fotografr Posted January 17, 2007 Share #1 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Months of waiting ended whenI finally got my M8 yesterday. But after a bit of shooting today, which appeared to show a rangefinder adjustment problem, the camera just flat out died this evening. I charged the battery again and it had no effect. No functions work. Â I am interested in finding a common denominator, if there is one. My M8 is black. I know one other person whose M8 died the same way and his was also black. Has this been happening to silver M8s as well? Could there be a different build quality? I'm trying to decide, also, whether to bother getting the camera fixed or just send it back for a refund and forget it. Â How many of you have had this happen? How long does it take to get it fixed? Is the camera reliable after being repaired? Â I know I'm asking a lot of questions here, but at the moment I'm very disillusioned. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 17, 2007 Posted January 17, 2007 Hi fotografr, Take a look here Dead M8 Survey. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
rondeb Posted January 17, 2007 Share #2 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Not sure if this will work, but... the M8's seem to be very sensitive to sd card compatibility. Make sure your card is on the list. This could be your problem. Good luck. Â -Ron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latecomer Posted January 17, 2007 Share #3 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Mine died after half an hour. The dealer replaced it with a new camera the following day. I have had no hassles since then. Â I was using a SD card not on the Leica list and this may have been the cause. Â The camera does have a few hassles. The one bothering me most is the poor definition in high contrast areas of jpg images. Really this is a small deal and by and large I am glad to have the M8 whatever its teething problems. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gesper Posted January 17, 2007 Share #4 Â Posted January 17, 2007 If it turns out to be true, maybe they will give you an exchange. This problem is not that common and is not related to the "recall" and you deserve a working camera right out of the box. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cindy Flood Posted January 17, 2007 Share #5 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Mine is one of the original 1500 and has not been back to Solms yet. Two weeks ago it went dead. The battery should not have been dead, but I changed to my fully charged spare. No go. Still dead. I took the new one out and re-inserted it. It finally came back on. The really strange thing is that my settings had changed. I always shoot RAW and it was now set for JPEG. It must have completely lost all power. Â I have shot several hundred shots since then with no more problems (other than the known first generation problems). Â I am very happy shooting with this camera and am looking forward to getting past these teething pains. I'm not giving up on the M8. Â My M8 is chrome, BTW. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted January 17, 2007 Share #6 Â Posted January 17, 2007 I think its certainly worth looking at whether or not there's a pattern with SD cards (in relation to this). Â Cheers, Â Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpwhite Posted January 17, 2007 Share #7 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Brent, this may not make you feel better, but YES, I had a similar problem with my chrome M8 (31017888), which came with firmware v1.09. My camera would not recognize the Sandisk 1GB card from my RD-1 initially, but after much fussing and rebooting the M8, I got several absolutely fantastic pics. The smoothness of the image, color accuracy and nuance -plus ease of focus- make the M8 worth any frustration along the way. Â After a few more instances of dead camera (mine told me it had a shutter fault), I returned it to Leica. I am promised a replacement camera next week, but I am not holding my breath. Â Without hesitation though, I know it is worth the wait. You have no idea how good the 35 Summilux and 28 Summicron are until you shoot them with an M8. Makes Velvia look like high-speed Ektachrome. Â In Leica's defense, they are a little company. I think their commitment is admirable. Â Peter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted January 17, 2007 Share #8  Posted January 17, 2007 SD cards are not identical, so this is certainly a possible source of trouble. However, there is a safe methodology recently presented on theonlinephotographer forum that I would suggest:  treat the SD card, when in the camera, as write only -- format it in the camera with the camera firmware before first use (someone mentioned above "the SD card from my RD-1 -- not!) delete in camera only if you must remove the card from the camera and use a card reader to upload to PC or Mac  treat the SD card, as seen from the PC, as read-only -- upload everything, backup to taste, verify, and then reformat in the camera  If one follows this approach, then it should be possible to distinguish problems due to the camera from problems due to the cards, plus it helps to keep from losing shots.  scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbretteville Posted January 17, 2007 Share #9 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Scott's suggestions make sence. I'd add a thought though. The only time where you should use a computer to delete something is if you move the card from one camera to another of different make. My experience with some cameras (the D2 is an example) is that they can get the hickups if they finds directories on a card that wasn't made by the camera itself. Â As to the many brands of cards: Most of the cards are rebranded (OEM) and made by a few manifacturers. Toshiba makes a lot of the cards (AFAIK Sandisk's are made by them) you see. There are a few others, but not as many as there are brands. Matsusita, I beleive, is another manifacturer. Cards are probably sold in bulk at a price according to the level of tolerances required by the rebrander. Â If the M8 is picky about its cards, Leica M8 support needs to keep the list updated, new cards are released all the time and there is no guarante that the cards on a list from October is available in March. Â - Carl Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted January 17, 2007 Share #10 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Take the card out of the equation - remove it. The camera should still power up without it. Â If the M8 has died so quickly, you should ask your dealer for a replacement. If it dies after just a day's use, it's as good as DoA. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevez4 Posted January 17, 2007 Share #11 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Both of my M-8s have hardware problems. The first, a 1.06 firmware, has a flashing rear panel but the B/W work is incredible. So I have not returned it to Solms yet. The second a black M-8 from Dale Labs went dark after 172 shots. I requested an exchange but the dealer did not agree. The camera is at Leica now. Â The hardware problems that some of us face are, in my opinion, more serious than the magenta etc. problems. They are manufacturing defects not a design fault, and should be treated as such. The forum has shown that software can fix many of the design faults. Â A last resort is always to claim 'defective merchandise" under your crdit card protection. That will get the dealers attention. They will not be arguing with you but a bank. Â The approach of Tony Rose to the early Leica problems is unusual in 2007. It used to be the hallmark of a Leica dealer who was selling a very special camera to a select few. These guys cultivated a lifelong clientle. I have been buying Leica from Ken Hansen since 1976. He came to my help with the M-8 although the camera was from another dealer. It is now becoming an expensive commodity camera as the forum members posts show. Â All the best sloving your problem. Â Stevez4 I Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Flatline Posted January 17, 2007 Share #12 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Yeah, I have to agree, the card should not crash the camera, I've never heard of that on any digital device. Â Some general comments though: Â ALWAYS format your card when you insert it - every time. Â ALWAYS make sure the camera is OFF when you take something out, off, or on. If you're going to take out a memory card, change a lens, or change the battery, make sure you have the camera OFF. Even a small connection might cause a little electric imbalance and cause a little short. Â NEVER use the USB cable. It's just not a good idea to hook your $5,000 camera to another electric device. The current is a risk. Take out the chip into a card reader to retrieve your data. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blovitch Posted January 17, 2007 Share #13 Â Posted January 17, 2007 My 1.09 version M8 (Black) did exactly the same thing. Â Changing SD cards and batteries did not have any effect. Â Both my M8s are now at Solms. Â I'm going to be in Frankfurt in February and I was thinking of visiting them. Â -Tim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
larry Posted January 17, 2007 Share #14 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Brent, Â I'm very sorry to hear about your problem, particularly since you've waited so long. I've had my silver camera since December 27th with no real problems. Â There does seem to be a disturbing trend here, though. I wonder if there might be a problem with the battery contacts in the camera? Â Best of luck, Â Larry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your Old Dog Posted January 17, 2007 Share #15  Posted January 17, 2007 Yeah, I have to agree, the card should not crash the camera, I've never heard of that on any digital device. Some general comments though:  ALWAYS format your card when you insert it - every time.  ALWAYS make sure the camera is OFF when you take something out, off, or on. If you're going to take out a memory card, change a lens, or change the battery, make sure you have the camera OFF. Even a small connection might cause a little electric imbalance and cause a little short.  