is there ever an end to my M8 misery?

[leicaM8freak]

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Hi there, please have a look at attached pictures.

One is a close up of the bottom right corner of the original which is attached too, but might not show the problem as clearly.

 

After my (First model) M8 problems that are well known to all, I had an earlier mentioned blocking of the camera which had me to take out the battery before able to use it again, the out of wack focussing, and now this.....first I was blaming the lens ( Tri Elmar) because I did not notice this using my 90 mm.

Then it occured to me that it only was visible in a well out of focus shot.

So I started testing, the pattern is the same with both lenses, and more visible and clearer when focussing from infinite to 1 mtr. (at infinite the pattern is blurry but still visible)

I presume this must be "dirt" on the sensor?

 

Am I correct in this, or is there another problem I did overlook.

Cleaning the sensor as suggested in the manual (using a blow brush without the brush) does not help.

 

FYI, I have NOT been uncareful whilst changing lenses, and did NOT in any way make it possible for anything to actually touch the sensor.

 

 

Help anybody? ( I am getting a bit tired of all this by now)

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[Guest guy_mancuso]

Just need to clean your sensor. New camera's still have grease and such and after some use they get rid of excesive stuff , just like breaking in a car some bolts need tightning down. I have cleaned my M8's twice now and now things have settled in and such. NORMAL

 

Just buy some Sensor Swabs and Eclipse cleaning fluid. Put a little on a sensor swap and wipe in one direction only and it should clean right off. There are some instructions posted somewhere on the net that describes exactly how to do this but it is very simple. The M8 is very easy to clean becuase there is no mirror and it is also very shallow so it is very easy to clean.

 

This is NORMAL folks and is inherent in every digital camera made on the planet

[Englander]

It looks like dust to me. It looks like the kind of dust/dirt that can be blown off the sensor. One of the things that people are going to have to learn is to turn off their cameras before changing lenses and how to clean sensors. It comes with the territory of interchangeable lenses and standard digital sensors. Ultrasonics seem to solve the problem of simple dust but there magic hasn't reached the most expensive digitals yet. Joe

[leicaM8freak]

Thanks for the info Guy.

Will give it a try.

Hope you don't mind me saying, but wouldn't it be nice if this "NORMAL thing" as you call it, would be mentioned in the manual, along with the advise how to get rid of it?

But no the manual states one is NOT ALLOWED to touch the sensor in any way, and if problems like mine occur to get in touch with the dealer and or Leica for a cleaning (for which you get charged) of the sensor.

 

This was a NEW out of the sealed box camera....one at least can expect a clean sensor...or don't you agree?

[Guest guy_mancuso]

I agree and it happens all the time in manufacturing , sort of the nature of the beast. they use clean rooms to install the sensors but they still have to assembly the bodies on all of this digital camera's so there is always loose grease around and by the naked eye most can't be seen.

 

 

now none of the OEM's want you to stick a sensor swab in there to clean it because there afraid most people would screw this up and send it in for a scratched sensor or something. than they would be hammered with repairs . It is just one of those unknown say nothing things they all do , is they don't want you in there playing around . Which is understandable most folks have no clue what there doing. main reason you will never see this in a manual . they would rather they clean them. Which you can do of course if your uncomfortable with it. But every camera i have bought and there have been many i always get this either out of the box or after shooting a couple hundred times the grease gets flying around a little. This normally just goes away but if it continues after some time than send it in.

 

I really hate saying this is normal but the fact is it is and not the exception

[j. borger]

You better start training cleaning the sensor yourself.... the M8 seems to attract a lot of it!

[steve_l]

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After the first time you will find it to be pretty easy....sensor swabs are expensive and you will probably go through a few before you get the hang of it, but just do it.

 

One thing I've found to help is to use a few extra drops of fluid on the swab when going after a really dirty sensor, as yours is.

[leicaM8freak]

As always, thanks for all the back-up and advise.

 

I myself am a veteran with various RF's, but this is my first ever digital.

All the issues coming up so far all have to do with the digital part of it.

 

I would be the last to say a negative word about the files coming from the M8.

 

 

Monday DHL is going to collect my camera for the big tune-up.

I will mention the need for cleaning the sensor and in the meantime dedicate myself to get all the info in this regard I can.

 

It has to be the absolutely perfect camera when it comes back to me...

 

So from me: radio silence until then.

[neelin]

FWIW, a pinhole lens gives fairly soft results but results in wickedly sharp? (or big) dust. Would that be because of the really small pinhole source, allows a relatively large shadow to be cast on the sensor because of a dust fleck?

 

robert

[wattsy]

FWIW, a pinhole lens gives fairly soft results but results in wickedly sharp? (or big) dust. Would that be because of the really small pinhole source, allows a relatively large shadow to be cast on the sensor because of a dust fleck?

 

robert

 

Isn't it because you get virtually infinite depth of field with a pinhole 'lens' and the dust is more in focus?

[Walker]

I have had the same experience and feelings towards it as you. First on my DMR (right out from the box) and then the M8 (also right out of the box). I had no experience with digital, so this Fall brought a very sharp learning curve for me! I finally made the sensors completely clean, and here is what I learned in the process (remember: completely autodidact with the help of some threads here at the forum:

 

1. There are at least three types of dirt: a. Loose dry dust; b. Sticky dry dust; c. Smears of various kinds. Those types demand different cleaning techniques.

2. The best way to discover dust on the sensor is pointing camera towards a bright surface (the sky for instance), with a small aperture opening.

