Shootist Posted January 25, 2007 Share #1 Posted January 25, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I'm in the market for a wider lens for the M8. I would really like to get the Leica 24mm 2.8 but my eye, and my wallet, keep wandering to the Zeiss 25mm. 1) Does the Zeiss 25mm bring up the 24mm frame lines on the M8. 2) Do any forum members have the Zeiss 25 and what do you think of it. Thanks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 25, 2007 Posted January 25, 2007 Hi Shootist, Take a look here Zeiss 25 or Leica 24?????. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
bradreiman Posted January 25, 2007 Share #2 Posted January 25, 2007 it does not currently bring up the proper framelines but there should be a solution eventually. i dont have either but from reviews and examples i've seen the zeiss is a good lens. the leica is more expensive and maybe a little better...b Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJL Posted January 25, 2007 Share #3 Posted January 25, 2007 Ed, The Zeiss 25/2.8 Biogon is great lens. It brings up the 28mm frame lines in the M8 finder. Sean Reid has done a very wonderful job comparing these 24/25 lenses in a write-up on his site (Reid Reviews) which, if you are not a subscriber, is well worth the few dollars for access. His comparison will probably answer a lot of your questions. I have the Zeiss 25/2.8, and I use is on the M8, not bothering with any finder lines, as it is pretty close to the full finder view. The only caveat is that there is some minor vignetting, but less than the Leica 24/2.8, and unless one can successfully code the Zeiss themselves, or use the Leica 28/2 coding, there may be some cyan drift issues when using the UV/IR cut filters for color shots. I have not had an issue here yet, but for indoor or higher IR source shooting, it could become bothersome for color shooting. The Zeiss is razor sharp on the edges, which is actually quite amazing to see on such a wide angle lens. I am very happy with it, and I understand your feelings about how much less it costs in comparison. LJ Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thisaccountisdeleted Posted January 25, 2007 Share #4 Posted January 25, 2007 The Zeiss 25/2.8 Biogon is great lens. It brings up the 28mm frame lines in the M8 finder. can it be filed back to bring up the 24/35 lines on the M8? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted January 25, 2007 Share #5 Posted January 25, 2007 Ed,The Zeiss 25/2.8 Biogon is great lens. It brings up the 28mm frame lines in the M8 finder. Sean Reid has done a very wonderful job comparing these 24/25 lenses in a write-up on his site (Reid Reviews) which, if you are not a subscriber, is well worth the few dollars for access. His comparison will probably answer a lot of your questions. I have the Zeiss 25/2.8, and I use is on the M8, not bothering with any finder lines, as it is pretty close to the full finder view. The only caveat is that there is some minor vignetting, but less than the Leica 24/2.8, and unless one can successfully code the Zeiss themselves, or use the Leica 28/2 coding, there may be some cyan drift issues when using the UV/IR cut filters for color shots. I have not had an issue here yet, but for indoor or higher IR source shooting, it could become bothersome for color shooting. The Zeiss is razor sharp on the edges, which is actually quite amazing to see on such a wide angle lens. I am very happy with it, and I understand your feelings about how much less it costs in comparison. LJ Thanks for the comments. That article is a very extensive review of the Zeiss 25, Leica 24 and CV 25 - all on the M8. All three of them are impressive, albeit in different ways, and that certainly is not always the case with a given set of lenses of similar focal length. Cheers, Sean Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJL Posted January 25, 2007 Share #6 Posted January 25, 2007 Bryan, I really do not know. There have been suggestions to that effect. Also, I believe Sean Reid tried to swap a 35 mount ring in order to bring up the 24 framelines, but he was unable to remove the mounting screws. There have been a few suggestions to Zeiss to consider a retro-fit of the mount ring in order to bring up the 24mm framlines, but so far, I have not heard any more about this. Seems like a great solution idea to me. Then the only other issue would be coding the lens in some way to utilize any software