Beewacker Posted October 30, 2011 Share #1 Posted October 30, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) My first Leica was an M4P, my second is a M6-TTL, LHSA and I just got my M9-P. I wanted a full frame sensor that promised everything the analog M’s delivered, so I bypassed on the M8’s. I’ve been developing my own film since 1970 and scanning since 1994. Due to space limitations I haven’t been able to continue with gelatin printing for the last 15 years, so I’ve shot and scanned with a Nikon Coolscan or Epson Perfection V750 and printed on an Epson 4000. Something just didn’t seem right about the image quality I was getting with the combination of developing scanning and printing. I was starting to question the Leica Glass. In the back of my mind I always wondered about Nikon or Epson optics and negative curl, but quickly dismissed the idea. That was until last Wednesday when the M9-P arrived. I headed off to Monterey for a test drive and full days shooting along the California Coast and Monterey Aquarium. I won’t bore you with the details, but I took one photo from 60 yards away with my 90mm Elmarit of a group of pelicans on a rock. I was able to blow up the photo to see the pupil in one birds eye. Now that is SHARP Glass! The same holds true for rest of my lenses. My Leica Glass was vindicated. I will always have and use my M6-TTL, just because I enjoy the developing process. If that one photo needs to be scanned for full resolution, then I’ll send it off to West Coast Imaging for one of their killer scan jobs. Meanwhile, I’m not sure I understand what’s the fuss about the M9 vs. M10/11/12. Leica has produced a full frame digital camera capable of equaling or surpassing any one of their film cameras and it’s not good enough? I should wait for the M10? I hope that Leica continues to innovate. Load up the next M with GPS and video, 36mp sensor, autofocus and maybe throw in an espresso maker too. I won’t buy it, but I will continue to support Leica by buying their lenses, as long as they don’t drip the espresso through them! Ron Rowe Walnut Creek, CA Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 30, 2011 Posted October 30, 2011 Hi Beewacker, Take a look here M9, what’s the fuss all about?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
sketchyhead Posted October 30, 2011 Share #2 Posted October 30, 2011 If I had any doubts about buying an M9, those doubts are now dispelled. All I need to do now is raid the piggy bank. A well written and persuasive post. Are you working on commission? Thanks Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted October 30, 2011 Share #3 Posted October 30, 2011 I went through the same stunning experience. Welcome to the world of the M9. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonel Posted October 30, 2011 Share #4 Posted October 30, 2011 Leica has produced a full frame digital camera capable of equaling or surpassing any one of their film cameras indeed! welcome Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wda Posted October 30, 2011 Share #5 Posted October 30, 2011 Nicely expressed Beewacker and welcome to the forum! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted October 30, 2011 Share #6 Posted October 30, 2011 ...and some of us went from long term use of film Ms to the M8.2, and saw no reason to wait for the M9 or beyond. Proof is in the prints. Welcome to the forum. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted October 30, 2011 Share #7 Posted October 30, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I’m not sure I understand what’s the fuss about the M9 vs. M10/11/12. Leica has produced a full frame digital camera capable of equaling or surpassing any one of their film cameras and it’s not good enough? Ron, I happen to agree with you, but for whatever reason, photographic, psychological, or a combination thereof, in the digital photographic marketplace, despite all the excellent arguments as to why the Leica rangefinder ought not be compared to a dSLR, Leica recognizes that to a certain extent they are bound by the rules of the game of marketing cameras in the digital age. Thus their challenge is to produce a camera capable of equaling or surpassing the top-tier of other manufacturers' digital cameras, and not merely to the minority of long-time loyalists to whom all that entails is a Leica engraving. My hope is that one thing Leica does "the old way" that other manufacturers don't, is long-term support for those of us who are happy with the M9 (or M8) and whose priorities don't include dropping $7-8-9-10K on a camera every few years. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpalme Posted October 30, 2011 Share #8 Posted October 30, 2011 Welcome to the forum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted October 31, 2011 Share #9 Posted October 31, 2011 ... My hope is that one thing Leica does "the old way" that other manufacturers don't, is long-term support for those of us who are happy with the M9 (or M8) and whose priorities don't include dropping $7-8-9-10K on a camera every few years. I think Leica has already demonstrated its commitment by releasing a firmware upgrade for the M8 two years after it was discontinued. Ron, Welcome to the forum and thank you for your considered view. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sp12 Posted October 31, 2011 Share #10 Posted October 31, 2011 Welcome to the digital revolution , though admittedly the M8 would've had more resolution than good film if you scanning at home. And the fuss about the M10/11 and such is more about Leica making something better than Canikon/Sony, not just something better than their film Ms. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted October 31, 2011 Share #11 Posted October 31, 2011 I'm certainly glad you're enjoying the M9, I do too. I'd welcome a link to "all the fuss" though, I haven't seen any to be honest. I'm a bit concerned, as always, about the polarising opinion however. I completely agree with you that if Leica added video, GPS and a coffee machine I wouldn't buy it. But you seem pretty intelligent so seriously, why pose such a straw man argument? If perhpas Leica added better high ISO capabilities, larger photosites, an external ISO dial, much longer battery duration and (insert sensible qualitative improvement here) would you then buy it? I know I would. So yeah, it's great, but so will the next one be. Why snipe at those who like to imagine and discuss the next one? There will be a next one, and it will be "better" than this one. To belittle those who acknowledge that seems unnecessary to me. I don't understand it. As a Leica fan, does an appreciation of the past (present) preclude an apprehension about the future? As a photographer does an understanding of the history of the art undermine a desire to create something new? Of course not. Inclusive, not exclusive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
