Best Tips/Tricks for B&W

[mweiner]

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I would add to my previous post the apparently contradictory advice (from the makers of Silver EFEX Pro among others), that to get a good black and white conversion, you need to start with a good color print with appropriate color adjustments, then lower contrast and increase saturation before converting to b+w (or taking the image into SEP).

 

I would guess that the optimal workflow might be to avoid seeing the image in color until you've chosen it as a keeper and cropped it for composition in b+w. Then do the adjustments in color and then to black and white conversion.

[sblitz]

i use silver 2 but also c1 6 pro .... one of the interesting things i have found that is fun to do in creating a b&w version is to raise the color saturation first and then convert to b&w gives you a lot more latitude when playing with the filters after the conversion. another thing you might try is to simply reduce the saturation to near b&w and don't convert. just sharing a few things but, like most have written, the beauty here is all in the eyes of the converter. unless you are trying to make a living selling your photos -- then the market decides.

[Jeff S]

This is probably true, but personal photography isn't a contest to see who can do everything, as if its a competition.

 

I never said that; you did. That has to be the most presumptuous thing I've read today.

 

Jeff

[Jeff S]

Saying that colour isn't easy, as if its a failed aim if you won't use it, is the most patronizing thing I've read today.

 

Nor did I say this. Two for two.

 

In fact, my point was the opposite...in direct response to someone who said color was useless.

 

Jeff

[250swb]

No Jeff, this is what you said in response to somebody who made a firm choice not to use colour,

 

The trick is to use color to elicit a different, but equally important esthetic. Not easy, as you've discovered.

 

You just imply that if a choice has been made to use B&W its because of a failure to deal with colour rather than knowing their own mind.

 

But I may have misread your words, and if so I apologise, it is always difficult understanding where somebody is coming from without examples of work that underline any tricks or aesthetic nuances.

 

Steve

[prunelle]

... You just imply that if a choice has been made to use B&W its because of a failure to deal with colour rather than knowing their own mind. ...

That's how I had understood it all too. The truth is exactly what I said then: the more I take photos, the more I notice that the colour is useless... unless you want to capture the colours instead of the subject. Sorry for repeating myself. I'll add that colour is more a distraction than anything else in a photo.

[Jeff S]

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To each his/her own. No disrespect intended. Differences in creative thought and execution are fundamental to the craft that we all enjoy. Some even enjoy 'useless' color. Vive la difference.

 

Not that it matters, but I shot, processed and printed b/w exclusively for decades until digital allowed me to additionally process and explore use of color. Still exploring. And always looking at works of others.

 

Peace.

 

Jeff

[sblitz]

photography grew up as a b&w medium and the original photographers, including hcb, used their knowledge of painting composition in creating their photographs. picture taking has evolved since then, including most obviously the use of color. there is a famous text from the 19th century, whose name escapes me, that went through color composition and how to see the dark side of the leaf being a mix of colors and not black or dark green. the tract, in fact, is credited for being the bible for the impressionist painting that was to come. the author of the book noted that one can learn to draw and compose and see the world in b&w fairly quickly but to understand the use of color is hard work, can take a life time, and many never get it. getting to photography today, there is definitely a power to b&w photographs by focusing the eye on the subject rather than get distracted by color. ah, but herein lies what makes color so difficult -- using it to tell, enhance, make more powerful, the story being told. woody allen once commented that the difference between silent movies and sound is the difference between checkers and chess. so i would submit that while b&w and color are each an artistic expression of the photographer and therefore there is no right or wrong or good or bad involved here, getting it right in color is an inherently more difficult process that some of us may never be able to master to our own satisfaction.

[250swb]

getting it right in color is an inherently more difficult process that some of us may never be able to master to our own satisfaction.

 

And yet there are millions upon millions of people who go on holiday every year and come back with colour photographs they are very satisfied with.

 

Aunty Vera's holiday snaps may not be sophisticated photographs, but they deal with colour in a straightforward uncomplicated way that doesn't need to be practiced to get right. Why do you want to make it sound difficult?

 

Chevreul, who's colour theory inspired painters from the 1850's, has had little or no influence on photography, dealing as his theories do with ways to combine colour that just don't crop up in photography enough to need understanding. I mean, he was dealing in part with natural colour casts, and we all know what photographers would do or say if a beautiful model had a green shadow under her chin. From the 1930's its Kodak colour that inspired photographers, not theoreticians.

 

 

Steve

[sblitz]

your aunty's photos from her holiday, along with my aunt's are perfectly fine for what they are meant to be. and if one's need today is for a camera to take holiday snaps that will rarely be printed and most often seen online, then an iphone or a small p&s are perfect. no different, actually better, than the instamatic photos from the 1960s.

 

you are, in addition, absolutely correct in that the early drive in film was to create something that faithfully represented what we saw. today we are well beyond that point and, as i just noted, a faithful representation of the clan at a holiday dinner does not require a leica m and the expensive lenses that go with it - or a higher end dslr for that matter.

