twf Posted January 7, 2007 Share #1  Posted January 7, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Disgusted (sorry about the above spelling)   I will probably be stoned by the faithful forum folks, but in any case these are my opinions.  I have been shooting with a Leica M6,M7 for years, and have enjoyed it for a few reasons. the lenses of the Leica are the best. The size of the rangefineder camera fits my neeeds perfectly, and I have become use to the way it feels in hand. If it wasn't for these things I would tell Leica to take the new M8 snd stick it in a dark place. I have not had the honor of spending close to five thousand dollars because my dealer has not come to my name on the list yet, so he now has had my deposit for three months.  I almost feel like a sucker to take mine when Leica can send enough cameras so that one matches my name on the list. It just seems to accept one knowing before getting it that their are some defects in the camera that should be fixed and not just with a filter. Further, I don't like any glass over my lenses because it does take something away from it's quality. I have never used filters for that reason.  I am shooting mainly now with two digital camers, RD1 Epson, and the Canon D5. Neither camera came with knowing defects, and both cameras work well. I find the Canon D5 photographs to be outstnding and the lens quality is just fine. The detail in the photographs are really sharp. I just wish Lecia could get their act together, and that they would keep us informed on what is going on. First, the cameras are not coming in quanity, and nothing further has been said about fixes. It is not a strong well run company today, and I am aftraid they are heading in the wrong direction. The Japanese have taken over the digital world as they have done with cars, so the question is what is the future for Leica? I guess I have seen too many good traditional businesses die because they could not change to compete with the world as it is today. It is a shame becuse I like my Leica's, and I want my M8, and I want to be a fan, but I sure am having a hard time, so toss those stones I can handle them  Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 7, 2007 Posted January 7, 2007 Hi twf, Take a look here Digusted. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
stunsworth Posted January 7, 2007 Share #2 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Errr, the Canon is a 5D. Â If the M8 isn't to your liking or the flaws are too severe for you don't buy it, you'll be wasting your money otherwise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
larry Posted January 7, 2007 Share #3 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Tom, Â It's winter in the northern hemisphere, so it's not unusual for people to be depressed. ;-) Â Leica is a small company and there's a lot of demand for the M8. Their production capacity is a tiny fractions of Canon's or Nikon's. It will take several months for them to fill all the orders. Once you get your M8, I think you'll find that the well-publicized "flaws" really don't have much affect under most shooting conditions. That's why many of these problems weren't discovered until after the first batch of cameras were delivered. I'll be happy when all the problems are resolved but they aren't going to keep me from shooting and enjoying my camera. To this point the only one that's appeared in my photos is the magenta cast on some materials. It's very easy to fix this, but I'll be glad when my filters arrive. As for any decrease in image quality using filters is concerned, in my experience, that's always been an overblown issue. Â Hope your glass gets half full (or more) soon. Â Best, Â Larry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted January 7, 2007 Share #4 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Further, I don't like any glass over my lenses because it does take something away from it's quality. I have never used filters for that reason. Â Then don't buy an M8. Ask for your deposit back. Â Many users have found that they are not troubled by the magenta caste issue, but if you take shots in the mixed light conditions, of black objects made from man-made fibres, you may be affected by it. The only cure is the IR filter. Â Sounds like you are looking for someone to tell you to stay with the Canon... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted January 7, 2007 Share #5  Posted January 7, 2007 Tom,  Mercedes Benz, BMW, Audi, Porsche, Opel and VW seem to be doing very well despite the insurgence of Japanese cars. It therefore doesn't seem reasonable to assume that Leica is doomed in the face of increasing sales of Japanese and Korean cameras.  I will probably be stoned by the faithful forum folks ...... so toss those stones I can handle them  You appear to be intent on attracting negative responses but if you have nothing valuable to contribute then perhaps you should first consider contributing nothing.  Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
macusque Posted January 7, 2007 Share #6 Â Posted January 7, 2007 I'm sorry about your waiting for the camera, although the deposit you had to leave is not up to Leica but to your dealer. I received my M8 in early December and my dealer knew that I would be the first to get it since before Photokina. He never asked me any deposit. Â Anyway I'm sure you'll be more than pleased with the camera once you'll received it. The IR filters don't affect the quality at all, I tested over and over and couldn't detect any difference, only better colors. I use B+W 486 F-PRO. I used to shoot with a 1Ds either with some fine L-lenses, including 35L, 85L, 300/2.8L IS and with some German glass like Leica 19, Zeiss 21 and 50 Zeiss. If anything, I prefer the quality from the Leica M8 (and DMR which I also bought last month). Â It is not a strong well run company today, and I am aftraid they are heading in the wrong direction. The Japanese have taken over the digital world as they have done with cars, so the question is what is the future for Leica? I guess I have seen too many good traditional businesses die because they could not change to compete with the world as it is today. Â I'm sorry but this is one of the reasons why I went Leica... I don't want to see a world dominated only by Nik-Can-Son, it's just so sad that Contax had to go... At Leica they know optics better than anyone in the world and their two sensors (M8 and DMR) are surely among the best you could get now. Â And please leave japanese cars where they are... never driven an M6 ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
twf Posted January 7, 2007 Author Share #7 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I am going to buy it, and I am sure I will enjoy it. You are right too much snow and cold in Santa Fe, over two feet, and I guess I have the winter mood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrism Posted January 7, 2007 Share #8  Posted January 7, 2007 Since you already know that Leica lenses are 'the best' you will appreciate the M8 as the best way of enjoying them in the digital realm.  Two feet of snow, eh? Perhaps that's where our missing snow went to! We are normally covered in the stuff by now in Nova Scotia. My front deck in January '03:  Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  Chris Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!  Chris ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/12945-digusted/?do=findComment&comment=136014'>More sharing options...
