M6 Hard rewinding the film

[myshkine]

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I've had my M6TTL for three years now, but the rewind process is getting more and more difficult. Never had problems until the last couple of rolls. Turning the rewind knob is difficult, and I must apply a good deal of force to complete the operation. Maybe I am not inserting the cassette far enough in the body when I load? Thanks for any ideas or suggestions.

[andybarton]

Time for a CLA, methinks...

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[Michael Geschlecht]

Hello Sebastiano,

 

Andy may well be right but I have a few questions:

 

When you are loading the camera do you push the cartridge in on the left & the film into the takeup spool on the right until you can see the film properly aligned along the guide rail where it will be w/ the back closed?

 

Do you begin winding by partially advancing the film & then, when you see it is engaging & moving properly, stop winding & turn the rewind knob to pick up any slack until you feel some, not a lot of, resistance?

 

After completing winding twice:

 

Do you pick up any remaining slack w/ the rewind before firing the second blank?

 

Don't try to get "1 last shot" when the tension increases @ the end of the roll.

 

When rewinding is the additional tension throughout the roll or just @ the end before the film disengages?

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael

[CalArts 99]

This is somewhat common and there are several washes under the crank that can cause issues. In particular there's a slotted washer between the camera and the crank that can come loose after long periods of use (in between CLAs.) Also the washers can get deformed over time making it difficult to rewind.

 

When was the camera last serviced? As already mentioned, get a CLA done if you haven't recently. And if you have, take if back to the technician and have them fix it. The issue is pretty straightforward to fix. You can DIY by unscrewing the crank and removing the washers and then just replacing them again (there are several and you need to replace them exactly as they were originally.) That can fix it for a while.

[myshkine]

Hello Sebastiano,

 

Andy may well be right but I have a few questions:

 

When you are loading the camera do you push the cartridge in on the left & the film into the takeup spool on the right until you can see the film properly aligned along the guide rail where it will be w/ the back closed?

 

Do you begin winding by partially advancing the film & then, when you see it is engaging & moving properly, stop winding & turn the rewind knob to pick up any slack until you feel some, not a lot of, resistance?

 

After completing winding twice:

 

Do you pick up any remaining slack w/ the rewind before firing the second blank?

 

Don't try to get "1 last shot" when the tension increases @ the end of the roll.

 

When rewinding is the additional tension throughout the roll or just @ the end before the film disengages?

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael

 

Thank you for your replies. I don't know if the camera got any CLA before I purchased it, so maybe it is time for a cleanup after all.

Michael, yes to first question, no to the second. And I normally do not try to get one last shot. As soon as I feel the tension, I release and rewind.

The tension is throughout the roll, not just at the end, as it would normally be.

One thing is that I insert the cassette and the film in the takeup spool and immediately close the cover. Only at this point I fire the shutter twice and advance twice to make sure the film has been properly inserted. I normally, two or three times during the roll, turn the rewind knob to pick up any slack.

Edited October 27, 2012 by myshkine

[Guest J-C]

Sorry to tell you that I had the same problems when I purchased my M6 when it was launched, in '84 if my memory serves me right. The CS never got it right, so I sold the M6 and was angry with Leica. Until I got my M9-P half a year ago.

[CalArts 99]

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Sorry to tell you that I had the same problems when I purchased my M6 when it was launched, in '84 if my memory serves me right. The CS never got it right, so I sold the M6 and was angry with Leica. Until I got my M9-P half a year ago.

 

Except that it's hard to put film into the M9-P.

 

But seriously, these rewind issues are common issues and can be fixed quickly by any good Leica tech. It's an issue that started with the M4. I'm sorry to hear that a Leica tech couldn't fix it, that's very odd since it's such an easy repair.

 

To the OP, here's a DIY you can attempt (otherwise just give it to a skilled Leica tech and get it straightened out; they do this sort of repair all the time and it's not expensive to do.) http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107289

[myshkine]

Except that it's hard to put film into the M9-P.

 

But seriously, these rewind issues are common issues and can be fixed quickly by any good Leica tech. It's an issue that started with the M4. I'm sorry to hear that a Leica tech couldn't fix it, that's very odd since it's such an easy repair.

 

To the OP, here's a DIY you can attempt (otherwise just give it to a skilled Leica tech and get it straightened out; they do this sort of repair all the time and it's not expensive to do.) http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107289

 

Thanks very much. I will get a CLA after all, so maybe I will also upgrade to the MP viewfinder that apparently is better than the M6.

[myshkine]

Thanks very much. I will get a CLA after all, so maybe I will also upgrade to the MP viewfinder that apparently is better than the M6.

 

I also read the procedure suggested in RFF, looks pretty easy, but I'm not much good at DIY reparations, so I'll go for a CLA at Solms. The Leica shop here has promised it won't be too long. Thanks to all.

[too old to care]

I bought my M6 new late 90's and it has always been hard to rewind. I assumed that it was due to the angle of the rewind knob. Sure would like to have it work better, but it has never been abused or out in the elements much, so I do not think the washers are the cause. I just take my time when rewinding it. But even my ancient Pentax rewinds better.

 

Wayne

[iphoenix]

Just a question. Is the problem due to high usage, low usage, or doesn't it matter?

[philipus]

And to add to iphoenix's question, is there a difference in the wear and tear between the M6 rewind crank and the M3 rewind knob?

 

Personally I would have thought the crank would wear more because it allows greater torque, if that's the word.

[too old to care]

My M6TTL was very hard to rewind when it was new, today it is better after 15 years of use, but still not what I would call easy. I cannot use the little knob, I must rely on putting my thumb on the lever itself. It has never failed me though, never broke the film or stripped the sprocket holes. Winding it is very easy though, so it must be the friction of the tulip causing the problem on rewind.

 

Wayne

[sblitz]

i find my m4 can be hard at times and not at others, beginning to think it has more to do with the manufacture of the film cassette. in any event, my old canon tl and my canon f1 (new version) were always a lot shoother. not exactly sure why the m4 is so tough, but it had a full fledged cla by leica before purchase. just the design i guess.

[myshkine]

It is possible that it is the M6 design, but in my case the rewind process was normally very smooth, it just got harder suddenly, so there must be something wrong.

[too old to care]

From that, I would say you have a problem with the washers under the knob. There is a video someplace on youtube on how to remove the knob (from a M7 I believe). The written instructions I have also seen look simple. But, if your camera is very old, a good CLA may be in order. Mine has never been touched, but it too will go in someday for its 10,000 mile (roll) checkup.

 

Wayne