NEVER use the USB cable. It's just not a good idea to hook your $5,000 camera to another electric device. The current is a risk. Take out the chip into a card reader to retrieve your data.  Absolutly correct on all counts. Each time the camera gets an opportunity to reformat the card, it writes a new FAT file (file allocation table). This is the brain between the camera and the card and tells the where all the files are stored. I always upload with a card reader and reformat when the card goes back into the camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted January 17, 2007 Share #16 Â Posted January 17, 2007 Absolutly correct on all counts. Each time the camera gets an opportunity to reformat the card, it writes a new FAT file (file allocation table). This is the brain between the camera and the card and tells the where all the files are stored. I always upload with a card reader and reformat when the card goes back into the camera. Â Â I have done this with every digital camera I have owned ,make it part of the process. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share #17  Posted January 17, 2007 Not sure if this will work, but... the M8's seem to be very sensitive to sd card compatibility. Make sure your card is on the list. This could be your problem.Good luck.  -Ron  I'm using the Kingston 2GB, which is on the compatibility list. I then tried a SanDisk 512, also on the list, and it didn't work either. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share #18  Posted January 17, 2007 Mine is one of the original 1500 and has not been back to Solms yet. Two weeks ago it went dead. The battery should not have been dead, but I changed to my fully charged spare. No go. Still dead. I took the new one out and re-inserted it. It finally came back on. The really strange thing is that my settings had changed. I always shoot RAW and it was now set for JPEG. It must have completely lost all power. I have shot several hundred shots since then with no more problems (other than the known first generation problems).  I am very happy shooting with this camera and am looking forward to getting past these teething pains. I'm not giving up on the M8.  My M8 is chrome, BTW.  Thanks, Cindy. I did try removing and recharging the battery. I'd like to try a different battery but haven't been able to find one yet. As mine was dying, I also noticed the settings changed from RAW to JPEG. The other thing that happened right before it died is that the image preview stopped and I was not able to recall images, even though they wrote to the card.  I think my best option is to try to get it replaced. From what nearly everyone says, the camera is worth working with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share #19  Posted January 17, 2007 Brent, this may not make you feel better, but YES, I had a similar problem with my chrome M8 (31017888), which came with firmware v1.09. My camera would not recognize the Sandisk 1GB card from my RD-1 initially, but after much fussing and rebooting the M8, I got several absolutely fantastic pics. The smoothness of the image, color accuracy and nuance -plus ease of focus- make the M8 worth any frustration along the way. After a few more instances of dead camera (mine told me it had a shutter fault), I returned it to Leica. I am promised a replacement camera next week, but I am not holding my breath.  Without hesitation though, I know it is worth the wait. You have no idea how good the 35 Summilux and 28 Summicron are until you shoot them with an M8. Makes Velvia look like high-speed Ektachrome.  In Leica's defense, they are a little company. I think their commitment is admirable.  Peter.  Thanks, Peter. I agree with you about the company. I've been using Ms for 25 years and I do think they'll get it right in the end. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted January 17, 2007 Author Share #20  Posted January 17, 2007 SD cards are not identical, so this is certainly a possible source of trouble. However, there is a safe methodology recently presented on theonlinephotographer forum that I would suggest: treat the SD card, when in the camera, as write only -- format it in the camera with the camera firmware before first use (someone mentioned above "the SD card from my RD-1 -- not!) delete in camera only if you must remove the card from the camera and use a card reader to upload to PC or Mac  treat the SD card, as seen from the PC, as read-only -- upload everything, backup to taste, verify, and then reformat in the camera  If one follows this approach, then it should be possible to distinguish problems due to the camera from problems due to the cards, plus it helps to keep from losing shots.  scott  Scott--This is good advice. Unfortunately for me, I did all those things and still got a failure. I used a new card that was on the compatible list, immediately formated it in the camera, shot for the better part of a day and downloaded by removing the card from the camera and using a card reader. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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