Leica M9-P ????

[rosuna]

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Frankly, I couldn't care less. I didn't move from M4 to M4--2 or M4-P,nor from M6 to M6TTL or further to M7, I didn't move from M8 to M8.2. Minor upgrades are no buying trigger for me, nor the number of scratches on my current camera

 

That is because your current camera already is a M9... but people considering one are intrigued...

[jaapv]

Well - speculation is always intriguing.

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[adan]

I agree with Jaap that MP cosmetics on an M9 would require different milling of the top plate - I don't agree that it would cost that much more.

 

The top plates are computer-milled. It probably costs quite a bit less to change the milling "program" than it does to rewrite the M9 firmware, given that CNC software is structured with flexibility and ease of change in mind. That's the whole idea behind CNC. Crank out 1,000 MP top plates this week, 1,000 M7 top plates next week, 1,000 M9-P top plates the week after - all with just a few mouse clicks.

 

Technically, I'd think it is "harder" to machine a red-dot top plate. One has to cut a perfect circle to a specific depth, and then machine out the triangular opening through the remaining metal for access to the adjustment mechanism.

 

For an MP-type plate, all one has to do is drill a simple hole right through (not to any exact depth), and then tap it for screw threads.

 

But to one of Uwe Weller Feinwerktechnik's CNC machines, it's all just numbers in the computer instructions. Weller Feinwerktechnik GmbH

 

Yes, a one-off for Seal would cost more than a run of 1,000 for a special edition, or 5,000-10,000 if this is the new "production" look for the M9.

 

More accurately - it will cost "X" to set up the new machining, and for a one-off, all of "X" would have to be recovered in the cost of one camera. For a run of 1,000, the new machining setup would cost "X"/1000 per camera. For a big run, "X"/5000 per camera.

 

It would not surprise me at all if Leica actually does change to an "M9P" as the production model, as we reach what is probably about the halfway point in the M9's overall production life. An "M9.2" but with more visible cosmetic differences and a certain caché to justify a no-doubt higher price. Some current M9 owners would probably trade up for "real" chrome, MP styling, and a sapphire LCD - moving some M9s into the used market. New purchasers would likely be happy to get a camera that is clearly "2011" and not "2009."

 

(Well, they are all "1954" - but you know what I mean. )

Edited May 24, 2011 by adan

[Jeff S]

Frankly, I couldn't care less. I didn't move from M4 to M4--2 or M4-P,nor from M6 to M6TTL or further to M7, I didn't move from M8 to M8.2. Minor upgrades are no buying trigger for me, nor the number of scratches on my current camera

 

I mentioned in another post that my approach is the opposite, preferring to wait for 'second generation' products (not just with cameras, but often for cars, appliances, etc), especially when significant hurdles are involved (M9 going to full frame and without external IR filters presented challenges). This better ensures that 'bugs' and issues have been sorted out, in this case including firmware updates along the way.

 

So, we coexist well, since there would be no changes without experience and input from early adopters. My M8.2 is no doubt a better sorted camera than an M8, with some relatively minor additional features to my liking. And I had my M7 to keep me occupied until the second generation digital M came along.

 

I have no current reason to change from my M8.2, but if I did decide to move to full frame, then it would more likely be to a later M9 version (assuming no radical price increase or the addition of some 'crazy' changes).

 

Jeff

[menos I M6]

Andy is right on the money.

 

The complete step of engraving "M 9" on the left side front face is cancelled during machining in this orientation.

This means probably, the omission of one milling tool in the process (Ø1mm milling tool or smaller, given the very small corner radius in the lettering).

 

An additional core hole drilling tool + tapping tool is needed, while the core hole drilling tool would probably be utilized in another operation during the program, to drill a start point for one of the roughing milling tools, to mill the rangefinder and viewfinder windows.

 

I judge the omission of the "M 9" lettering and the milling of the triangular RF adjustment port hole + circular fitting for the Leica logo as a significant time saving in CNC machining time.

