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What is the best LTM lens possible?


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In the late 1960s I was working for a camera dealers in Montreal, who were the Leica agent. I remember the Leica salesman coming in and offering to supply to order any of the lenses which were made in Midland in screw mount, at the same cost as the M mount. There weren't many posiibilities though, basically it was the 35mm Summicron (first type) and one or two others (90 Summicron?)

 

Gerry Young

 

Gerry,

 

Just out of interest - does Photokina Technic, Hubert Wokrina, Jürgen Rubi and George Kovacs ring a bell?

___________________________________________________________________________________________

 

As to an LTM digital Leica...... Sorry, that is akin to introducing a Rollei TLR with an APS sensor or a 5 series BMW with a 1960's engine and transmission in it. Just does not make any sense from a user's point, as well as from marketing perspective. Not everybody is a Leica collector awash in LTM lenses and to re-introduce a limited edition LTM series just would not be viable for Leica.

 

I think they have other pressing matters on their plate right now......

 

All the best,

 

Jan

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They couldn't make a IIIg with an M mount without redesigning the body as the lens to film distance is greater than the M cameras.

 

Oh yes, Bryan, they could! How come I know? Because IIIg's with M mount do exist. Leica apparently made a few of those in the late 1950 s. Not many, so they are extremely rare and costly these days, but technically it is no big deal. Just fit an M mount bayonet to the body instead of the screw mount, it will protrude about 1mm more out of the body than the screw mount to accomodate for the different lens to film distance, but that's it.

 

Cheers,

 

Andy

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Because IIIg's with M mount do exist. Leica apparently made a few of those in the late 1950 s. Not many, so they are extremely rare and costly these days, but technically it is no big deal. Just fit an M mount bayonet to the body instead of the screw mount, it will protrude about 1mm more out of the body than the screw mount to accomodate for the different lens to film distance, but that's it.

 

Cheers,

 

Andy

 

 

True. I used one before I actually knew what it is. :p

Some dude who cleaned out my relative's house when he moved to a senior's home took it.

:eek:

 

Andreas

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Well;, you live and learn. I suppose it could be done as the bayonet mount is a bit thinner than the screw mount, and they would have to make the hole for the mount a little larger. Also it would need a special top plate as the bayonet mount is rather wider. It would be interesting to try the modification. I wonder how much my IIIg would be worth if I did the mod. Not very much I would imagine.

 

Bryan

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Gerry,

 

Just out of interest - does Photokina Technic, Hubert Wokrina, Jürgen Rubi and George Kovacs ring a bell?

 

They do indeed, I worked there from 1966-69. Hubert and Juergen were the owners (Lotte also, Hubert's sister and Juergens wife), George was the Zeiss rep. but used Leicas! :)

 

Gerry

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Just out of interest - does Photokina Technic, Hubert Wokrina, Jürgen Rubi and George Kovacs ring a bell?

 

They do indeed, I worked there from 1966-69. Hubert and Juergen were the owners (Lotte also, Hubert's sister and Juergens wife), George was the Zeiss rep. but used Leicas! :)

 

Gerry

 

I thougt so! Heard about you when I worked there between 1971 and 1975..... George Kovacs was already with Walter A. Carveth (Leitz) during my times.

 

Small world......

 

All the best,

 

Jan

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Robert,

 

Supposedly the LTM body tooling was pitched when they made the production move from Wetzlar to Solms.

 

I know they brought out the 0 replicas a few years back, but remember they did so w/o a rangefinder and up to the M8, that was the single most expensive component of both LTMs and M bodies. Perhaps it still is even on the M8.

 

Jerry

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Since they are making the MP3, that may be as close as one can get to the old M3.

 

All they would have to tool up for is the old ASA dial on the back, and a self timer to replace the battery meter compartment. The film counter is unchanged (except for the plastic counter dial) so that already is there. The self timer may prove expensive to resurect though, as would the old M3 finder at 0.91 mag.

 

The last two would probably kill it.

 

Jerry

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Jerry

 

Shame about the tooling for the lll series - the concept of a re-issued / digital lll really appeals...