corrections in camera for removing vignetting and any cyan drift. LJ Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJL Posted January 25, 2007 Share #7 Posted January 25, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Sean, I really thought you did an excellent job reviewing the lenses, and I agree with your assessments on the Zeiss, using one myself. I still keep hoping for a Zeiss mount retrofit, and then a menu drive for the M8 firmware. That would be very sweet for this little gem, and some others that fall outside of Leica's coding system at this time. LJ Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted January 25, 2007 Author Share #8 Posted January 25, 2007 Thanks for the replies. I have nothing against Sean Reid but I am cheap and the other day when I was at his site and did the subscription rout I almost feel opff my desk chair, $32.95 for a one year subsrciption!!!!!!!! Maybe if it was $10 or $15 for a one year subscription I might of taken it. I think I'll go with the Leica 24mm. This way I can get my 50 f/2 and 90 f/2.8 coded for free with the voucher. Update on the 30% Lens discount deal. This is the email I received back from M8 support. Thank you for your interest. The offer was valid also for those who had ordered and paid a M8 until the 31.12.2006. The camera had not to be delivered within this period. Best regards Leica Camera AG C. Basseng So it seems i'm SOL on that deal. But I'll still get the 2 IR filters and as my 50 and 90 take the same filter I'll get a 39mm and a 55mm, the 55 for the 24mm lens Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
artur5 Posted January 25, 2007 Share #9 Posted January 25, 2007 About the Zeiss frame issue with the ZM25 and ZM21, maybe we could organize a sort of swapping rings ... I have a ZM21 and I need a ZM25 bayonet ring to get the 28/90 frame lines. In exchange I'll send you a ZM35 ring, so you got 24/35 frames with the ZM25. Well, that seems a bit extreme and requires a lot of mutual trust of course. Really if you need the address the ZM25 issue it's easy to file down the keying flange of your actual ring -about 2 or 3 mm. I think. BTW It was easy for me to retire the 4 retaining screws of the bayonet ring.. I know Sean couldn't do it because the screws on his lens were very tight or glued, but mine weren't. Cheers Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pascal_meheut Posted January 25, 2007 Share #10 Posted January 25, 2007 $32.95 for a one year subsrciption!!!!!!!! Worth every penny. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wmspa Posted January 25, 2007 Share #11 Posted January 25, 2007 it does not currently bring up the proper framelines but there should be a solution eventually. i dont have either but from reviews and examples i've seen the zeiss is a good lens. the leica is more expensive and maybe a little better...b I had inquired with Zeiss Germany some time ago and last week they sent me an e-mail confirming that they were able to swap the bayonet mount to bring up the 24/35 frames. I sent them my Biogon 25/2.8 last Friday. Of course, I don't have it back yet. The price is EUR 40, I guess plus shipping costs. Wolfgang Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptomsu Posted January 25, 2007 Share #12 Posted January 25, 2007 Never ever use a Zeiss on a Leica! Serious, this is not what will satisfy your needs! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocker Posted January 25, 2007 Share #13 Posted January 25, 2007 Never ever use a Zeiss on a Leica! Serious, this is not what will satisfy your needs! Nonsense - have you used this lens? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodyspedden Posted January 25, 2007 Share #14 Posted January 25, 2007 Thanks for the replies.I have nothing against Sean Reid but I am cheap and the other day when I was at his site and did the subscription rout I almost feel opff my desk chair, $32.95 for a one year subsrciption!!!!!!!! Maybe if it was $10 or $15 for a one year subscription I might of taken it. I think I'll go with the Leica 24mm. This way I can get my 50 f/2 and 90 f/2.8 coded for free with the voucher. Update on the 30% Lens discount deal. This is the email I received back from M8 support. Thank you for your interest. The offer was valid also for those who had ordered and paid a M8 until the 31.12.2006. The camera had not to be delivered within this period. Wow You are going to buy the Leica 24 NEW!l and can't come up with $32.95 for a subscription to Sean Reid reviews? Let me make a suggestion..........buy a used 24mm for half the new price. Send it to leica and have it CLA'd and callibrated for about $75. You will have about $1200 in your pocket compared to buying it new. Out of that $1200 buy a subscription to Reid Reviews. You will never regret it. More real and practical info than you can get anywhere else, particularly for rangefinder shooters. LOL Cheers Woody Spedden Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted January 25, 2007 Share #15 Posted January 25, 2007 According to Chasseur d'Images # 290, both lenses on the M8: Vignetting at f/2.8: 24/2.8: 0.1% (with M8 correction) 25/2.8: 0.4% (w/o M8 correction) Chromatic aberration: 24/2.8: 0.09% 25/2.8: 0.03% Distorsion: 24/2.8: 0.33% 25/2.8: 0.18% Sharpness: 24/2.8: excellent from f/2.8 to f/16 25/2.8: very good at f/2.8 and f/16 - excellent from f/4 to f/11 Size - Weight: 24/2.8: 58 x 45mm - 290 g 25/2.8: 53 x 60mm - 260 g Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wparsonsgisnet Posted January 25, 2007 Share #16 Posted January 25, 2007 Ed, I have stated previously on the Forum that the subscription I paid for ReidReviews is the best $30-something I have ever spent on photography. What you would get, if you signed up, is not one but two (2 !) reviews containing images from both the Leica and Zeiss lenses, as well as commentary by Sean. In your price range, how can you afford not to have this very fine information? I bought the 24mm immediately after seeing only the first of the two reviews, but don't take my recommendation, get to the reviews. The images in the articles tell the entire story! I believe you're talking one Starbuck's cappuccino a day for a week! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xjr Posted January 25, 2007 Share #17 Posted January 25, 2007 If one can spend nearly £3000-00 on an M8 then one must be able to afford its lenses.A lense in its final form is not just a collection of pieces of glass ...it is also how its built. I wonder how the 25mm will fare if dropped from 1.5m high on marble with camera attached.My MP and 24mm survived except for a small crack on the plastic hood ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted January 25, 2007 Share #18 Posted January 25, 2007 Thanks for the comments on the site, guys! Objectively, there are actually many lenses that do very well on the M8. Some of them are made by Leica and some are made by other companies. The longstanding myth that non-Leica lenses are "lesser" optics is not necessarily born out in actual side-by-side testing. I say this having been immersed in rangefinder lens testing since September. The advantages of modern Leica lenses on the M8, in my experience, are: 1) Almost all of them perform very well optically. 2) Build quality and performance are very consistent from sample to sample (also true so far for Zeiss ZMs) 3) Most of them can be coded by Leica and so have matching custom corrections programmed into the M8. If one is looking purely at optical quality and the way a lens draws an image on a sensor, however, Leica is not the only company making first-rate lenses for the M8. When one chooses to use lenses (other than Leica) on the M8 that decision may have little to do with cost and much to do with preference. Cheers, Sean Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grober Posted January 25, 2007 Share #19 Posted January 25, 2007 OK. So I mail my ZM 25mm Biogon to Zeiss in Germany and have them change the mount so that the lens will now inovke the more proper 24mm frame on the M8. And I buy the required B+W IR-cut filter. What should I expect to see when I use the lens without 6-bit coding for color shooting? Cyan at the corners? Anything else? (No, I'm not going to mess with hand coding the lens. I'd only mess up the new mount. I love this lens!) Anyone? My alternative is to sell it and buy the 28mm Elmarit-M with my one-shot, Leica 30% discount thingy. The cost of the Leica 24mm is prohibitive. -g Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted January 25, 2007 Share #20 Posted January 25, 2007 You'll see cyan drift with the 486 filters and a touch of vignetting. It's the cyan drift that will likely be problematic but perhaps you would want to look into possible solutions for that in post-processing. Cheers, Sean Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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