macpants Posted October 31, 2011 Share #12 Posted October 31, 2011 I don't know. I quite fancy the idea of getting a nice hot cup of java out of my camera after having been sat in some inhospitable place for a couple of hours - waiting for the sun to come up..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest glasses Posted October 31, 2011 Share #13 Posted October 31, 2011 Hi Beewacker, Welcome to the forum. Glasses Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double Negative Posted October 31, 2011 Share #14 Posted October 31, 2011 Any doubts about the M system in general are quickly assuaged by a) the experience, and the results. I used to be a honkin' DSLR shooter myself and since getting back into RFs, honestly, I've hardly touched that gear. And this was back in 2008! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted October 31, 2011 Share #15 Posted October 31, 2011 I think Leica has already demonstrated its commitment by releasing a firmware upgrade for the M8 two years after it was discontinued. IIRC that update simply added the newest lens codes, which one might say could have been done to uninhibit M8 owners from purchasing those new lenses. What I'm hoping for is long-term parts and service support for discontinued cameras. It concerns me as to what will happen if my M9 needs some digital part, like a circuit board, chip, even a sensor, down the road a few years from now. Or for that matter even a battery, if the M10 doesn't use the same kind, witness the DMR. I suppose the moral of the story is to shoot the heck out of the M9 and be happy to chuck it when the time comes, and embrace the future. That is the new paradigm of life today after all, isn't it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swamiji Posted October 31, 2011 Share #16 Posted October 31, 2011 I suppose the moral of the story is to shoot the heck out of the M9 and be happy to chuck it when the time comes, and embrace the future. That is the new paradigm of life today after all, isn't it Or buy a second one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted October 31, 2011 Share #17 Posted October 31, 2011 IIRC that update simply added the newest lens codes, which one might say could have been done to uninhibit M8 owners from purchasing those new lenses. What I'm hoping for is long-term parts and service support for discontinued cameras. It concerns me as to what will happen if my M9 needs some digital part, like a circuit board, chip, even a sensor, down the road a few years from now. Or for that matter even a battery, if the M10 doesn't use the same kind, witness the DMR. I suppose the moral of the story is to shoot the heck out of the M9 and be happy to chuck it when the time comes, and embrace the future. That is the new paradigm of life today after all, isn't it The firmware update also rectified freezing when Discreet mode was used with Continuous shooting mode. I think it's a little unfair to beat up Leica on the basis of the unavailabllity of repairs for the DMR when it was Leica's partner company's (Imacon?) purchase by one of Leica's competitor's, Hasselblad, that prevents repairs being offered. Historically Leica has supported repairs for discontinued products; you can still have any of the film M's and lenses repaired by Leica today and most screwmount cameras and lenses. Few other camera companies offer that level of support and commitment. Another good sign is that the M8, and I assume it's the same for the M9, is manufactured from discreet off-the-shelf components thereby reducing its reliance on bespoke products from third parties who can't or won't be able to supply them in the future. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted October 31, 2011 Share #18 Posted October 31, 2011 The firmware update also rectified freezing when Discreet mode was used with Continuous shooting mode. I think it's a little unfair to beat up Leica on the basis of the unavailabllity of repairs for the DMR when it was Leica's partner company's (Imacon?) purchase by one of Leica's competitor's, Hasselblad, that prevents repairs being offered. Historically Leica has supported repairs for discontinued products; you can still have any of the film M's and lenses repaired by Leica today and most screwmount cameras and lenses. Few other camera companies offer that level of support and commitment. Another good sign is that the M8, and I assume it's the same for the M9, is manufactured from discreet off-the-shelf components thereby reducing its reliance on bespoke products from third parties who can't or won't be able to supply them in the future. Pete. I stand corrected about the firmware. I didn't know that. (Had sold my M8 already). I agree with most of what you said, and hope the last paragraph especially is accurate. However I do think it's entirely fair to hold Leica accountable for the outcome of the DMR. There are, TTBOMK, laws in certain countries where the DMR was sold which mandate the availability of parts/repairs for a certain time frame, and I think the DMR still has a few years to go to opt out of that. I think a company relying on partnerships and outsourcing ought to have had a contingency plan, especially for such a pricey item. It's not the case of a sub-$1000 Pana-Leica P&S. We had a prior-generation Volvo S40 which was made entirely by Mitsubishi. AFAIK that partnership was a one-timer and no longer exists; nonetheless those cars are still being serviced at Volvo dealerships, and parts are still available. Maybe not the best example, but the only one I could think of. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darylgo Posted October 31, 2011 Share #19 Posted October 31, 2011 Imagining what a M10 would bring is like imagining unlimited wealth. I shoot my M9 and am amazed at the picture quality, the M10 thoughts then fade away quickly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sblitz Posted October 31, 2011 Share #20 Posted October 31, 2011 i agree completely. my guess is that one will get the biggest jump in quality etc swapping out of the m9 when the m11 is released. between now and whenever i will continue to use and enjoy the m9 without question or compromise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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