Am i missing something?

[krazypara3165]

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So, stopped by real camera in Manchester last week and my fiancée treated me to a iiia.

 

Now, I'm looking at lenses but don't know where to go. I'll only be using the camera occasionally at 1940's weekends so don't want to go overboard too much as my DSLR lenses have already cost me more than enough.

 

The thing is, I keep seeing 'inexpensive' and 'elmar' used in sentences.... But I'm yet to see one under £170!! Then there's the summitar and summicron that are double that.

 

This leaves me with the collapsible industar lens that can be picked up from £30 and over or something like a canon 1.8 for around £130 (not collapsible, but that's not the end of the world)

 

An I missing something?

[Robert M Poole]

Industar lenses are Russian copies of German lenses and quality control with these was not always great. You can pick up some really nice copies if you are lucky. These don't always focus correctly and need shims putting in (from what I've heard not personal experience). I'm not sure how much you know about cameras so I don't want to start patronise you by talking about speed of lenses etc. Real Camera is a great shop, make sure to stop in at Leica Store Manchester too as the service is next to none and they will let you try out lenses. Enjoy the iiia

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[krazypara3165]

Industar lenses are Russian copies of German lenses and quality control with these was not always great. You can pick up some really nice copies if you are lucky. These don't always focus correctly and need shims putting in (from what I've heard not personal experience). I'm not sure how much you know about cameras so I don't want to start patronise you by talking about speed of lenses etc. Real Camera is a great shop, make sure to stop in at Leica Store Manchester too as the service is next to none and they will let you try out lenses. Enjoy the iiia

Cheers for the fast reply - I've not been in to the Leica shop yet - I was not sure if it sold the old lenses (I presumed they mainly dealt with new cameras) I'm aware of speeds ect which was why I'd mentioned the Canon lens that should be considerably faster. Still, It would be nice to have something original with it. 

 

I've read that the industar lenses can be hit or miss but at the cost if they can be made to take reasonable pictures then I would be happy enough. 

[earleygallery]

An I missing something?

 

Sounds like you're missing a lens!

 

The prices you mention are 'cheap' in Leica terms, but you should be able to find a good black scale 5cm Elmar f3.5 for around £100, which is a super little lens and a perfect match for your llla.

 

You may find focussing issues with a Russian lens and other options are going to cost the same or more than an Elmar anyway.

 

Just keep looking.

[Robert M Poole]

Cheers for the fast reply - I've not been in to the Leica shop yet - I was not sure if it sold the old lenses (I presumed they mainly dealt with new cameras) I'm aware of speeds ect which was why I'd mentioned the Canon lens that should be considerably faster. Still, It would be nice to have something original with it. 

 

I've read that the industar lenses can be hit or miss but at the cost if they can be made to take reasonable pictures then I would be happy enough. 

 

Leica Store Manchester sell a lot of new stuff but they do have lots of old stuff (though nothing for the prices you want). I picked up a great Helios 44-2 for using on my Fuji XE1 and it's sharp and contrasty and fast, no fungus just a beautiful lens and cheap as chips.  There is always a premium on Leica lenses though, they are much sought after and you pay for the red dot (which increases the image quality obviously!!)

[krazypara3165]

Thank

 

Sounds like you're missing a lens!

 

The prices you mention are 'cheap' in Leica terms, but you should be able to find a good black scale 5cm Elmar f3.5 for around £100, which is a super little lens and a perfect match for your llla.

 

You may find focussing issues with a Russian lens and other options are going to cost the same or more than an Elmar anyway.

 

Just keep looking.

 

 

Thanks, I guess I'll keep looking. I've seen a few on ebay but whilst I have no issues using ebay i'm always dubious about buying lenses from it. The ones i had seen went for around the £80 mark. There was a red scale elmar that went for £65 but I kept clear as it was from a seller in Peru with no previous history and as it stands I wouldnt be able to tell apart a fake and the real deal. 

 

I may bite the bullet and fork out - I can get one from real cameras for around £160 but at least it would come with a warranty and I know it would be in great condition. 

[Robert M Poole]

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Thank

 

 

 

Thanks, I guess I'll keep looking. I've seen a few on ebay but whilst I have no issues using ebay i'm always dubious about buying lenses from it. The ones i had seen went for around the £80 mark. There was a red scale elmar that went for £65 but I kept clear as it was from a seller in Peru with no previous history and as it stands I wouldnt be able to tell apart a fake and the real deal.

 

I may bite the bullet and fork out - I can get one from real cameras for around £160 but at least it would come with a warranty and I know it would be in great condition.

Real Camera also have an eBay page, might save you a trip.

 

www.robertpoolephotography.com

[duckrider]

Those sexy small L-mount Voigtländers, they are made for You

 

https://cameraquest.com/voigtlen.htm

 

Thomas

[TomB_tx]

The Canon 50mm f1.8 in LTM mount is a very nice lens, and not expensive in Leica terms. The older all chrome version looks at home on a Leica III series. The slightly later black and chrome is more common and thus some less, and I use one on my IIIIf. Unlike the Russian lenses, the Canon work fine on Leica.

You find that the Leica LTM lenses sell for more than you would expect, based on the body prices. That's because the lenses can be used with modern Leicas and many other digital bodies, while the old bodies are dedicated to film.

That said, a III series body really should have a 50 Elmar to complete the effect. There are also several Japanese copies of the 3.5 Elmar design which are nice, but they are more scarce, and thus won't save much.