twf Posted January 7, 2007 Author Share #9 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Cris, Â You sound so happy. Maybe it is becasue we took your snow. Â Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted January 7, 2007 Share #10 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Many users have found that they are not troubled by the magenta caste issue, but if you take shots in the mixed light conditions, of black objects made from man-made fibres, you may be affected by it. Â Andy, this is the second time I've seen you 'quote' the official Leica line about the IR problem in this forum. If you had actually used the camera you would know that the IR 'contamination' is a much more widespread issue than is implied in your (and Leica's) statement. Â Personally, I think the camera is good enough that I have been happy to work around the IR oversensitivity (especially now that they have been able to obtain suitable filters - no thanks whatsoever to Leica) but to pretend that the problem only affects certain users in certain circumstances doesn't really do anyone any favours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted January 7, 2007 Share #11 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Hang on... I am not spouting anyone's line but my own. There are loads of shots on this forum that don't display the IR problem, even when shot without filters. Â If Tom doesn't want to use filters, then he should just ask for his deposit back and buy something else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
larry Posted January 7, 2007 Share #12 Â Posted January 7, 2007 I've only experienced the magenta cast with man-made fibers and not under all lighting conditions. Still, I'll be happy when my filters arrive. Â Tom, Â It certainly seems as though the western part of the county has gotten all the snow. To this point, we've had a very mild winter in Minneapolis. Maybe that explains my positive attitude! Â Larry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerndReini Posted January 7, 2007 Share #13 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Tom, Â Relax, it will all be good. Just like you I've been waiting for my camera, and I agree that spending all this money for a camera you are not holding in your hands and then reading all this negativity makes you have second thoughts. Â However, I've had the opportunity to test a demo for a couple of days over the weekend, and it wiped away all my concerns. Prints are amazing and all the bugs can be worked around. I used the first version with firmware 1.06 and it had all the problems mentioned on this forum and I would still buy it. I'm happy to hear that the banding and blob issue seems to be mostly fixed. As far as IR magenta goes, it is in your face. Now, since I didn't have an IR cut filter, Jamie's profiles did wonders to the contaminated pictures and they are a great short term solution. Â Here is the most important part: I am also a purist and weary of filters. I happen to own one of the very rare first version aspherical summilux 35s and to protect this beauty I do use a Heliopan UV during the day. For night shots, I usually take it off to avoid reflections when I'm shooting with my MP. I kept this filter on throughout my testing of the M8 to see what kind of problems I can expect from using the IR filter. Now, I know UV and IR are not the same, but I was excited to see that there were NO extra reflections or ghost images with the filter in any of my pictures - and I was taking pictures of decorated shopping windows at night during Christmas time. Â So there you go, I hope this makes you feel a little more at ease with your decision and now stop worrying because it drives all the other waiting list people into depression. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your Old Dog Posted January 7, 2007 Share #14 Â Posted January 7, 2007 I don't know if I'd relax in your situation. I think you dealer may be way down on Leica's list of dealers if you have to wait that long. If you can get your deposite back you should and get on the phone. Work at it and I'll bet you locate one within a months time. If your dealer ain't got you one in 3 months, what makes you thinks he'll get you one in 6 months or a years time? If your dealer has no Leica's at all on the shelf then maybe the factory don't consider him a first rate dealer worthy of their passing by first rate dealers with their limited product... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gesper Posted January 7, 2007 Share #15 Â Posted January 7, 2007 I had never owned a Leica before the M8, having traditionally stayed with Nikon since the '70's. I thought the early M8 images posted were stunning, handled one at my dealer, and bought one in early Novemeber. I'm not happy about the problems, but it still makes the consistently best images by far of any digital camera I have seen (at least in my opinion). So much so that since I sent it back to Solms in early December my other cameras have been gathering dust. I wish I had it back, even with the flaws. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted January 7, 2007 Share #16 Â Posted January 7, 2007 This has to win the award for most pointless thread ever. Give the man a prize! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted January 7, 2007 Share #17  Posted January 7, 2007 Roll on the Coffee Bar/ Members' Bar, I say  Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest flatfour Posted January 7, 2007 Share #18 Â Posted January 7, 2007 As an ex Mercedes, Porsche, BMW, Audi, VW and Rolls-Royce dealership owner I can assure you they all have new model warranty problems, that make Leica's look trivial. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted January 7, 2007 Share #19 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Well I am happy shooting two of them, there doing the job better than anything else i used . getting ready for a week long shoot with them and given a few warts I am not even concerned about the out come and this is for pay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
twf Posted January 7, 2007 Author Share #20 Â Posted January 7, 2007 Thanks for being so nice about about a silly, worthless thread. Â Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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