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M10, MM mk1 and Q


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My first Leica was an M9 and I suppose those years were getting into the Leica mindset, now firmly implanted. Have a nice set of Leica M glass (21, 35, 50, 90, 135).

 

For reasons of ISO and colour, sold the M9 and bought a Q and MM mk1, both of which I love, use the latter most.

 

So the question is, given I have limited financial resources, will the M10 meet my MM b&w and ISO satisfaction levels so that I can trade both the Q and MM for an M10, or do I sell one of the kids and keep the Q, trading the MM for an M10? Buying an M10 in addition to MM and Q is not an option, and then I would have too many cameras (which for many is not possible, but is for me, also having an M7, Mamiya, Bronica and a couple of Sony's - although these are shared with my kids).  

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For me, performance at ISO 6400 is the benchmark. I found as many M10 raw files as I could in that range, processed them to taste, and made a few prints. Comparing similar but not identical M9M files of my own, there is a subtle but meaningful-to-me difference that favors the Monochrom. It becomes apparent upon critical but bare-eye inspection of 10" wide prints, and on close but casual inspection of 20" wide prints (at least using Piezography K7 carbon matte on Canson Velin 315). M9M images simply stay transparent longer, whether for higher magnifications, higher sensitivities, or both. I don't want to say it is a big difference, but if we didn't care about subtleties we probably wouldn't be shooting with Leica gear in the first place.

 

The M10 offers numerous advantages over the M9M. Even though ultimate tonal quality for B&W photos taken at high sensitivities isn't one of those advantages, the files are good that I could imagine many discerning photographers being quite pleased with the complete package that the M10 offers. I anticipate sticking with the M9M until repairs and service become prohibitive, which is another topic entirely. :-)

 

Hope this helps,

Jon

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Hope this helps,

Jon

 

Thanks Jon, it helps to confirm the impossibility of the position I'm in. The M9M just produces very special images. Would I miss it? I dropped my M9M in the sea 6 months ago and I held on 2 days after getting the insurance money before replacing it. The Q is equally addictive, and I normally carry both (in the mini Courierware bag). I think I'll have to sell one of the kids. More practically, I think I will have to test one at a dealer, stew on it a bit and I think the odds are tipping towards the M9M to M10 change. I had a plan to get one when Trump leaves office, so I should be OK for the summer holidays. Just booked a trip with the wife to lots of the historic/gastronomic towns in Spain - Bilbao, Salamanca, Valladolid, Caceres, Seville, Toledo, Madrid. Added up the bill, flights and car hire and came to within about $5 of the price of an M10. A message from God.  

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Wait for monochrome m10. It will be worth the wait.

NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO. NO.  and NO. again !!!!

 

Like Jon, given the choice I would keep the M9M until bits fell off, and bits are more likely to fall off me before that happens.

Replacing my M9M with insurance cash, could have got the more recent version for not a lot more, but stuck with the M9M. The balance of cash from my "new for old" policy also paid for most of a 35 Cron, as they happily paid out on the list price of a Typ 246. Only time I was happy that Leica had increased their prices. 

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Wait for monochrome m10. It will be worth the wait.

 

I do appreciate you are an uncompromising snapper living in a largely inanimate colour-free world. Leica can easily do that to you, it's starting to do it to me. I was wondering, do you combine your love of chickens with cooking? Whenever I think of not having my M9M I look at some images and think I must be mad. Here's my mate Tony ordering an Uber last week and some oversize poultry (quite heavily cropped, those things are dangerous) that we saw on our walk, which I hope you appreciate.

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 I have the M10 and MM1. The M10 is a great camera. Is responsive, fast, very good IQ, feels perfect in the hand, impressive high ISO performance, broad DR... But the MM1 files remain untouchable. I compared some M10 B&W conversion files with MM1´s and there is not contest. I will keep my MM1 forever. My advise is don´t dump the MM1, you will regret it.

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 I have the M10 and MM1. The M10 is a great camera. Is responsive, fast, very good IQ, feels perfect in the hand, impressive high ISO performance, broad DR... But the MM1 files remain untouchable. I compared some M10 B&W conversion files with MM1´s and there is not contest. I will keep my MM1 forever. My advise is don´t dump the MM1, you will regret it.

