fielden Posted January 2, 2011 Share #1 Posted January 2, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I have been shooting for some time now with leica dlux and M8 cameras. Didn't really get on with the M8 and now have just a dLux 5 which is great but......... I want to have a go with black and white film and would welcome any advice on how to go about it. I intend to buy an old M or R camera and lens on the basis I could probably get most of my money back if I don't take to it. But then what? Initially, I may have the films developed and printed but would like to start developing my own film and maybe move on to printing. Which film would be good to start with? If I develop the film and want to make photographic prints are there companies that will do this from my negs? Is there a benefit in scanning and digitally printing? Is there an inexpensive scanner I could buy which would do the job without breaking the bank? How do digitally printed photos compare with darkroom prints? Is there a website with step by step instructions on developing my first film? What equipment will I need? I understand film can be developed without a darkroom? Sorry for so many basic questions, any help or links would be appreciated. I have searched the forums without any joy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 2, 2011 Posted January 2, 2011 Hi fielden, Take a look here Starting with Film - Newbie Questions.. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
too old to care Posted January 2, 2011 Share #2 Posted January 2, 2011 C41 color film is easy to develop. The temperature is the only critical thing, around 100 degrees. B&W is even easier to develop, temperatures around room temperature works just fine. Do a Google search for C41 and you will find a ton of stuff on how to develop it, including a You Tube video that shows the process. I have not looked, but I bet there are sites that also explain b&w. Of course there are books written on the subject, but I if you ask around some of your friends may also have experience, especially with b&w and probably would love to show you. I put my dark room stuff away about 10 years ago and just got it out again. I am enjoying film much more than digital. Chemicals are cheap, C41 kit about $20 to $30, b&w about the same. This will get you started. The most expensive thing will be the negative carrier; I use stainless steel reels and plastic tanks, and a good thermometer. I have had my equipment for decades, it just does not wear out. Drying the film is done by hanging it up, no special equipment needed except a couple of clothespins. Even our local professional lab does not do regular wet prints anymore, but scan the negatives and print them digitally by a wet process. This allows them to change the colors easier than swapping in and out filters. There has been a pretty good discussion on the Plustek film scanner and software that works well with it. Some of us have recently picked up one to replace our older scanners and for the most part, most of us are happy. Just look down this page for some of those comments. I know that this may not answer your questions, but it will give you a starting place to look. And, start here. You can get the spec sheets for times, temperatures, chemicals and film. http://www.digitaltruth.com/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted January 2, 2011 Share #3 Posted January 2, 2011 I have been shooting for some time now with leica dlux and M8 cameras. Didn't really get on with the M8 and now have just a dLux 5 which is great but......... I want to have a go with black and white film and would welcome any advice on how to go about it. I intend to buy an old M or R camera and lens on the basis I could probably get most of my money back if I don't take to it. But then what? Initially, I may have the films developed and printed but would like to start developing my own film and maybe move on to printing. Which film would be good to start with? If I develop the film and want to make photographic prints are there companies that will do this from my negs? Is there a benefit in scanning and digitally printing? Is there an inexpensive scanner I could buy which would do the job without breaking the bank? How do digitally printed photos compare with darkroom prints? Is there a website with step by step instructions on developing my first film? What equipment will I need? I understand film can be developed without a darkroom? Sorry for so many basic questions, any help or links would be appreciated. I have searched the forums without any joy. I'll have a go at some of these as I've only recently returned to film myself. Firstly, I went for a M film rangefinder (M6) as it's small, not dependent on batteries and will hold its value (I suspect more so than an R). I bought bulk film here which came with the bulk film loader. I bought 2 developing tanks with 4 cassettes, changing bag, storage bottles, thermometer, measuring cylinders and jugs off ebay (total cost £50 but you might find your local photographic soc has stuff going free). I bought Ilfosol3, Ilfostop, Ilford Rapid Fixer and Kodak Photflo at AG Photographic, Birmingham (Here). I viewed a number of Youtube vids to remind me of the process. I filled the bath with water at 20C to stabilise the temp of my chemicals and, after prerinse using water for a few mins at 20C, developed in the Ilfosol3 for 5mins, fixed, rinsed and hung overnight. I bought a V700 from Amazon having read good reviews and thinking I might get a medium format camera at sometime. I then scanned pretty much using these settings in Vuescan. The results are here. And I gave my brother a copy of the book I made here! Colour films I tried (kodak Portra 160NC and Ektar 100) have been scanned at Palm Labs. For test films I've been getting low res scans on CD when developed. You could get higher res scans and have the good photos printed by Palm or scan them your self then print on inkjet. Kodak Tri-X is a favourite BW film but I may start with Ilford FP4/HP5 soon in order to help a company devoted to analogue photography. For step by step guide to film developing I followed this guide for my developer Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
