ZM 21mm/2.8: image samples or just feedback

[sisoje]

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Hi,

I would like to see some ZM 21mm images with M8. Can I please ask all you guys (and girls) that already using this combo to give a little bit more info. Any succesfull "home made coding"?

Thanks,

Steven

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[mike prevette]

 

I've been very happy with the lens. The construction is nice, and the focusing "lump" has a nice feel. The hood is well built, but unfourtunatly blocks the lower half of the rangefinder window at close focus (it's clear after about 5')

 

I had it for a few weeks before my M8 got here so I also shot some film with it on my M6 and they played well together. The film looks great.

 

I have coded mine as a leica 21, and it works well. I haven't done any hardcore tests to see how hard it's working, but I can see a slight difference in normal photos.

 

Drawbacks are speed, the hood, and size. Not that 2.8 is really that slow, nor is the lens that much bigger than any other 21mm. In a perfect world it would be a 1.4 and be the size of the new 28

 

You can see some more with the lens on my flickr page, they aren't the best shots for lens comparrison but it's what I got. Flickr: mike@freedomfromgravity's photos tagged with zeiss(all these shots were before I coded the lens, and some of them are crops)

 

_mike

[sisoje]

Thanks Mike,

what method U used for coding? Can U post an image of the rear mount?

Steven

[mike prevette]

Steven see this thread: http://www.leica-camera-user.com/digital-forum/10494-proof-concept-regarding-self-coding-lenses.html9long thread, in the beginning I had the 21 coded as a 50 but later corrected it to a 21)

 

Mark the rear mount, and then you have to hold the preview lever all the way to the right, with lens detection enabled for it to take effect. This is actually quite useful, it becomes a quick on/off for lens correction.

 

_mike

[Cooper]

Hi Mike -

Well the great contrast and composition in your photo above drove me take a peek at your shots on flickr with the 21mm zeiss on the M8 -- really outstanding b&w's you've posted there, creamy blacks and texture. I'm thinking esp. of a shot of a weiss beer (it seems) on a table (togetherfordifferentreasons). That glass glows like the milk in Notorious - and Hitchcock had to put a bulb in there to get that effect. Would you mind sharing your b&w workflow? Looks like you've quickly locked in the 21 with m8. Do you find yourself keeping the lens at a certain aperture, or within a range? Thanks - Steve

[artur5]

Steven see this thread: http://www.leica-camera-user.com/digital-forum/10494-proof-concept-regarding-self-coding-lenses.html9long thread, in the beginning I had the 21 coded as a 50 but later corrected it to a 21)

 

Mark the rear mount, and then you have to hold the preview lever all the way to the right, with lens detection enabled for it to take effect. This is actually quite useful, it becomes a quick on/off for lens correction.

 

_mike

 

Mike, correct me if I'm wrong, but the lens brings the 50/75 frames unlike the Elmarit 21 ( 28/90 frames) so, when you code the ZM 21 as an Elmarit 21/2.8 the camera doesn't recognize correctly the lens because the frames aren't what should be. Now my point is, you have to hold the frame selector all the way, each time you fire the shutter in order to benefit from the in-camera vigneting and future cyan corner corrections ?. If it's so, do you feel comfortable and intuitive shooting this way ?

I have the ZM 21 but not the M8 -not yet - and I wonder if changing the lens bayonet mounting ring for the ring of a ZM 28/2.8 would do the trick, because the Biogon 28 should bring the 28/90 frames. I have also the ZM 35/2, and as far as I know, all the ZM Cosina built lenses share the same lens bayonet ring, only changes the keying flange of course.

I checked the Zeiss site and theoretically it's possible to order spare parts for any lens you wish.

Cheers

Arturo

[mike prevette]

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Thanks for the complements.

 

Ya, having to trigger the correction via the frame select lever is a drag, but it's certianly not a show stopper. I'm using a 21/28mm viewfinder so the range finder frame lines aren't a big deal to me. Also since most of my stuff is very quickly shot spur of the moment type stuff the vignetting correction isn't really that important to me, in fact I think it enhances most of that style stuff. It's usually when I'm carefully composing a more formal shot that I actually have the time to think about weather vignetting would enhance or detract from the shot, and then I remember to push the frame selector over.