 

You've changed my mind for the third time today.

I have compared Q files of the same image converted to b&w and there is a palpable difference in quality. The Q is comparable to the M10 to some extent due to it having broadly the same Maestro II processor.  

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I do appreciate you are an uncompromising snapper living in a largely inanimate colour-free world. Leica can easily do that to you, it's starting to do it to me. I was wondering, do you combine your love of chickens with cooking? Whenever I think of not having my M9M I look at some images and think I must be mad. Here's my mate Tony ordering an Uber last week and some oversize poultry (quite heavily cropped, those things are dangerous) that we saw on our walk, which I hope you appreciate.

How strange a response. I also have color in my world. But I don't feel this is worthy of an explanation.

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For reasons of ISO and colour, sold the M9 and bought a Q and MM mk1, both of which I love, use the latter most.

 

 

Did the same, but now: MM1 ...gone, Q ... gone, got M10 now and happy to have one for all :)

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For reasons of ISO and colour, sold the M9 and bought a Q and MM mk1, both of which I love, use the latter most.

 

 

Did the same, but now: MM1 ...gone, Q ... gone, got M10 now and happy to have one for all :)

 

That was my masterplan that would not involve any financial hardship, but I think I would miss the Q.

 

Maybe trade the M9M for an M10 and see if I still use the Q. 

 

Very glad to hear it's worked out for you, but still early days with your M10. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

The Q is comparable to the M10 to some extent due to it having broadly the same Maestro II processor.  

 

I do not think the processor has a significant influence on image quality.  The image sensor makes the biggest difference.  Although the sensor of the M10 is said to be developed starting from experience with the Q and SL it is not the same sensor as in the Q and SL.

 

That was my masterplan that would not involve any financial hardship, but I think I would miss the Q.

 

 

Only advantage of the Q would be it's a more compact camera and has video.  If that is important then keeping the Q along the M10 might be a good idea.  If video is not important for you the Q will become a dust collector.  I'm sure you will grab the M10 most of the time.  It's a very good camera if you can live within it's narrow scope of use.

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Seriously - this is just case of GAS. Wait it out and it will pass.

 

Your MM1 and Q combo sounds ideal for what you do at the moment. The M10 will still be there if you change your mind - but your MM1 will be hard to replace, and you will miss autofocus of the Q just when you need it most.

 

Save you money and wait for the M11 with a slightly higher pixel count and genuinely new sensor.

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Seriously - this is just case of GAS. Wait it out and it will pass.

 

Your MM1 and Q combo sounds ideal for what you do at the moment. The M10 will still be there if you change your mind - but your MM1 will be hard to replace, and you will miss autofocus of the Q just when you need it most.

 

Save you money and wait for the M11 with a slightly higher pixel count and genuinely new sensor.

Shouldn't that be "buy and it will pass?"

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The Monochrom (original) is non-negotiable in my mind -- I would not sell it for any reason. It's special. That said, the M10 is a beautiful and fast camera (no time-outs when shooting more than a few high ISO images) and is almost everything, I think, I wanted a digital M to be. But I don't think that would ever stop me from using the MM.

 

The Q, on the other hand, is the perfect companion. It has auto-focus (hey, sometimes that's really really nice -- but it also goes into manual beautifully), macro (am I the only one that occasional gets frustrated at the 1m or 0.7m near focusing limitation of an M?, and colour for when you need it.

 

Mind you, I don't have a Q but I've kept on lusting after one... Perfect travel combo, a 50mm on the MM and the 28mm of the Q, IMO... I say keep what you have and be happy.

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Personally, if you're curious enough about the M10, I would sell the MM1 and give it a go. The Q gives you a casual auto-focus option and it sounds like you would miss that. If you have a change of heart in the near future, the M10 would still retain most of its value — and you can repurchase the MM1 again (they're only ever getting cheaper after all!)

 

P.S. I have an MM1 as well and I know exactly how you feel about this camera.  

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