topoxforddoc Posted January 2, 2011 Share #4 Posted January 2, 2011 Graeme, Have a look at Ilford's website ILFORD PHOTO - Developing Black & White Film Buy a copy of a standard book such as Michael Langford's guide. Used copies from £0.01p! The Darkroom Handbook: Amazon.co.uk: Michael Langford: Books You need a changing bag, daylight tank (buy one that processes 3 reels), thermometer, 3 measuring jugs or graduates, scissors, can opener, watch with second hand, some bulldog clips (to hang film from shower curtain rail) and chemicals. Most of it is available on the *Bay for next to nothing. Keep to one film and one developer for at least 6 months before you start experimenting. I use XTOL (mixed from powder into 5 L - I started keeping mine in five used 1 litre plastic mineral water bottles) and HP5, as it suits a lot of my photography, which is low light or concert work. Any make of fixer and stop solution will do. Photoflo or photo wetting agent is helpful to stop drying marks on your film. If you can't get chemistry locally, then try Ag Photographic in Birmingham or Silverprint in London. Send me a PM if you want more help. Good luck, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smb Posted January 2, 2011 Share #5 Posted January 2, 2011 If you want to shoot black and white go with the M and a Summicron for the best/classic results. You will find that you will need to slow down your shooting pace from digital to film. As for darkroom printing...it is an art/technology form of its own and completing different from digital printing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 3, 2011 Share #6 Posted January 3, 2011 If you want to shoot black and white go with the M and a Summicron for the best/classic results. You will find that you will need to slow down your shooting pace from digital to film. As for darkroom printing...it is an art/technology form of its own and completing different from digital printing. Why slow down? . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hiles Posted January 3, 2011 Share #7 Posted January 3, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Graham, Consider starting with C41 film, both in B&W and colour. They are easy to process (either yourself or at a local lab), and the results are very fine indeed. For B&W there is Ilford XP2 Super, and Kodak and Fuji have fin examples also. In colour I like Kodaks films, but there are many excellent examples on offer. Don't be in a rush - personal opinion. Become comfortable with 1 film. I favour wet printing. There is great potential in inkjet printing, but I think there is nothing quite like a real silver print. The craft and art of fine printing is something to aim for, IMO. Again, no rush. As for books, I am a fan of Fred Picker's "Zone VI Workshop". He teaches the Zone system. No need to follow it slavishly, but understanding how to determine fim speed and development time is indispensible. Once you have made these simple tests, you will never again wonder about exposure and development. Don't believe second hand advice or published tables - do your own tests. And keep it simple. This not rocket science. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmas Posted January 3, 2011 Share #8 Posted January 3, 2011 Hi First B&W film is easy, to expose and dev, a 1st hurdle is getting it into the M, (and back out again) dont laugh. Read the instruction manual (PDF) for the M you get carfully, best before you buy the M. I have different Ms but prefer M2s, they are cheap as well. You dont need another lens the M8 lenses will do ok. If you are using mono in the main any M will do but the late M6 and later cameras wont accept the brass Leitz cassettes (IXMOO), late M6 will need a baseplate modification, M7, M5 and MP no way. You can get a separate meter if you are nervous or want night/dusk shots, the old Westons are easy to use (if you are fussy) and cheap. You can get all the developement kit 2nd hand (possibly for free), e.g. join a camera club and plead poverty I got a (wet) enlarger development trays for free as well, you might need to buy a film scanner but you dont necesarily need a high resolution high quality dedicted one. You might want a photo capable printer but again a cheap one may do. You may prefer to wet print, and ue the dig print for proof... If you are not a tecco freak you can use any film and the nominal time and temperature from the database. The difference between films is their speed and contrast, if you shoot high contrast sceanes use a low contrast film, or you will have high light (burn) problems, (not as bad as digital). If you are an artist you may want an old or single coated lens for the shadow fill in or pastel colors. There are two film types C41 where the image is a dye, and normal monochrome where the image is silver. You can develope either at home, you dont need to process the C41 at high temperatures, you can use 20C. The C41 film color or monochrome is easy to get processed and scanned and printed if you have a local mini lab, but they tend to scratch and otherwise damage negatives. your home dev should be perfect & consistent eventually. It is more difficult to get a good print if the negative is not easy to print. You can still get the positive color (or mono) transparency film. Shooting is different, you cant chimp, so it is hit the lever real hard for the next shot, no lag, if you want faster a baseplate with lever is faster if you can stabalise the camera against shake, but expensive, late M4-2 and M4-P may be best choice for this. You need to google and read, sorry... you may like it a lot. Noel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fielden Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share #9 Posted January 3, 2011 Thanks all for taking the time with these detailed replies. It is a big help. Now for some more reading and maybe some shopping! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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