 

As far as my BW work flow, I think a lot of you won't like what I have to say. First off I shoot in JPG mode a lot (sat. at BW, sharpness off, contrast at it's lowest). I find the noise pattern of the JPG mode to be much more pleasing than any RAW converter I've used. I have also adopted Lightroom for almost all of my work. I like it so much that most of my photos have never even been opened by photoshop. For me it's a truelly creative fun environment to work in. It's like a traditional darkroom on speed. My technical work flow is very simple I set my whites using the exposure or brightness slider, then set my black with the black slider, then adjust the curve till it works the best for me. I personally am not looking for a very even histogram, I'm looking for one with 90% of the information on either side. You have to be prepared to throw away a LOT of information in order to make a dynamic BW photo from a digital camera. It's called Black and White photography for a reason. If it were about tonality it would be called Grey photography. I used to be a tonality freak (8x10 delta 100 type stuff) but I have sense converted to something that is more "me"

 

As far as a working aperture, i must admit I chuckled a little at that one. WFO (wide.fucking.open) Is how I live my life both for work (cinema) and play (stills). So I would say 2.8 is definitely the aperture most of that stuff is at.

 

_mike

[sisoje]

Thanks for the complements.

 

Ya, having to trigger the correction via the frame select lever is a drag, but it's certianly not a show stopper. I'm using a 21/28mm viewfinder so the range finder frame lines aren't a big deal to me. Also since most of my stuff is very quickly shot spur of the moment type stuff the vignetting correction isn't really that important to me, in fact I think it enhances most of that style stuff. It's usually when I'm carefully composing a more formal shot that I actually have the time to think about weather vignetting would enhance or detract from the shot, and then I remember to push the frame selector over.

 

As far as my BW work flow, I think a lot of you won't like what I have to say. First off I shoot in JPG mode a lot (sat. at BW, sharpness off, contrast at it's lowest). I find the noise pattern of the JPG mode to be much more pleasing than any RAW converter I've used. I have also adopted Lightroom for almost all of my work. I like it so much that most of my photos have never even been opened by photoshop. For me it's a truelly creative fun environment to work in. It's like a traditional darkroom on speed. My technical work flow is very simple I set my whites using the exposure or brightness slider, then set my black with the black slider, then adjust the curve till it works the best for me. I personally am not looking for a very even histogram, I'm looking for one with 90% of the information on either side. You have to be prepared to throw away a LOT of information in order to make a dynamic BW photo from a digital camera. It's called Black and White photography for a reason. If it were about tonality it would be called Grey photography. I used to be a tonality freak (8x10 delta 100 type stuff) but I have sense converted to something that is more "me"

 

As far as a working aperture, i must admit I chuckled a little at that one. WFO (wide.fucking.open) Is how I live my life both for work (cinema) and play (stills). So I would say 2.8 is definitely the aperture most of that stuff is at.

 

_mike

 

 

 

I am totally confused now:

can you code 21mm lens properly that it shows proper frame lines (28)? I read that Mr. S. Reid coded the lens with succes.I would like to get more feedback before Idecide on this lens.

Thanks.

[mike prevette]

Steven the coding and the frame lines are seperate, yet connected. The coding on the lens mount tells the software in the camera which lens you have mounted. But the framelines are controled by a metal tab on the mount itself. Just coding a lens a certian way won't make the camera bring up different frame lines. In order to have the camera recognise your lens not only does the coding have to tell it one thing, but the framelines must match that lens. it's a kind of double check the camera does.

 

_mike

[sean_reid]

I am totally confused now:

can you code 21mm lens properly that it shows proper frame lines (28)? I read that Mr. S. Reid coded the lens with succes.I would like to get more feedback before Idecide on this lens.

Thanks.

 

I was able to code the Zeiss 21 (which I'll be testing shortly for an article on 21 mm RF lenses) but in order to trigger the code I need to hold the frame line selector in the correct position. It's fine for testing but would not work well for me in normal use for color work (since the IR-cut filter would be needed, etc.).

 

Cheers,

[sisoje]

I was able to code the Zeiss 21 (which I'll be testing shortly for an article on 21 mm RF lenses) but in order to trigger the code I need to hold the frame line selector in the correct position. It's fine for testing but would not work well for me in normal use for color work (since the IR-cut filter would be needed, etc.).

 

Cheers,

 

Thanks Sean,

so to make it simple: even if you code the lens, you have to keep your finger on the frame line selector in order to implement the corrections?

Now Sean, did you try the lens with IR-cut filter? And with the proper frame lines what are the results.

I just need to find out all I can before deciding to buy this lens. I would not be happy to get it for my (future) M8 and use it with "restrictions or limitations".

Does this apply to other ZM lenses as well (at this moment I have 28mm/2.8 and 50mm/2.0)

Thanks.