 

If these two changes are the only changes to the top plate, Leica indeed has found a cost saving of approximately 1,80 EUR to 2,50 EUR (incl. machine rate + additional 25% margin + VAT) in raw machining time costs from their supplier.

 

These are approximated prices, taking no real data into account (corrected machining times, real hourly machine rates, quotes form the supplier, etc…).

 

Now think about the cost savings on the Leica logo.

These parts are aluminum alloy stamping parts, which are painted, polished, connected with a self adhesive and delivered on feeding rolls, as I know.

Without knowing of country of origin, actual manufacturing process (hand polished, machine polished), I would judge them somewhere between 0.4 − 0.8 EUR/pc.

The painted/ plated screw instead will be only 25 − 50% of the cost.

 

All in all, I truly love the idea of this kind of M9 - it is exactly the digital M, I wanted, when I first saw the M9.

I was always asking for a script less, clean top plate, black paint finish and Vulcanite cover.

If Leica indeed includes other improvements (the sapphire cover is a must - my M8.2 has not a single mark on the cover glass, while the body is pretty brassy), I am all in.

 

Too bad, I actually played with the idea of picking a M9 up, while on travels in Europe in June, which will surely not give me a chance, to see or even buy the new, rumored model.

[Albertzingue]

To my humble opinion the leica M9-P should have :

1- a saphire screen

2- an enhanced buffer capacity

3- be available in black chrome : Leica, give us back the black chrome and stop the non-sense bullshit about "brassing nicely with age" as an excuse to a cheaper black paint laquer finish

[wattsy]

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bullshit about "brassing nicely with age" as an excuse to a cheaper black paint laquer finish

 

I'm not a fan of the glossy black finish of the M9 but, to be fair to Leica, it is very hard wearing. My M9 is 18 months old and used regularly but shows no signs of brassing whatsoever. Most (all?) of the brassed M9 bodies I've seen on the internet look like they've been sandpapered.

[jsrockit]

I'm not a fan of the glossy black finish of the M9 but, to be fair to Leica, it is very hard wearing.

 

How'd you get a glossy black M9? Mine is dull black.

[andybarton]

I'm not a fan of the glossy black finish of the M9 but, to be fair to Leica, it is very hard wearing. My M9 is 18 months old and used regularly but shows no signs of brassing whatsoever. Most (all?) of the brassed M9 bodies I've seen on the internet look like they've been sandpapered.

 

The only black bodies that brass naturally are the black paint ones - a finish that hasn't been offered on the M9 as yet.

[Albertzingue]

All is based on some pictures or a silver-chrome M9 looking camera around the neck of Mr. Seal.

 

Didn't we have this already? http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/current-offers/170523-leica-m9-limited-set-15-995-a.html#post1634686

 

Indeed. But still it is very likely that a new M9 will be on the shelves soon.

[stephan_w]

Indeed. But still it is very likely that a new M9 will be on the shelves soon.

 

what I heard from someone who must know it: It will be chrome, without Leica-Dot, with MP-like-engraving, with saphire-back (i suppose they still have a stock from the M8), and will cost under 6tsd Euro.

[algrove]

In a recent interview with Panasonic UK product and marketing managers, linked to at the m43rds rumours site, there is discussion about the introduction in June of another Leica branded lens for the m43rds range, a 25/1.4 (e.g. a 50-lux for the G/GH/GF series). The timing of June syncs with the rumours in this thread, so perhaps a Leica branded G3 with the 25/1.4 is what is in the offing?

 

LouisB

 

I bought a D Summilux 25 f 1.4 ASPH lens for my 4/3 Panasonic GF1 about 2-3 months ago. Very sharp lens. Nice bokeh too. Funny thing is that the lens has now been discontinued at B+H. Maybe the problems in Japan caused it. Although, it does say Leica on it. Is this the lens you are talking about?

