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convince me to buy the Dlux6


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I shall say this quickly: does anyone have anything more than subjective opinion in this whole matter? Are those that feel that they are 100% the same have some insider information? Because the anecdotal evidence that I have seen would say that something is different in image quality. We've heard different computer processing, different lens tolerances, etc. But panasonic labeled camera's images don't seem to have the color definition and overall character of the Leicas. Until the personnel from the Panasonic plant wade into the fray, this is just a "taste great, less filling" argument.

 

OK look at it this way. What you're saying is that Panasonic (who manufacture the Leica) make their branded cameras a bit, well, crappy, just on purpose. They somehow make the lens (the same lens that is) less well, they screw up the in camera jpeg processing, and they make their camera a bit shit for what purpose?

 

Now, if you can post some info from Leica or Panasonic to substantiate your claims I'm happy to listen.

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Guest D-Lux 6

"rolleyes"...nice

Well, as far as the lens issue is concerned, those are manufactured by Leica, not Panasonic. In an armory, the armorers will select certain rifles to be set aside because they simply produce tighter groups (greater accuracy) than others of the EXACT same make, model, and even lot numbers. When dealing with manufactured goods, particularly lenses, some items come out to tighter tolerances. Who's to say that better lenses aren't reserved for Leica branded cameras. As far as Panasonic supposedly making their products inferior, which considering even if it's true, they're still subtle differences we are talking about--nothing more is being claimed. Perhaps that's part of their multi-million dollar agreement to produce cameras under Leica's name, giving the better brand an ever-so-slight advantage.

Now, I've admitted all along that I don't have evidence, other than actually looking at images, which I'll admit is subjective. I've been asking if there is anyone tied to the industry that can provide this, not peanut-gallery anecdotes. By that token, you have absolutely zero proof that I'm wrong, but yet challenge me to produce the evidence: something greater than your fluffy opinion; the burden of proof was placed on you long ago. When you show us the evidence that there is absolute zero difference, then I'LL listen. In the mean time, you're Panasonic users gluing red dots to their cameras and claiming that it is the exact same thing.

Edited by D-Lux 6
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In the absence of facts real discussions become difficult.

 

While it's conceivable that the products differ, most people who are in any position to tell say that they do not.

 

Why don't you compare the cameras themselves instead of opinions about the cameras?

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Well, as far as the lens issue is concerned, those are manufactured by Leica, not Panasonic.

 

The lens is NOT made by Leica. These cameras are wholly produced by Panasonic.

 

Your wrong on that point for starters, as well as the other points you make. But if you really want to convince yourself that you're right, then go ahead. I don't understand why you have a problem accepting that Panasonic make the camera, it doesn't mean it's any less good, but it's no better than the version without the red dot.

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Your wrong on that point for starters, as well as the other points you make. But if you really want to convince yourself that you're right, then go ahead. I don't understand why you have a problem accepting that Panasonic make the camera, it doesn't mean it's any less good, but it's no better than the version without the red dot.

 

FWIW, there was a time I owned both a Leica D-Lux 5 and its Panasonic equivalent. Got the latter for my son who did not take to photography much. The ONLY difference I could tell between the two was that the Leica looked better [with or without the damned red spot:-)]. I eventually gave the Panasonic away to a nephew who enjoys it and produces wonderful pictures.

 

- Vikas

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volskwagen es audi ? un golf gti es igual a un A3 ? ... misma plataforma , mismo motor pero no mismo carro , la misma odiosa comparación para lumix/leica o leicasonic , compré la leica , diferente baño antirreflex en el cristal , ..." lumix no es lo mismo pero es igual "... y más barato ...

 

I'd venture that the GTI is a better car than the A3. But this has nothing to do with the DLux 6....

:cool:

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This is fascinating to watch. You'll be telling us next that the D-Lux is hand-finished in Solms... It's badge-engineering, nothing more. You have been told the actual "differences" - none of them optical- or performance-related - and still you persist.

 

Believe what you want, it does not change reality one jot or iota. But ask yourself this... What motivation do you think those disagreeing with you have? You have already accused people of being "Leica haters" because they do not agree with you. Can "Panasonic shills" be far behind?

 

Really? :rolleyes:

 

Regards,

 

Bill

 

Sent from another Galaxy

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I can't see what the real life differences are, and I've looked. Personally, I have no issue w/ Panasonics and currently shoot w/ a GX-1 and the two Panasonic-made Leica lenses (45mm & 25mm). Both fine lenses, altho physically less robust than Leica-made Leica glass. When I went off to buy the D-Lux 6/LX7, I figured the software was valuable to me, so Points+ to the Leica. I was able to find a pristine (all documentation, original box, even warrantee stuff) D-Lux 6 and didn't pay full retail. If I hadn't found that deal, I would have had no hesitation in buying the Panasonic (even if it looks less cool); money is still money, after all. Both equally fine cameras for my purposes, tho.

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...The Leica Dlux6 and it's Panasonic sibling are made by the same people in the same factory from the same components (inside) including the same sensor, same lens. The Leica has a slightly different body style and comes with a better 'pack' i.e. post processing software, warranty.

