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One month in Europe - Leica X 113 or M8?


leicadude

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Greetings. Some of you are no doubt M users so I would like your opinions and others:

 

I am planning a one month trip to Europe in the summer and would like to take one main camera. I already own the Leica X 113 but always wanted to step up(?) or over(?) to either M8 or M6. Does it make sense to make the change before taking a trip? I am really interested in getting into the rangefinder M at some point and this trip will give me a chance to shoot a lot. Would a M8 or M6 (yes, film) be a compromise in image quality. Or does it makes more sense to buy the EVF 020 and stick with the 113 as it is newer? My DLux 5 will be the backup.

 

Just interested in your thoughts out there.

 

Thanks!

Rudy

 

 

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first step to M 

take the Leica T, good price to performance, one M Lens (35mm) with Adapter, buy in Europe same second hand Lenses on demand. When you are happy with this Combination, go the next Step and think about the M10. I have both, the Leica T and the Leica SL, both with the M Lenses and there are great for me. The most used Lens vor me is the Lux 50mm, but think about the crop on the T. The Leica SL comes after the M240 goes, my eyes was the Problem, the Focus with the Viewfinder is hard to get good Fotos with it.

Sorry for my english, i`m German

Edited by pietchen
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Given the digital option of today with instant feedback, I would not use a film rangefinder for a one month trip, if you haven't had a couple of month shooting experience before, along with the option of reviewing the results. The rangefinder experience is too idiosyncratic, if this is the proper word for it.

 

Keep in mind using film also has some risk of being passed through a wrongly configured airport scanner, trashing your celluloid memories.

 

The M8 again is too divaesque with IR - I would not bother with it anymore. Keep in mind you want lenses, too, and the M8 as the only Leica-M has a crop factor.

 

So - if you can swing it, get yourself a used M9/E with some mileage and potentially swapped sensor, along with a Voigtlander 1.5/50 and maybe one or two other - not too challenging - lenses, such as a 3.5/90, and a 2.5/35. The M9 should be available at good prices now with the advent of the M10.

 

Cheers

Ivo

 

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Greetings. Some of you are no doubt M users so I would like your opinions and others:

 

I am planning a one month trip to Europe in the summer and would like to take one main camera. I already own the Leica X 113 but always wanted to step up(?) or over(?) to either M8 or M6. Does it make sense to make the change before taking a trip? I am really interested in getting into the rangefinder M at some point and this trip will give me a chance to shoot a lot. Would a M8 or M6 (yes, film) be a compromise in image quality. Or does it makes more sense to buy the EVF 020 and stick with the 113 as it is newer? My DLux 5 will be the backup.

 

Just interested in your thoughts out there.

 

Thanks!

Rudy

 

Interested in your Avatar - classic car or bike fan?

 

I don't think it's a good idea to buy a new camera just before a trip - you want to be familiar with your gear, but it sounds like you may have time to do that.

 

Firstly you really need to decide if you want to shoot film rather than digital. There's no issue of quality difference - film is a different medium. I happen to prefer film over digital, ultimately, but I do shoot a lot of digital now out of convenience and cost issues.

 

The M8 is still a great camera but you need to bear in mind the crop factor (1.3X approx) and the fact you need UV/IR filters for colour work. Also they seem to be quite hard to find and dare I say it, over priced for a used camera which cannot be repaired if the screen is faulty. 

 

An M9 is a better proposition but more expensive of course and then you need to factor in the cost of a lens or two.

 

When you think about it, there is still a big gap in the Leica range for someone who has bought one of their compact cameras and then shows interest in 'upgrading'. You either have to switch to rather different and limited T system or fork out huge sums for an M or SL.

 

My advice would be to keep your X camera which is a good travel camera with an all rounder 35mm lens, and if you're interested in film, buy a camera to try it out with - maybe not a Leica M at first, there is an abundance of great used film equipment out there. As you're going travelling look at one of the better compacts, such as an Olympus XA (which is a rangefinder but hardly bigger than a cigarette packet) or one of the autofocus compact zoom cameras which will give you more reach than your Leica X (you could look for a Leica Minilux zoom!).

 

Best of both worlds.

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Interested in your Avatar - classic car or bike fan?

 

 

When you think about it, there is still a big gap in the Leica range for someone who has bought one of their compact cameras and then shows interest in 'upgrading'. You either have to switch to rather different and limited T system or fork out huge sums for an M or SL.

 

 

 

(James, on the side note about the avatar, it reminds me of my visit to the Ace Cafe in London with my old Leica X1. I am fan of classic car and bike but not a collector. I own a newer 911 and an older Ducati Supersport. Both are great fun :). Thanks for asking!)

 

You bring up a good point about the big gap from X to M. It's a huge jump that I was hoping to bridge with an M6 or M8 / Voigtlander. Either of these M's should not lose much money in the next couple of years. It's all about timing

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One thing is for sure. If you take the X113 and nothing else, you will come back a better photographer, you will really learn the X....and get some fantastic images along the way! ....that's three things :)  I've traveled regularly over the past 10 years and not always with an M or much gear at all and find I bond with whatever I have along.....less is more!

 

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The first question should be.....
Do you want to mess with film and processing?

Take the Leica X 113 as your main camera, DLux 5 as additional focal length lenses. This is a great kit to enjoy your trip and make photographs.
 I used this until I went to the M240 and got a case of serious GAS......which is almost under control.
 

Shoot with the 113 depending on your end product .........what more will you need?

..........also its very liberating to work with one lens and travel light

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The first question should be.....

Do you want to mess with film and processing?

 

Take the Leica X 113 as your main camera, DLux 5 as additional focal length lenses. This is a great kit to enjoy your trip and make photographs.

