Old Shuttercrack Posted March 4, 2007 Share #41 Posted March 4, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Here is my setup, a Xenar 4,5/135 on a Novoflex Bellows with Pistol grip and a Visoflex III: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/17734-visoflex-65mm-m8/?do=findComment&comment=189576'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 4, 2007 Posted March 4, 2007 Hi Old Shuttercrack, Take a look here Visoflex + 65mm + M8. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
geoffreyg Posted March 4, 2007 Share #42 Posted March 4, 2007 This is kind of neat. We buy a state of the art camera with retro feel, and find ourselves hunting for 1960's gear to take macro shots that are better done with newer stuff but isn't as much fun. That's clear enough. So if we want macro, and the M8, its either the new 90 or the Visoflex. So my contribution will be a report on the Summicron DR as another low-budget way to get a bit closer. Saved me having to buy a 'lux, for a lens I won't use that much. But is 20" close enough? Maybe. And those "eyes" just clip on and off. Might even be practical. Or maybe not! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rona!d Posted March 4, 2007 Share #43 Posted March 4, 2007 My today´s evening-picture and two crops of it. (Very poor evening light + cloudy). With #16464 (OTZFO) focus-mount/2x #16471 extensions/TE 135, at ISO 640 Not too bad for a +40 years old lens ... Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/17734-visoflex-65mm-m8/?do=findComment&comment=189778'>More sharing options...
waterlenz Posted March 4, 2007 Share #44 Posted March 4, 2007 This is kind of neat. We buy a state of the art camera with retro feel, and find ourselves hunting for 1960's gear to take macro shots that are better done with newer stuff but isn't as much fun. That's clear enough. So if we want macro, and the M8, its either the new 90 or the Visoflex. So my contribution will be a report on the Summicron DR as another low-budget way to get a bit closer. Saved me having to buy a 'lux, for a lens I won't use that much. But is 20" close enough? Maybe. And those "eyes" just clip on and off. Might even be practical. Or maybe not! The dual-range will not work on an M8!!!! I have one and won't even try as it could damage the camera - too bad. Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted March 4, 2007 Share #45 Posted March 4, 2007 Now that is amazing Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_brown Posted March 5, 2007 Share #46 Posted March 5, 2007 The 50mm Dual Range will work on the M8, but only in the close-up range. Closest focusing distance is about 17", where it covers about 6 x 9". Farthest distance is about 38". It will not function outside this range! Mounting and unmounting this lens is tricky so proceed at your own risk! Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/17734-visoflex-65mm-m8/?do=findComment&comment=190159'>More sharing options...
hankg Posted March 5, 2007 Author Share #47 Posted March 5, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) One more question. I believe the later 65's take Series 6 filters. Is there a slight step down (or up) ring that will get you to an available 486 IR cut filter size? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted March 6, 2007 Share #48 Posted March 6, 2007 Well my dealer just e-mailed me and he got it to work on the M8 with a 90 apo at 4 and 12 inches. he played with it all day. LOL I bought it for 225.00 This should be fun Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffreyg Posted March 6, 2007 Share #49 Posted March 6, 2007 Thanks all for the heads up on the 50 DR. I called Tamarkin, and after we both wondered how that could be, they opened up the shipping package, put the DR on an M8 and we both were amazed - no infinity focus. Back to the drawing board - now the 40 CV is looking appealing - f 1.4, focus to 27", and small, light and cheap. Hmmm. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted March 6, 2007 Share #50 Posted March 6, 2007 Dietmar, is that a Visoflex III with a Bellows I? On the subject of lens choice, it appears that any M-mount lens will fit, so now my question is why you would use a special lens for macro shots, if you don't need more than the 1:2 a 50mm will get you, for example? Personally I don't have a need the flatness of field, and my 50 Lux Asph seems to do well in the almost-none tests I have done. I am also curious which of the Visoflex telephoto lenses are really good? Can you mount R lenses on the Visoflex? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael M. Posted March 6, 2007 Share #51 Posted March 6, 2007 According to Leica-Users target ("always try to get best") why not looking to "real" macro-stuff? Including usage of viso and bellow. Play with all the "macro" techniques as they are (some at least): General: As normal optic isn't designed to cover "macro" (1:1 or higher) I have to look for technical wise better fitting concepts: 1.) New 1,4/50 asph. supporting "floating elements" ist a little moving towards to close up (but not that much). Don't expect "macro wonders" by this. Anyhow as new lenses supporting lower optical distortion level (higher class failures) compared to the older ones, use the latest version available. 2.) Using a reverse adaptor to put "standard lens" frontglass towards sensor is much better solution for 1:1 and higher. Because you invert also optical calculation of the lens by this. 35mm WA even better in this compared to standard. It will increase ratio by lower focal distance. 3.) Using the new 90mm macro - but it's not designed for "much above 1:1" in standard mode. 4.) Usage of "real" macro-lenses like "Photar-" "Luminar-" or "M-Compon" Series for ratio =>> 1:1 5.) There is also an other old idea to step into 'macro' using 2 different standard foto lenses (~ 90mm/35mm) coupled face to face. But as much more glas - much more distortion ... From my macro history I prefere 2.) and 4.) What is your favourite? Any other ideas? Think also that macro on M8 will show also a not known disadvantage of the new Leica lense generation: In our days lens show higher quality if f-stop is open (1.4) compared to f-stop closed. This was little different in past And as you need to close f-stop for enlarging depth of focus as much as possible ... Michael Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted March 6, 2007 Share #52 Posted March 6, 2007 What are the options for high-quality real macro lenses on the M8 with the bellows? I don't even know where to start looking for that kind of information. What enlargement would the 90/4 Macro give directly on the Visoflex III with an M8? