different leader template ANZOO than the well known ABLON.

[andybarton]

Tell us something we DON'T know Chris

 

That's a very comprehensive answer. Thanks.

[chris_livsey]

Tell us something we DON'T know Chris

 

That's a very comprehensive answer. Thanks.

 

Can we discuss 35mm film perforation sizes and shapes next? Can Arriflex modify a 3 perf camera to 2 perf ? Or shall we move on

 

BTW the perfs do make a difference of you shoot movie film in a motor drive body, sometimes.

 

I'm off to mx some Beutler now

[erl]

Tell us something we DON'T know Chris

 

That's a very comprehensive answer. Thanks.

Well, I didn't know ANY of that!

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[andybarton]

Me neither. I was kidding

[chris_livsey]

http://www.panavision.com/sites/default/files/2Perf%20Explained.pdf

 

Rather than disappoint I have added a link, "The Good the Bad and the Ugly" was shot in 2 perf. Some movie cameras can be changed from 2 to 3, and back.