Considering X1 - AF and Kids?

[jmooney]

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Hi All,

 

I'm seriously considering an X1. The image quality is the obvious draw and it would suit my needs but I'm concerned about one thing and that is photographing my 6 year and 1 year old daughters. I'm aware this isn't a sports camera, I have a DSLR for sporting needs but what about the normal motions and gyrations of little kids as they go about their day? Can anyone shed some light on how the X1 fairs in this situation? I've done OK with a Lumix LX-5 and I'm guessing the X1 should perform nearly the same. Thoughts and experiences are much appreciated.

 

Cheers,

 

Jim

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[abrewer]

Only way to know for absolutely certain is grab one and try it

 

But from my experience with it for about 2 weeks it's fine for anything except low light

[pharyngula]

Jim,

 

I've used a G9, D-lux4, and S90 for family stuff with small kids. They were all better than ok for this purpose and are excellent tools for such a "job" in circumstances involving frenetically paced events and travel when small kids are involved and you also have to carry all manner of things from a diaper bag to a stuffed animal toy. There just isn't time to sit and think about composing that shot when your wife is looking at you with that - "put the camera down and engage now..." - look.

 

My youngest is now 7 and the frantic pace has largely subsided (or at least transformed a bit in that I don't have to chase any toddlers hell bent on reaching a flight of stairs before I do). So, I decided to ditch the last compact and treat myself to an X1 a few months ago. I love the camera and while I don't consider it fast enough (e.g., AF) or versatile enough (e.g., fixed focal length) for small kid action, I'm quite content with it for both general family shots and my own selfish photographic pleasure as a "take everywhere" camera. I'm glad to be done with the compacts. To be honest, most of the photos I've taken of young kids came out of my dSLRs and pig-heavy lenses. The compacts were just for those times when I needed to take photos while "minding a busy store" and had my hands full (literally and figuratively). In my view, the X1 is a "compact" in size only - I'm sure you get that point.

 

Long story short, I just don't think the X1 is an ideal shooter for the purpose of catching young active kids. Can it be done - sure. Will you have the time and patience to catch that shot consistently - not so sure. I have an MP and had an M8.2 for a while and I feel the same way about these cameras. I certainly would use the Ms and X1 for kid stuff (and still do) but I have a good idea of when they are likely to be appropriate choices and when they are not. There is a lot to be said for having a compact, an X1, a rangefinder and a dSLR on the shelf to choose for that particular family assignment....! Plus, a compact like an S90/S95 can always be with you regardless of whatever other "serious" camera (I include the X1 here) you are toting.

 

Doug

[johannespiritu]

I recently got the X1, which I now use alongside my film Leica M's. I also take a lot of photos of my kids (12, 4, and 1 years old).

 

For both the X1 and the M's, I focus on the subject, and once I get focus I prefer to move and stay within the same distance so that the subject remains in focus, rather than refocusing. It's a trick that I learned a while back for using manual focus cameras, and I use the same technique with the X1. It has worked for me, and so far has fared better than relying on fast AF (which are both non-existent on the X1 and film M's!). It does require you to be on your feet, though!

[abrewer]

I think it's interesting that someone would compare the Canon S90/S95 (I've owned and used both of them extensively) to the X1 and draw the conclusion that the former is superior for indoor photography of animated or active subjects

 

I had to reshoot numerous times at Indy with the Canon's to get a usable image inside a well-lit pavilion where the drivers were available for interviews

 

The flash is worthless on that camera and the only focal length at which you actually get f2 is the widest

 

Personally I don't find much difference in the S's and the X1 in real-life usage

[py6km]

Essentially, I bought my X1 for family shots (new addition to the family).

 

Generally speaking I'd say that if you're dealing with a subject which is stationary, or moving 'a little bit' then the X1 will be ok. I've managed to capture our two rabbits and my daughter with it (although she is weeks old and so movement isn't as frenetic as it's likely to get!). The difficultly I've found is that I like to be fairly close in, and use spot AF to make sure I'm getting the bit I want in focus - by the time it takes the camera to have focussed and taken the shot, the subject could well have moved; there's a small amount of luck in it.

 

Compared to, for example, the GF1, focus is slow (but accurate). With the GF1 I could nail focus for grab shots successfully. This isn't possible with the X1 in my experience (although I rarely use the 1 point H AF box - that might speed things up a bit).

 

Overall I'm very pleased with it though. The other contender for me was an X100 - that lost mainly due to the fact that, when relatively close up you have to i) use the EVF because of parallax, and ii) the size of the AF box can't be made smaller in OVF mode (i.e. it reverts back to its, quite frankly, very large size when switching from the smaller size in EVF to OVF).

[pharyngula]

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I think it's interesting that someone would compare the Canon S90/S95 (I've owned and used both of them extensively) to the X1 and draw the conclusion that the former is superior for indoor photography of animated or active subjects

 

Actually, you will note the words "ok" and "excellent" under certain "circumstances" were used in reference to S90-class compacts but hardly the word superior. I also said that most of my action shots of kids were consistently taken with dSLRs. I'm not pushing a compact lke the S90/S95 at all - I agree with your criticisms of the Canons. But that doesn't make the X1 necessarily a better alternative camera for indoor action shots of active kids.