3. Use high quality claning equipment. I chose VisibleDust (http://www.visibledust.com), which is "reassuringly expensive" (as a friend formulated it).

4. Be extremely cautious and take your time - you probably will have to give it several attempts to get rid of all.

5. I started with the VisibleDust Sensor Brush. This brush is rotated on a motor attached before (!) operation. This is to load it with static el. + getting rid of dust particles. When this is finished, the brush is drawn one time over the sensor, mopping up the dust in the process. If you want to repeat, then the brush must first be rotated before applied again. This is extremely important, and I wasted some time learning this lesson. If you don't follow this procedure, you may actually be leaving more dust on the sensor instead of removing it (I did).

6. Smears and sticky dust particles demand other techniques. I ended up with VisibleDust Sensor Clean, which is a fluid developed for this kind of thing. This comes with cotton swabs (a kind of q-tips) which I did not like at all. Instead, I bought some VisibleDust Sensor Swabs. These are rectangular, and cover the whole sensor in one "draw." 2-4 drops of the Sensor Clean is applied, then the Swab is drawn one time (never more than once) over the sensor. Again, if you want to repeat, then the swab must be turned over and get some more Clean.

7. Before point 6. above, it is best to use the Sensor Brush in order to remove any loose dust.

8. Point 7. may have to be reapeated in order to get rid of everything. In all, I must have spent some 5-6 short evenings before I was satisfied with the result. In the end I almost gave up and decided to send the whole thing in for service. After that, and one more attempt, everything seems fine. I now believe my M8 to be alive and sensitive to my intentions!

9. Never ever breath on the sensor. Never use pressured air for blowing on it. Never use cloth or such things on the sensor: you will probably get away with it, but it is not necessary and there is a risk.

 

I think that is all. After some attempts you will get the hang of it, and I imagine more experienced people at this forum perform this routine (or something like it) quite automatically when called for.

 

Best regards

 

Willy

[canlogic]

Is normal to get dort on sensor after some using. Is NOT normal camera to come from factory with already so many dort like this. Is never happen it to me with other. Outside is always some dort going in the air, bat in Leica factory room is suppose be clean it up air, factory man suppose to wore spetial robe and cover up for shoes, everything to keep away dort whilst camera make from parts together. Is big shame on them.

 

Both my Canon 5D and 1DMKII were worse than this right from the factory.

[wilfredo]

Reginald,

 

Here's a website that covers just about everything on cleaning digital cameras:

 

Cleaning Digital Cameras - Introduction

 

I hope this will ease your misery, you deserve a break :-)

 

Happy Shooting,

Wilfredo

Benitez-Rivera Photography

[MarkM6]

I have read that, the Power should be OFF whenever you change the lens (or when the sensor-chamber is open). The arguement is that when the power is ON, the sensor is charged and it attracts dust.

[wilfredo]

Mark makes a very good point. I've never had problems with my Canon 20D, I always turn the camera off and face the camera down when changing lenses. Hopefully the M9 will have a self-cleaning sensor.

 

Cheers,

Wilfredo

Benitez-Rivera Photography

[Guest guy_mancuso]

LOL Guys BIG hole means dust, there is nothing you can do or that is made that will stop dust from big hole. Even if you left lens on all the time , grease will come from the parts too . Like i said BIG hole =dust. Bigger Hole =More dust. It's like water it will get in:D

[marknorton]

I'll just add that when using a swab, take your time to wipe it across the sensor - 2 or 3 seconds in a single steady stroke. Do it once, and once only.

[leicaM8freak]

From this end...many thanks for all the good advise!!! heartwarming!

At least I don't feel that lonely anymore knowing more people have the same problem as I do.

I do not have, and will not be able to get any cleaning pads or fluids befroe Monday, so I will not have a chance to take a "dustfree" picture before the M8 goes back home, to be upgraded.

As said I will enclose a letter and request them to clean the sensor as well.

 

 

Hopefully it will return somewhat dustfree.

 

I think mine is suffering from the " sticky" dust because a blowbrush(without the brush) would not get it of.

 

Anyway, I have a couple of weeks time to get the nessecary materials in to clean the machine myself when it gets back.

 

Thank you very much again for all the kind and very informing replies to my concern!!

 

Reginald, Ireland

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[LJL]

Guy,

I agree with you here. I shoot a lot of equestrian and polo with my Canon 1-series cameras and "sealed" "L" lenses. I have set myself up so to NOT have to remove lenses in the dusty environments where I shoot. Does not matter. I still have to clean (usualy just dust) my sensors every single week. As you say, dust finds a way into a big hole. The only saving grace at times it shooting at f2.8, so dust on the sensor is less obvious in most shots. The minute I stop down to f8 or so, it shows up a lot more. I have already cleaned the M8 sensor a couple of times to remove dust. Have not run into the more sticky/oily stuff yet, but expect it will happen. Cleaning the sensor is just part of the deal with digital cameras that have a removable lens (DSLR or DRF). One learns the procedure, gets the proper tools and jsut deals with it. Not a problem, and not something that all the wishing in the world is going to make go away.

 

LJ

[blakley]

The M8 manual describes how to clean the sensor on page 128. The camera must be ON, and the battery should be fully charged. You select "sensor cleaning" on the main menu, which opens the shutter. When you're done, and AFTER you've taken all your cleaning tools out of the lens throat, you turn the camera off, which closes the shutter and deactivates cleaning mode.