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted March 6, 2007 Share #53 Posted March 6, 2007 I'm wondering about the 90macro also Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael M. Posted March 6, 2007 Share #54 Posted March 6, 2007 What are the options for high-quality real macro lenses on the M8 with the bellows? I don't even know where to start looking for that kind of information. What enlargement would the 90/4 Macro give directly on the Visoflex III with an M8? Hopefully understand correct about your comment Significant posive options: - "Abbildungsmassstab" (sorry ???) much more larger then 1:1 (up to 1:10 and more) @best optical conditions!!! New 90mm macro goes "only" for 3:1, normal lenses approx. 8:1 or even less (tele) still on reduced performance! - Info about "Magnification optics" available in www / or archive "Photar" > Leica (history) "Luminar" > Carl Zeiss (actual product) "M-Componon" > Schneider-Kreuznach (actual product) Their main target (therefor they are designed and calculated) is to capture to film/sensor an image which is much larger then in reality. Oposite to normal fotography. But that's where real macro starts ... - As f-stop 16 or 22 is "forbidden" on standard lenses if you're looking for maximum sharpness ("Beugungsunschärfe" - sorry once more - will be limiting factor when closing f-stops to enlarge depth of field ), "Lupenobjektive" are already designed to be used with f-stop down to 45 or even 64 with best success in sharpness, contrast and large depth of field (as a physical result of this f-stops) and same time less optical failures). Parameters you will not be able to combine all together to their maximum by using "standard" lenses. As normal lenses are designed to show maximum optical power at infinity ( oo:1) they will get worse at the other end of the range (8:1) or if they are real "macros" it's a little enlarged down to 3:1 at f-stop closed down by (max) 2-3 steps. Vice versa on those "Lupenobjektive" ... Michael Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzav Posted March 6, 2007 Share #55 Posted March 6, 2007 There are many used enlarging lenses of extremely high quality that can be had for a fraction of their original cost thanks to the decrease in darkroom enthusiasm. Lenses such as APO Rodagons and Componons will give any macro lens a run for it's money, and will certainly better any marginal macro or standard lens on a bellows. Most of these lenses are in a Leica thread mount, so a simple Leica thread > M mount adapter is all you need to use these on a Visoflex/bellows setup. Try it, you will be in for a pleasant surprise! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted March 6, 2007 Share #56 Posted March 6, 2007 Ronald, this is interesting. There may be two different versions of the second (!) version mount, that with the fully knurled focusing ring. My lenshead unscrews from a line pretty immediately aft of the aperture ring; this unscrewing lays bare a thread of larger diameter than the one that fits the Universal Focusing Mount, which is further down. On your pictures this joint simply isn't visible! On the other hand, the joint you ARE using IS visible on my lens, but the head doesn't unscrew there. Neither do I! Maybe I should visit a camera mechanic? However this may be, the lenshead focuses to infinity this way too. Sorry I can't post any pictures -- am changing computers. My Tele-Elmar is no. 2420480. The old man with the lens head -- terrible affliction Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted March 6, 2007 Share #57 Posted March 6, 2007 There are many used enlarging lenses of extremely high quality that can be had for a fraction of their original cost thanks to the decrease in darkroom enthusiasm. Lenses such as APO Rodagons and Componons will give any macro lens a run for it's money, and will certainly better any marginal macro or standard lens on a bellows. Most of these lenses are in a Leica thread mount, so a simple Leica thread > M mount adapter is all you need to use these on a Visoflex/bellows setup. Try it, you will be in for a pleasant surprise! Nick, the mechanical fly in the optical ointment is that you will have to work at a fixed reproduction ratio, if you use it directly on a Viso.. A Bellows II, on the other hand, is OK if you have the M39 adapter to go with it. The old man ... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael M. Posted March 6, 2007 Share #58 Posted March 6, 2007 ... Lenses such as APO Rodagons and Componons will give any macro lens a run for it's money, and will certainly better any marginal macro or standard lens on a bellows ... Thats right! If you see the optimum performance spot of those enlarging lenses you will find performance maximum in the range of 10:1 ... 1:1. No need to perform at infinity so, concentrade on small target range. And as this Range is much more limited compared to a standard lens, it is more easy to perform better in the small field of specified usage. But still same story when it comes to real macro (1:1 ... 1:20) Also a Apo-HM-Componon (-S) from Schneider (my personal fafourite for enlarging) will not satisfy at all. It's simply not designed for 1:20. OK, it will still perform better then a S'lux 1,4/50 Asph. but it's basically not perfect at all. So, it's depending on the range you want to cover and in the area short before 1:1 an Enlarging lens may optically be a good solution. But be carefully most enlarging lens offer the feature (in normal use very welcome) of illuminated f-stop figures. And they take out the "lightning power" via some lightpipes direct from picture area inside. If using this lens as taking lense you have to close this channel because light wents also "in" this way in. Michael Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzav Posted March 6, 2007 Share #59 Posted March 6, 2007 No mechanical flys Lars, I only mentioned using it with a Visoflex/bellows combination... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzav Posted March 6, 2007 Share #60 Posted March 6, 2007 Michael, you are absolutely correct! I solved that issue in the past by using a black rubber O-ring that fit snugly over the light pipe aperture facing the rear of the lens. This worked with both APO Rodagons (my preference) and Componons. A faster (although less permanent) solution is simply place a small piece of electrical tape over the aperture. It can then be tested quickly with a flashlight in a darkened room for light leaks. This may give one a final use for the darkroom! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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