 

so we involved in the creative process with these cameras and, to me, the great challenge is to be creative with color. people today are trying all sorts of things to make photos take on color look that is perhaps more impressionistic, for the lack of a better term, or generally speaking pushes the envelope to use color to draw the view to see what they the photographer is trying to convey. today, that could very well mean green eyeshadow on the chin. and today, color theory from painting is very much more valid in photography -- simple reproduction of real life does not require the equipment in our hands.

 

the photos from our respective aunts also did not like have the composition and use of light that make b&w photos stand out.

 

so i stand by my point, that the creative process using color adds a layer to the b&w photo that inherently increases the complexity and makes it more difficult to get it right. some do it well, some just create a postcard. no one who is good at karaoke becomes a singing star.

[Dabow]

Hwo do you distinguish between what is better left in color and what would be better in black and white? I know its subjective but Im just curious what people's opinions are on this.

 

My philosophy on this is simple - if colour adds nothing to the image I take it out.

[sanyasi]

I have been working with Silver Effects Pro 2.0 lately. As others have suggested, start with the presets. I literally go down the list through them all just to see what happens and what I like. My eye keeps pointing me toward the darker versions of the images. When I find something I like, I then head over to the color filters and see if I can improve the image. After that, I experiment with each film type to see what happens--I tend to go back to the default. I then work with the film grain. Finally, I will try vignettes, burns, and borders to see what happens. At that point, I may add some control point adjustments. Other times, I start over.

 

It is a question of experimentation, but I suspect a personal style will begin to emerge.

 

Good luck

 

Jack Siegel

[prunelle]

Hi, I think you must follow these rules for good B/W photo.

 

• Shoot in RAW
  
• Shoot in Color
  
• Low ISO
  

If you do raw, you don't need to shoot in colour since raw files are always in colour.

[Peter.S]

It is the same as with the wet darkroom: blood, sweat and tears.

 

It will depend on what software you have what techniques are available to you. Silverefex is a very good tool even if it is your only one, but I think that a mix of Photoshop and Silverefex is the way to go.

 

In any case it always starts with a well exposed color picture.

 

What we miss in our digital world is the tonal range of B+W film, so sometimes it can help to do a little of HDR on your color picture before you convert to B+W. Then after the conversion extending the tonal range continues. Once you think you have squeezed every ounce of information out of the file you can start creating the file you visualized by working on the midtones, dark greys, blacks and deep blacks. It is easier to tease some levels of gray out of what first looked white, but once you have pushed certain tones into black they are lost (generally speaking). I always from light to dark.

 

As in the wet darkroom you will have to print a lot to see where you are heading (even with a callibrated screen).

 

Links should keep you reading for a while.

 

If you are really focussing on Silverefex I think there are some tutorials on youtube to get you started.

[lykaman]

Hi, my guidelines as follows:- If I’m purely looking 4 B&W I set the camera to B&W

Trial & error with PP programs..whichever you like is best..

If I think a color image does not work I try it in B&W. But in the end it’s all your decision..

28million photographers = 28million+1 different views! 1 photographer has 2 views!

[zimboom]

 

Maybe you should start with Ansel Adams first, for instance The Negative. He makes you aware of pre-visualization, learning to see subject and scenes in B&W, and how you want it in B&W. He advises to carry a Wratten filter #whatever, through which you can see a scene in how it comes in B&W, so you know what filter you need (this can of course be translated into digital with filters in Silver Efex)

 

This is the only answer that make sense to me. I've read the book and I would not compare B&W with color or wondering which is best, this is personal, each have their own recipe for B&W. I use a tri-tone technique in pp for my B/W!

[Beyder28]

This is the only answer that make sense to me. I've read the book and I would not compare B&W with color or wondering which is best, this is personal, each have their own recipe for B&W. I use a tri-tone technique in pp for my B/W!

 

tri-tone technique?? Can you please explain?

[Beyder28]

I would add to my previous post the apparently contradictory advice (from the makers of Silver EFEX Pro among others), that to get a good black and white conversion, you need to start with a good color print with appropriate color adjustments, then lower contrast and increase saturation before converting to b+w (or taking the image into SEP).

 

I would guess that the optimal workflow might be to avoid seeing the image in color until you've chosen it as a keeper and cropped it for composition in b+w. Then do the adjustments in color and then to black and white conversion.

 

How much would you lower the contrast and increase the saturation by in general?

[zimboom]

 

tri-tone technique?? Can you please explain?

 

In CS5, Image Mode;

 

1- convert to grayscale

2- convert to Duotone

3- in Duotone option choose Type: Tritone

 

Ink 1: Black

Ink 2: Pantone 441 or what ever you feel

Ink 3: Pantone 5455 or what ever you feel

 

4- in the curve option box (square box with diagonal line) for each color make adjustment to your liking and click ok

5- In Image mode, convert back to RGB Color space

 

Et voilà!

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[Beyder28]

In CS5, Image Mode;

 

1- convert to grayscale

2- convert to Duotone

3- in Duotone option choose Type: Tritone

 

Ink 1: Black

Ink 2: Pantone 441 or what ever you feel

Ink 3: Pantone 5455 or what ever you feel

 

4- in the curve option box (square box with diagonal line) for each color make adjustment to your liking and click ok

5- In Image mode, convert back to RGB Color space

 

Et voilà!

 

Thanks for making me feel stupid. For what its worth, I only use Aperture.