 I used this until I went to the M240 and got a case of serious GAS......which is almost under control.

 

Shoot with the 113 depending on your end product .........what more will you need?

..........also its very liberating to work with one lens and travel light

 

 

+1 I think the X is a great travel camera and I woud not want to experiment with a new system during vacation.

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Have you considered the Q? That might be the option you need. I have the X 113, and would happily take it on holiday - which I will do this summer, but I would like the Q option and am current saving for one... Just a thought.

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One thing is for sure. If you take the X113 and nothing else, you will come back a better photographer, you will really learn the X....and get some fantastic images along the way! ....that's three things :)  I've traveled regularly over the past 10 years and not always with an M or much gear at all and find I bond with whatever I have along.....less is more!

That is a fair point, the lighter you go the more you explore what you have to hand. 

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A month-long trip is not the place to learn how to shoot film. Stick with what you know (the X), concentrate on getting some good pictures with it, and you'll have a more enjoyable trip. Learn to shoot film in a more familiar environment (home) before taking it on the road. And when you do, don't worry about scanners at security checkpoints, just keep your film out of checked luggage.

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Thank you all for you opinions so far. Appreciate you taking the time to respond!

 

My last extended trip to Europe involved a Canon film camera and many rolls of slide and negative film. Those where the days! I still shoot my Yashica T4 Super D occasionally which yields such a different result from anything digital. Variety is great!  :)

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Shooting film defiantly yields a different result from digital as does working with one lens or creating an assignment or theme when you go out for the day......Say today everything I shoot will be in Black and White or whatever
 
So tell us ......Do you want to revisit the film experience.....Why?

Is there something you want to accomplish with this particular trips photography?
Have you exhausted the possibilities of the X113? .......and the Dlux 5
 
Before buying cameras you may want to ask yourself some questions.
Or maybe you just want a new camera....nothing wrong with that
 

There are no wrong answers.......but for me defining a purpose always helps me make better photos.

 

In full disclosure, after shooting film for 30 years.....and giving it up in the late 90's, for me there is no reason to go back....with the vast possibilities of digital and the "computer darkroom". My knowledge of film photography is the spring board for the current medium.....but that's me.

Edited by ECohen
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Shooting film defiantly yields a different result from digital as does working with one lens or creating an assignment or theme when you go out for the day......Say today everything I shoot will be in Black and White or whatever

 

So tell us ......Do you want to revisit the film experience.....Why?

Is there something you want to accomplish with this particular trips photography?

Have you exhausted the possibilities of the X113? .......and the Dlux 5
 
Before buying cameras you may want to ask yourself some questions.
Or maybe you just want a new camera....nothing wrong with that
 

There are no wrong answers.......but for me defining a purpose always helps me make better photos.

 

In full disclosure, after shooting film for 30 years.....and giving it up in the late 90's, for me there is no reason to go back....with the vast possibilities of digital and the "computer darkroom". My knowledge of film photography is the spring board for the current medium.....but that's me.

 

 

Thanks ECohen. All good questions! No way I have exhausted the possibilities of the X113 and I doubt very few owners of the X113 have done that! ;) The same way, I did not get to the Leica by exhausting the possibilities of a my previous cameras. It's interesting and fun to explore and at times you hit something really interesting and spend more time on it or look at the next step. It just looks and sounds interesting to shoot the real deal rangefinder at some point. I do appreciate the thoughts from a 30 year film veteran! :) 

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I still have an M8 but in your situation I would not use it as you propose. Perhaps for a long weekend. Like others, I endorse the view that your existing kit would be my choice, thus freeing your mind from going up a new learning curve.

 

An alternative might be an X Vario. Similar sensor size to your X113 but with an excellent zoom lens. Its main drawback stems from a bungled marketing launch by Leica. It is worth looking at the thread dedicated to pictures recently taken by late adopters who are using this camera.

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"It just looks and sounds interesting to shoot the real deal rangefinder at some point."
 
It is  but embrace the new and do it digitally. You can do everything on the computer that film could do, better, cheaper and faster. And because its instantaneous, its more fun. Also digital has the added benefit of learning the craft, faster as making mistakes cost you nothing.
 

Unless you have deep pockets or make big prints go used...... collect lenses....... expect GAS  ;)

 

........and work on your Post Processing. Just like film needed great skill in the darkroom so does digital.

 

Hope this helps.
 

Edited by ECohen
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...embrace the new and do it digitally. You can do everything on the computer that film could do, better, cheaper and faster. And because its instantaneous, its more fun. Also digital has the added benefit of learning the craft, faster as making mistakes cost you nothing.

 

Unless you have deep pockets or make big prints go used...... collect lenses....... expect GAS  ;)

 

........and work on your Post Processing. Just like film needed great skill in the darkroom so does digital.

 

 

Thanks. Digital is great, I agree, and I am sticking with it in the end. That is why the subject says X113 or M8. The M9 would be even better as pointed out, but much more money. The M6 is such a cool camera and could be the cheapest way to try a true Leica rangefinder experience without losing resale value in the end.  :D

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I love this medium and COOL is always a good reason to buy a camera....really
 
Truthfully if your young......I'd wait for a good deal on an M9 or a M240. We choose photography less for the tools and more for the joy of slowing down life and sharing what we see.
 
Your X113 complemented by the lens choices of the Dlux 5 is such a great kit. Unless you just have to move on to more/different stuff I'd stick with them and work on technique.
 
But If your like me you've already made up your mind.......you just want to share. :)

Do what makes you happy..... in the end that all that matters.

 

One more thing....."cheapest way" get this out of your mind.....nothing cheap about Leica. Your go down the M path...... it leads to lenses.

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