 

As for flash, I hate the snapshot look one gets using the on board pop-up flash of pretty much any camera including the S90/95 and the X1 but at least the X1 has a hot shoe and can be fitted with a bounce flash. And they both have good low light sensitivity (but here the X1 is clearly superior of course) rendering indoor ambient light often sufficient even with moderate movement of the subject.

 

In my opinion, an X1 is simply not the best choice if you require a camera mostly to shoot young active kids - indoors or out (and in saying this I'm not at all implying that an S90 is somehow superior). But if you are buying it mainly for other reasons, most certainly try it out on kids as well and just see how it goes - I have no doubt that you will get some great shots but it would take more skill, patience and luck than I generally possess (granted, not particularly high bars) to get those shots consistently. Zone focus is indeed a good solution when the light is sufficient but it does limit your range of mobility and when indoors your DOF will often be too narrow to be of much practical use.

 

I hesitate to make the suggestion, but an X1 supplemented with a small and versatile dSLR like a Nikon d5100 (or equivalent) with better than kit-lens glass would be a great way to go if one of your primary objectives is to document the lives of small kids.

[Ecaton]

For kids and pets the X1 AF is not ideal, as it isn't with most compact large sensor cameras. However, ZF is easy with the X1 and its excellent high iso performance allows to keep shutter speed up for indoor shots as well.

[jmooney]

Thanks for all the insight everyone. It looks like I might wind up with a combo of a Dlux 4 or 5 and the X1. That was kinds of the way I was headed prior to considering the X1 - a combo of a Dlux and an M8 but in reality (see above note about two kids ) I realized it wasn't going to be financially possible to buy and M8 plus lenses for the foreseeable future. I'll probably grab a D-Lux 4 and plan for an X1 in lieu of an M8 - Leica lens and IQ but more affordable than an M8 kit. We also have a Nikon DSLR which is fast but I honestly like the images from the Dlux's better. Not to mention lugging it around. We were in Disney World two weeks ago and I was carrying an LX-5 and it was perfect but the zoom control froze so for the last few days I was forced to carry the D5000. The first day put the 18-200VR on it and talk about an albatross....switching to the 35/1.8 helped a bit but I still liked the LX/Dlux images better.

[wda]

Hi All,

 

I'm seriously considering an X1. The image quality is the obvious draw and it would suit my needs but I'm concerned about one thing and that is photographing my 6 year and 1 year old daughters. I'm aware this isn't a sports camera, I have a DSLR for sporting needs but what about the normal motions and gyrations of little kids as they go about their day? Can anyone shed some light on how the X1 fairs in this situation? I've done OK with a Lumix LX-5 and I'm guessing the X1 should perform nearly the same. Thoughts and experiences are much appreciated.

 

Cheers,

 

Jim

 

Jim, joining in late after your mind is made up. I agree that anything short of auto-follow-focus is difficult with children. Two comments:

 

1. Kids are not always moving. Many of my best shots were captured when in repose or absorbed in some object or activity.

2. Don't forget that pre-zone focusing in manual can work very well. It is not too difficult to move and keep within the optimum distance. Sure you will get some failures, but shoot a lot and select the best expressions. With the X1 you can now lock the manual distance. Very useful.

[jsrockit]

I'm sorry, but as a former X1 user, I'd say this is not the camera for this type of action. Sure, there are work arounds, but they are workarounds.

[jpjansen]

Actually, action shots are doable. This is my wife in serious trouble quite near the green.

 

There is some blur around the club head but, given the shutter speed, the result is acceptable. The vegetation in the bunker is perfectly sharp.

 

All sizes | L1011776-C1 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

[Ecaton]

Actually, action shots are doable. This is my wife in serious trouble quite near the green.

 

There is some blur around the club head but, given the shutter speed, the result is acceptable. The vegetation in the bunker is perfectly sharp.

 

All sizes | L1011776-C1 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

 

I decided to start with golf after my 70ths birthday, because for the time being I'm still into action sport. Healthy kids move quite a bit faster.

[lykaman]

Hi jmooney......

well you have heard various thoughts on the X1, here’s my 4pennies worth!

(1) Have you used Leica before?

(2) There is a Learning Curve on the X1!

(3) Although the X1 can be setup as a P&S the best results are when set up by the photographer

(4) Although some say the AF is slow I have found that in most cases it is fine. Manual focussing is a good way to go...

(5) Learn the camera before you do serious shooting ie.. panning, focussing, metering, the X1 has a plethora of settings, ISO/WB/+-EV/Multi Point/Single focus points plus much much more..

Finally if you just want a good P&S without all the dials & settings with the added advantages of a zoom try the new V-Lux30...It is a Leica......

[shinglj]

I've been using my X1 for 5 months and it takes beautiful images . It demands a different approach to photography .But I would never recommend it for photographing kids. There's no getting away from it even with the V2 software the autofocus is always leisurely , often frustrating and sometimes wrong .

 

shinglj

 

The Rolling Road

[lykaman]

I have found the X1 focus "wrong"

The Face Recognition setting is often forgotten,

It actually works pretty well.

[Ivan Muller]

DL4guy imo is right about everything, mirrors my experience. For kids that are moving all the time, its going to be very difficult! Have a look at the new olympus releases might be the camera to go for......