 

If you use both versions together you won't be able to see any difference in the quality of the results. Why should you?....

 

As far as I understand, the in-camera software used in the leica version is different. This will only show if you compare jpgs of panasonic and leica. RAW shooters shouldn't see any difference in image quality.

 

So those who claim that the leica gives better results most probably don't shoot RAW.

 

This is another myth. They're the same.

 

 

this debate always seems to raise so much emotion :p, why?

Hi James, I believe you're wrong about the jpg in camera processing being a myth.

here is my take on this subject...

(but i think people should just choose what makes them happy and accept other peoples findings and therefore choices, without getting arrogant and personal).

 

I have written this elsewhere on this topic.

I have owned 4 D-Lux 5's and 1 D-Lux 6.

I have not owned a LX5 or LX7.

I shoot jpg and raw. I shoot many pics and I do not want to spend my time processing every photo I shoot, but want to enjoy each to a suitable level. therefore jpg's are important to me.

 

I did not have the benefit of having both cameras handy to do a true A for A comparison so I found the next best thing was to look at around 200 photos of each in flickr (therefore different shooters, different conditions, different subject matter), but given the number of pics looked at I felt the findings to be conclusive.

I found the leica pics to have a better colour rendition. I also find the leica produced pics to look more 3-dimensional, maybe due to better edge detail/different NR? ...I don't know.

I even tapped into the D-Lux6/LX7 group, and looked at many photo's whilst intentionally not looking across the right hand side to see if the pic had been shot with a leica or panny. The pics are presented randomly. Around 90% of the time I guessed correctly if it was a leica or a panny doing the shooting. So as far as I was concerned, a conclusion could be drawn.

Given as previously mentioned, jpg's are just as important to me as raw, this was an important finding.

This combined with longer warranty, better resale and the fact I also did not have Lightroom, and also most importantly that I could buy the D-Lux 5 at a far reduced price (only $200 over the panny and $250 less than the D-Lux 6) made me settle on the D-Lux 5.

I also believe the D-Lux 5 to be superior to the D-Lux 6 with image quality (not video) but that's another debate altogether, which is why I recently reverted back from the D-Lux 6 back to a new D-Lux 5.

At rrp, the D-Lux 6 being double the LX7, I think I would be line ball with which to choose.

My recommendation to anyone deciding between the two, would be to weigh up the greater warranty, resale, better jpg processing, Lightroom, but higher cost balance - and make their own decision accordingly.

...but I can personally see a difference between the two in jpg's.

 

Quickly, as to the Sony RX100...

it shoots beautifully, but doesn't have the same macro capability as the leica/panny's nor the fuji X100/200, which is very important to me. Also the Sony feels somewhat too iphone like in the hand for my liking compared to the leica/panny, which feels more tangible in the hand but not quite up to the level of the fuji's.

 

just my 2c ! :)

 

roger anthony

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I started this thread so I better weigh back in.Two weeks ago,I went for the Leica ,purely for the nice industrial deign. With my eyes wide open.... Panasonic electronics ...Leica "designed" lens ......cool sleek camera body. Yep I went for the pretty face. I didn't even question the the salesman at the Leica Store who told me Leica "tweaks" the firmware....for the "Leica Look" True or not it wouldn't be a leap to expect Leica to have some design input.Who cares the photos are great and its and easy to use. It's not the first time I payed more for great aesthetics. Oh I almost forgot I also bought the Panasonic LVF2

Thanks to everyone for all your help

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ECohen,

 

I don't think you will regret your choice for a moment. I really enjoyed my 5 and expect to use my 6 quite a bit now that the weather is changing and it will become a pocket cam carried on a motorcycle on days I don't ride the bagger.

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I started this thread so I better weigh back in.Two weeks ago,I went for the Leica ,purely for the nice industrial deign. With my eyes wide open.... Panasonic electronics ...Leica "designed" lens ......cool sleek camera body. Yep I went for the pretty face. I didn't even question the the salesman at the Leica Store who told me Leica "tweaks" the firmware....for the "Leica Look" True or not it wouldn't be a leap to expect Leica to have some design input.Who cares the photos are great and its and easy to use. It's not the first time I payed more for great aesthetics. Oh I almost forgot I also bought the Panasonic LVF2

Thanks to everyone for all your help

 

ECohen, good choice! You are going to enjoy this camera immensely. Nothing wrong with having a pretty face around. Congrats!

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It is a little the same type of debate that there was between Leica Digilux 2 and Panasonic LC1 on a topic in this same forum.

 

Leica and Panasonic have had a partnership and manufacture for several years of the identical devices. They differ between them by their appearance but the interior is the same one and the manufacturing is entrusted to Panasonic.

 

Un very significant testimony on the two above-named devices is besides here :

 

Leica Digilux 2 / Panasonic DMC LC1 - Tete-a-Tete — Motorsports Photography by Motorsports Photographer John Thawley | American Le Mans, Grand Am, Indy Car, Trans Am

 

As you can note it, the images are nearly identical and I wonder even if there exist really determining differences…

 

Guy

Edited by Guytou
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