 

ps. I noted your comment about the M3 viewfinder, if you happen to be able to comment on this, it would be great

 

http://www.leica-camera-user.com/leica-collectors-historica/16565-m2-viewfinder.html#post173177

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Jerry,

 

if I were them, a replica M3 would have a built-in light meter (as even Leica customers do now expect that, just remember the recent MP classic which had no light meter and sold very slow, and so it would not have the self timer) and I would probably use the existing 0.85 finder in lieu of the old M3's 0.91 finder (I agree that resurrecting that one would most likely be economically unfeasible).

 

Starting from the already existing MP3, the only things they would thus have to do is to change the frame counter from the M2 style of the MP3 to the regular current MP counter and to use the 0.85 mag. finder (I believe the MP3 has the 0.72 finder). If they are really determined, they could use the old and much nicer M6 ASA dial at the back, instead of that horrible piece of plastic they are currently using on the MP.

 

Best,

 

Andy

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Around the year 2000, maybe in 1999, Leica built the current Summicron 2/35asph, the current Summicron 2/50 and the then current Summilux 1.4/50 (not the asph) in LTM, allegedly 500 of each, all in chrome. The original request for these lenses apparently came from Japan, and many of the lenses were sold over there, but some found their way to the rest of the world.

 

Luckily I got one. I bought it to go with my M6 but was also very excited at the thought of being able to use it on my IIIf. Sadly, as this pic shows, modern Leicas - just like so many things - just keep getting bigger and bigger. I've only used it a couple of times on the IIIf more for novelty value than anything else. It just doesn't feel right on the diminutive little IIIf.

 

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Michael

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When I get a chance, I will post some shots of my IIIG with the SM 35 Summicron f/2 asph, which I believe looks very nice on the camera. I admit that the photo that was posted above makes the lens look too large for the SM body, but I believe this is a result of the perspective of the taking lens for the shot, which appears to be a Wide Angle or slightly wide angle lens. If I am mistaken, I am surprised, but let's see what I can come up with (I took the photos a couple of years ago, and have to find them before I can post them here).

 

On the broader question of which lenses are the best for a Leica SM, let me weigh in and say, from the standpoint of modern optical formulas, coatings, sharpness, accutance, contrast etc. it's no contest - any of the three modern lenses that Leica made in SM in 1999 or 2000 for the Japanese market beat out anything that was made before or since.

 

Now this is an attempt at an objective opinion from someone who has used most of the great glass that leica has made in SM and M mount. Also this does not address subjective issues such as the use of an older summar to achieve the famous leica "glow" (i.e. flare) of the older lenses. If you are looking for an old look, get an old lens.

 

If you are looking for super-sharp, contrasty images with lenses that are at the cutting edge in terms of construction, then those three lenses are the best (again, IMO). By way of review, they are all silver chrome over brass and are (1) the 50/1.4 Summilux, modern with current coatings, pre-asph w built-in shade (fast, sharp but more pleasant bokeh than the asph lux); (2) 50/2 Summicron with built in shade (latest formula and coatings - sharp as anyone would want...the 50 lux asph is a little sharper but very unfriendly to the face of any woman over 18 years of age); (3) the 35mm/f2 summicron asph (incredibly sharp but still friendly to people --with good bokeh. I have all three of these, which I bought new. I am one of those people who love the IIIG, but, unfortunately, only to fondle (sick) in my den. I took it out one day and took photos at a art reception using the 35/2 asph, and the pictures were wonderful, with all of the look of what I would have gotten with any modern M and the same lenses in modern M mount. I occasionally consider selling one or all of them simply because I don't use them, but that is not because they are anything but the best glass you can put on a SM leica. Full stop (IMHO, of course).

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I think it is fair to say that the 1.4 Summilux, which I've had for some time now, does look a little big and heavy, when mounted on the lllf - so much so that I became worried as to whether the lens mount was robust enough to withstand the weight - in fact it's quite heavy on an M2 as well !!

 

Nevertheless, this is probably a sacrifice worth making, to allow the little camera to get 'modern' results when they're called for.

 

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:)
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When I get a chance, I will post some shots of my IIIG with the SM 35 Summicron f/2 asph, which I believe looks very nice on the camera.

 

Ed,

 

to save you some work, this is how a SM 35 Summicron f/2 asph looks on a IIIg.

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Andy

 

As you say, it looks reasonably compact on my lllf Red Dial too - I can see Michael's point as you can feel the weight a little but it's by no means excessive

 

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