S006 or A7RII

[andreleon]

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Hi all, I already have Leica M and R lenses and Contax and Mamiya 645 lenses too. If you were me what choice could be yours: get a Leica S006 or a Sony A7RIIwith the Techcart Adapter. Thanks for your advice . Best regards.

[stephan_w]

Try the SL. Try the Sony. The S006 makes sense only with Leica-S lenses, in my opinion. On the SL you can put everything what you want. The Sony is a really nice camera, yes, but shines with the Sony primes

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[Jeff S]

You can adapt Contax and Mamiya lenses to the S (a search will bring up discussions), but you will lose the robust weather sealing that the system offers. The 006 also lacks LV and the dynamic range of its successor 007.  The size and bulk of the S system is an obvious distinction, and you should also consider the S lens AF issues if you're not already aware (well documented in many threads here).

 

I agree that the SL is another option to consider.

 

Trying (rent, borrow, demo....and make prints) before purchase is always prudent, regardless of recommendations. 

 

Jeff

Edited November 14, 2016 by Jeff S

[Mute-on]

Sell the Contax and Mamiya lenses and get an SL and additional R lenses you desire.

The S is expensive and by all accounts unreliable, though the results are excellent.

Alternatively a Hasselblad X1D.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited November 14, 2016 by Mute-on

[darylgo]

Get an S and a 70mm, try it, you'll love it and not look back. Phenomenal ergonomics and imaging.

[jip]

The S is totally different than the A7, simply because it's a SLR, but also because it has a larger sensor, so the look and feel of your images will be different.

 

I'd say these two systems are hard to compare. I love my S006 with leica lenses and Zeiss lenses for Contax 645.

[LorenzoLandini]

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You're comparing apples with oranges. It all depends on the kind of photography you're doing. 

 

First off the S is a medium format camera and its sensor is almost 60% larger than the Sony or SL. It gives your images a medium format look and the quality associated with a larger sensor (regardless of pixel count) and also comes with all the disadvantages of a medium format camera that may or may not be relevant to you (slower camera, slower lenses, heavier, bulkier, lower ISO, no live view, etc.). Not to mention reliability...unfortunately. The S shines with its native S lenses (ok, also with other top notch lenses such as the Zeiss for the Contax 645 for instance) and if you're not planning on buying any of the S lens, it might be not the best option for you. 

 

The Sony is small, compact, faster, etc. It's another camera and cameras are horses for courses, it depends on the kind of photography you are doing. 

 

You may want to check another thread on the forum about optimal bodies for R lenses if that the preferred path. Sony is one and they are other good bodies too. I have R lenses too and so far I haven't bought a body for them yet. Given that I have M lenses too as you do, the SL is definitively a body that I will consider at some point. Nikons appears to be good but require a modification to the lens mount because of the flange distance. Some Canons are good too and R lenses can be used with just one adapter. 

 

I have a S006 and I think it's a great camera that gives me the ability to produce very good images, but I am also aware of its shortcomings. Those disadvantages are not that relevant to me but I am sure that for others they will be a deal breaker. A camera is a tool and you will end up being very happy or very frustrated depending on what is important to you. I am guessing that by comparing a Sony with an S you don't have a clear understanding of what is really critical to you and you're trying to find a compromise with a body that could take as many lenses as possible (very understandable approach). In my humble opinion you should be focused on what you need from a camera, how you use it, what's a must have, what's can you give up, etc. and forget about your lens arsenal for a second. The more you compromise, the less optimal your set up will be.  

 

My two cents. Cheers. 

[FlashGordonPhotography]

You're comparing apples with oranges. It all depends on the kind of photography you're doing. 

 

First off the S is a medium format camera and its sensor is almost 60% larger than the Sony or SL. It gives your images a medium format look and the quality associated with a larger sensor (regardless of pixel count) and also comes with all the disadvantages of a medium format camera that may or may not be relevant to you (slower camera, slower lenses, heavier, bulkier, lower ISO, no live view, etc.). Not to mention reliability...unfortunately. The S shines with its native S lenses (ok, also with other top notch lenses such as the Zeiss for the Contax 645 for instance) and if you're not planning on buying any of the S lens, it might be not the best option for you. 