[brill64]

this is not an m9-p but i imagine it might look something like this mp3..minus the film advance and rewind crank, the exposure window where the screw is, probably chromed rather than painted silver..

 

Leica MP3 LSHA | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

[esquire53]

P will stand for profit ....

Leica is back in the black and they celebrate with a (limited) Profit Black edition

 

cheers

Uwe

[roydonian]

If the new model is simply a cosmetically different variant, what need was there for Leica to hand out pre-series examples to selected users? A 'leak' such as has happened may be whetting interest from some potential users, but could also damp down M9 sales until the new version is announced and we know whether or not there are internal changes.

 

Perhaps I'm not understanding the concept of viral marketing...

 

Best regards,

 

Doug

[rosuna]

I bought a D Summilux 25 f 1.4 ASPH lens for my 4/3 Panasonic GF1 about 2-3 months ago. Very sharp lens. Nice bokeh too. Funny thing is that the lens has now been discontinued at B+H. Maybe the problems in Japan caused it. Although, it does say Leica on it. Is this the lens you are talking about?

 

Well, there is a rumored 25mm f/1,4 Summilux lens for micro 4/3 cameras, made by Panasonic but signed by Leica and to be presented later this year.

[brill64]

If the new model is simply a cosmetically different variant, what need was there for Leica to hand out pre-series examples to selected users? A 'leak' such as has happened may be whetting interest from some potential users, but could also damp down M9 sales until the new version is announced and we know whether or not there are internal changes.

 

Perhaps I'm not understanding the concept of viral marketing...

 

Best regards,

 

Doug

 

i agree, valid point, "if"..testing out new firmware and un-leaked handling maybe? no one (here) knows for sure and it's all viral speculation until proven otherwise, except for what a few dealers may or may not have leaked out. but saying that, even the original m9 was just a pipedream right up until a couple of months before it was actually released and the rumors started to fly. i doubt any kind of leak would dampen sales of the original m9 and i'm basing that at least on everyone here knowing how long it took to finally get one...some more than a year. some of those stories were ugly. i very much doubt, unless extremely lucky or someone in the industry owes some huge favor, or you can pay well over the "list price", that one would be able to obtain an m9-p within 6 months to a year from it's supposed release anyway. it's currently virtually impossible to buy new leica lenses unless waiting 6 months or willing to pay ridiculous mark ups on official list price. if not then they're 'out of stock until further notice'. whether cosmetic variant or not, irresistible charm to some, must-have practical tool to others. PERHAPS the rebirth of a dream in the form and tradition of an m2, m3 or mp, which to a younger generation coming from modern slr photography and is also interested to be a part of the tradition of professionalism and longevity that owning a leica rangefinder represents perhaps? retro or not, call it what you will..it's going to be huge..again.

[adan]

A 'leak' such as has happened may be whetting interest from some potential users, but could also damp down M9 sales until the new version is announced and we know whether or not there are internal changes.

 

At the moment, damping down M9 sales would be like trying to damp down a forest fire with a paper cup.

 

My Leica reps says M9 availability is still spotty - most shipments to the US sell out long before the next arrives.

 

On the flip side, no doubt there would be some people who would accelerate their M9 purchase (if possible) to avoid a price increase for what amounts to cosmetic differences (there won't be any significant internal changes until a whole new M10 appears).

[roydonian]

Perhaps we are being favoured in the UK, but for some months dealers have been advertising the M9 as being available from stock.

 

The M8.2 was launched in September 2008, and I was able to walk into a shop in London and buy an ex-demo camera in April 2009.

 

Best regards,

 

Doug

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Marc Lankhorst]

Have a look at this: GOING RETRO! 35 Cron PRE-ASPH (for a change). on Twitpic.

Looks like a chrome M9 with engraved lettering on top, without the red dot, and with "-P" just visible on the hot shoe. It seems that Seal is Leica's official leak now (no pun intended...), this picture certainly doesn't look like a coincidence.

 

Marc