[krazypara3165]

Cheers all. Sadly Real camera store only has a fraction of their stock on Ebay - a good example is they have no iii's online yet have over 20 in store! its not too far out of my way anyway. 

 

Just checked the Voigtländers too - it appears most of the ones I would be interested in are discontinued sadly. 

[spydrxx]

I've bought most of my Leica gear on Ebay for the last 15 years or so, with very few issues, all of which were swiftly resolved.  Doing your own due diligence is absolutely critical however, and your own research on the lenses prior to even considering what is being offered is likewise super super important. You may well need to ask sellers to check on certain things and/or send you specific pictures before committing...like has thee lens been CLA's anf if so by whom and when, is the diaphragm smooth and no oil on the blades. When shining a flashlight thru the lens are there signs of dist, haze, mold, fungus, oil spots or separation of the elements. Knowledgable sellers can answer these questions...many cannot...this is where you begin taking chances, so you begin to think in terms of tradeoffs...is the price sufficiently low to compensate for not knowing the condition, does the sell offer returns, etc. For instance I recently had to cancel a sale on a 135 Tele-Elmar because while all looked fine in the pictures, price and condition was right, but one set of distance numbers had been blackened out by previous owner. I took a chance and made an offer which was accepted, but learned later that the serial number put that lens in the category where the lens head wasn't removable  (which I wanted for Visoflex usage)....dumb me. Seller graciously cancelled sale.

[michaelwj]

So, stopped by real camera in Manchester last week and my fiancée treated me to a iiia.

 

Now, I'm looking at lenses but don't know where to go. I'll only be using the camera occasionally at 1940's weekends so don't want to go overboard too much as my DSLR lenses have already cost me more than enough.

 

The thing is, I keep seeing 'inexpensive' and 'elmar' used in sentences.... But I'm yet to see one under £170!! Then there's the summitar and summicron that are double that.

 

 

An I missing something?

 

 

I think you are missing the calibration to Leica prices. "Inexpensive" and "£170" go together perfectly well in Leica land! Some hoods go for double (and even triple) that.

If you are patient, take the time to learn, and keep watch, you should be able to find one significantly cheaper than that. Of course buying from a reputable dealer will be more expensive as you are paying for their knowledge, service, and taking on the risk. Any savings you get from eBay or wherever are offset with your time. As with many things, you can spend money or time (or both once you get into collecting...).

[krazypara3165]

Cheers - its all still a bit of a learning curve. Ive got my eye out on ebay but i need to learn as much as I can about what i need to be looking for. as it stands the canon lens seems to be the best compromise between quality and price but if I can pick up a leica lens for a reasonable price I'll get one. 

[michaelwj]

Cheers - its all still a bit of a learning curve. Ive got my eye out on ebay but i need to learn as much as I can about what i need to be looking for. as it stands the canon lens seems to be the best compromise between quality and price but if I can pick up a leica lens for a reasonable price I'll get one. 

 

 

The Canon lenses are excellent regardless of price. Also the Nikkor Leica thread mount 50 1.4s are great, but getting back up there in price...

 

Typically, the Canon and Nikkor lenses had more durable coatings at the time, so survive in generally better condition.

 

There is nothing wrong with using a non Leica lens on your Leica. Robert Frank used a Nikkor 50mm for much of him Americans work, and DDD famously used the 85mm Nikkor (and other focal lengths?) during the Korean war after visiting the Nikon factory and trying them out for himself (or whatever the story is...).

Edited December 8, 2016 by michaelwj

[krazypara3165]

So - A colleague today pointed me in the direction of Peter Loy's website! The prices are better than I have seen so far (looking at a summitar 2.0) but I'd imagine the postage would ramp it up. That said he has a very competitively priced Zeiss Super-Ikonta B, 532/16 so I'm half debating treating myself! 

Edited December 8, 2016 by krazypara3165

[chris_livsey]

http://www.collectablecameras.com/cameralist.htm

 

Is worth keeping an eye on as well for more "bargain" level stuff, if you just want to shoot why not: Leica L39 screw mount 50mm f2 Jupiter-8 lens. Silver finish. Very nice condition, clean clear optics, light cleaning marks, will make good pictures. £25

can't argue with that with a dealer backing the sale.

 

http://www.apertureuk.com/leica.html

Offer good value.

 

I still can't believe Jem let you out of Real Camera without some glass 

[krazypara3165]

Cheers for the advice all. Managed to pick up a Elmar for £100 - It came with a Canon IV too! the cameras a bit worse for wear but it will give me a chance to learn how to do a CLA. 

 

I did go a bit overboard though - I ended up getting an immaculate 1.8 Canon lens too!

[Robert M Poole]

http://www.collectablecameras.com/cameralist.htm

 

Is worth keeping an eye on as well for more "bargain" level stuff, if you just want to shoot why not: Leica L39 screw mount 50mm f2 Jupiter-8 lens. Silver finish. Very nice condition, clean clear optics, light cleaning marks, will make good pictures. £25

can't argue with that with a dealer backing the sale.

 

http://www.apertureuk.com/leica.html

Offer good value.

 

I still can't believe Jem let you out of Real Camera without some glass 

 

I've heard the Jupiters need shims to focus. Any experience with this? I have a soft spot for old Soviet lenses.

[chris_livsey]

My only experience is with an 8 on a Nikon rangefinder with internal mount where it performs well enough. I periodically remove the rear element and shake out the paint flakes 

 

This at f2:

Ilford Pan 400 Harvey's 777

 

 

this at something less than f2 maybe 5.6

 

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Hallo,

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https://www.cameraquest.com/ltmlens.htm