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fotografr

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Jaap,

 

Are images not supposed to provoke discussion? There is nothing wrong with the free exchange of ideas, particularly when they are motivated by photographs.

 

The photographs I posted were political by their nature. If you are going to unilaterally decide they cannot be discussed in that context, maybe you should just expand the rule and say no political images can be posted.

 

I really didn't appreciate having my thread locked before I even had the opportunity to reply to someone who twisted my comment and read in his own I inaccurate conclusion.

 

Now I suppose this one will just be summarily removed.

Edited by fotografr
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Sorry, but politics are against the forum rules, and the alternative was to delete the thread. Of course journalistic type photographs have a place in this forum, but the discussion should be about the photographic merits of the images, not the political implications.

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Brent -

 

I LOVED the first photo posted in your locked thread.  It deserves prime time.

Photos of these events should be encouraged and discussion about the photographs should be similarly encouraged.   This keeps us all internet friends.  

Discussion of the politics to which the photos relate should - as Jaap says - be avoided.  Not sure why you want to provoke a discussion of politics that, in an internet discussion, only has one certain result which is to quickly turn internet friends into internet enemies and hurt people's feelings.  I am sure that you do not want to do this.  I am also sure that there are other internet forums and mediums (like Facebook and Twitter) that could be good outlets for you to share your photos and provoke and engage in political discussion.  I just agree with Jaap that this forum is not the forum.

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I do understand that the rule exists but I don't agree with it. It seems to me we are adults here and ought to be able to express differing points of view that are triggered by images, whether the subject matter is politics, religion, sex or whatever. I truly do not understand the notion that we need to be protected from each other's words. If things become too heated, one always has the option to not respond and move on to another thread.

 

Adam, you are correct that I have no desire to hurt anyone's feelings nor to be insulting. But when someone incorrectly interprets something I posted, I think it's only fair that I have the opportunity to respond. Locking my thread prevented me from doing that.

 

The images I posted are a political statement in and of themselves. In my opinion, it's absurd to not be allowed to discuss them in that context and talk about the reason for 100,000 people showing up to march in this mid-sized Midwestern town.

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Sorry, but politics are against the forum rules, and the alternative was to delete the thread. Of course journalistic type photographs have a place in this forum, but the discussion should be about the photographic merits of the images, not the political implications.

 There is currently another thread showing images from a similar march in Cleveland. Someone posted the following comment:

 

"...and well done ladies!

Go on

Thomas"

 

That is clearly a political comment. If there is going to be consistent enforcement, this thread should also now be locked.

 

Can you see how silly this all gets?

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Documentary photographs that provoke discussion? Hardly an unheard of concept in the world of Leica! It's absurd not to allow Leica photos to do what they're good at on a Leica forum.

 

I do appreciate the dilemma faced by the forum authorities but the ban on politics is a poor answer to the problem. It isn’t possible to document momentous events without making a statement about their significance. To let photos of events around the inauguration of the 45th president go by without comment on the political implications or his fitness for office is to ignore a massive elephant in the room.

 

My solution is simple. Do not ban topics. Take action against posters who breach forum rules about civility and respect for other posters. In other words, moderate the manner of discussion, not the subject being discussed!

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I'm fine with any rules Andreas sets - you can appeal to him. For the time being, we have a no-politics rule. For good reason IMO.

The topic was not banned. It was locked exactly because I did not want to delete the photographs as they were within our rules.

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Thanks for the advice, Jaap, but, as you very well know, the site owner is much more likely to listen to you than me and your mind’s made up.

 

But it seems that not all of your fellow moderators observe a no political comment on photos rule. From the thread you locked, here is an unmistakably political comment posted by moderator erl:

 

“As a document, the images are momentus [sic].
It makes me wonder how Americans got it so wrong, IMO.
And the same marches are happening world wide.
Now we all have to live with the result. Let's hope it works, somehow.”

 

It’s good to see erl on the side of the angels but it doesn’t help in the consistent application of forum rules.

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Why is it not good enough to discuss politics in the Barnack's Bar section of the Forum???

 

Why do people feel the need to clutter the photo forum with personal opinions that are only bound to cause strife???

 

Do you not know how to use Facebook and Twitter??  

 

These are reportage photos and the merits of them are in the composition, exposure, rendition and the mood that they capture.  Is this not enough material to discuss in this Photo Forum??

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About the Bar, yes and no. Basically the no politics rule applies there as well, but sometimes, depending on the occasion, we will let a thread run, as long as it remains respectful. That is, however, at the discretion of Andreas and the moderators.

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About the Bar, yes and no. Basically the no politics rule applies there as well, but sometimes, depending on the occasion, we will let a thread run, as long as it remains respectful. That, however, is not a precedent.

 

You’re almost agreeing with me, Jaap, that it’s the way a subject is discussed that should be policed rather than the subject itself. Progress!

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You’re almost agreeing with me, Jaap, that it’s the way a subject is discussed that should be policed rather than the subject itself. Progress!

 

yes but as far as I am aware such discussion has generally NEVER been allowed in the PHOTO forum.

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You’re almost agreeing with me, Jaap, that it’s the way a subject is discussed that should be policed rather than the subject itself. Progress!

And you are almost agreeing, Robert, that a preemptive closing can be a wise action ;)

 

I like narrow middle grounds :)

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And you are almost agreeing, Robert, that a preemptive closing can be a wise action ;)

 

I like narrow middle grounds :)

 

I am in complete agreement with you, Jaap, that you are wise to close a thread when it is threatens to become uncivil or abusive. To my mind, the subject being discussed is beside the point.

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Seems to me the most appropriate place to discuss the political point of view depicted in images of an event is alongside the images being referenced, not in a completely separate section.

 

Why are we so afraid of having a free exchange of ideas, even if the discussion becomes heated? Are people on this forum really so thin skinned that they can't tolerate a few words of criticism from a total stranger on the internet? I think not.

 

In the event someone gets completely out of line, the mod can just delete the post and warn the individual. To assume none of us are capable of discussing politics without becoming abusive is just plain wrong.

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I wish it were that simple. We have had to ban too many valuable members over silly disputes, not to mention that the moderators prefer to participate in the forum instead of having to act like schoolmasters in playground squabbles.

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