 

The Sony is small, compact, faster, etc. It's another camera and cameras are horses for courses, it depends on the kind of photography you are doing. 

 

You may want to check another thread on the forum about optimal bodies for R lenses if that the preferred path. Sony is one and they are other good bodies too. I have R lenses too and so far I haven't bought a body for them yet. Given that I have M lenses too as you do, the SL is definitively a body that I will consider at some point. Nikons appears to be good but require a modification to the lens mount because of the flange distance. Some Canons are good too and R lenses can be used with just one adapter. 

 

I have a S006 and I think it's a great camera that gives me the ability to produce very good images, but I am also aware of its shortcomings. Those disadvantages are not that relevant to me but I am sure that for others they will be a deal breaker. A camera is a tool and you will end up being very happy or very frustrated depending on what is important to you. I am guessing that by comparing a Sony with an S you don't have a clear understanding of what is really critical to you and you're trying to find a compromise with a body that could take as many lenses as possible (very understandable approach). In my humble opinion you should be focused on what you need from a camera, how you use it, what's a must have, what's can you give up, etc. and forget about your lens arsenal for a second. The more you compromise, the less optimal your set up will be.  

 

My two cents. Cheers. 

 

The OP could overcome most of the issues you raised by considering a 007 instead of a 006. High ISO, live view and camera responsiveness.

 

However, I think you've hit the nail on the head. They're very different systems that just don't feel the same in use. Although the IQ of the S006 is definitely superior at lower ISO's it's also a lot more to lug up a hill if that's your intentions. To me the differences are:

 

S006:

 

- Large and heavy.

- Mandatory LENR

- Short maximum exposure times

+ Great IQ at lower ISO's.

+ Battery life.

+ Build Quality

+ S lenses are the best money can buy.

 

A7R2

 

- Short Battery life.

- Questionable ergonomics and menus.

+ Flippy screen.

+ High ISO IQ.

+ Smaller/Lighter

+ Smooth reflections App (costs 10 bucks but worth it)

+ Lots of available and adaptable lenses.

- Not so good with M lenses wider than 50mm (some are good but not all).

 

Personally I think if you're considering the A7R2 then the next step up is the 007 because it has a CMOS sensor which allows live view and higher DR than the Sony.

 

Gordon

[R3D-D0T]

The SL renders just okay with M lenses but if you print large the resolution sucks.

 

007 renders files with a much better look than A7RII and 006. But it's prone to failure/defective equipment (really frustrating when traveling). You'd have to bear that risk.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

The SL renders just okay with M lenses but if you print large the resolution sucks.

 

 

24MP is 25 inch prints @ 240dpi. Or 20 inch at 300dpi. Bigger than many print and exactly the same as any other 24MP camera.

 

The A7R2 may have more resolution but since it doesn't work as well with a number of wider M lenses as the SL (35 lux, 50 lux, 28 cron, 21mm 3.4 etc) the additional resolution is wasted and you'll find the SL out resolves the A7R2 with these problematic lenses. You can of course have a Kolari mod done on the Sony but that has it's own issues.

 

While some lenses perform extremely well (the WATE is the obvious one) you're almost always better off selling the M lenses and replacing them with the Zeiss Loxia version or a larger native FE lens.

 

The A7R2 also doesn't apply lens profiles to the DNG files like the SL does automatically. Some but not all of Lightroom's profiles do as well as the inbuilt ones.

 

I have the A7R2 and unfortunately it's not as easy as just more resolution when it comes to M lenses.

 

Gordon

[albertknappmd]

I would opt for the 007 as it has increased dynamic range and you can use 6400 ISO.

Alternative is the SL but again you have to decide whether you want MF or 35mm format as each has its advantages and disadvantages as eloquently stated above....

I realize that this is a big decision and would encourge you to RENT the different systems first.

Albert     

[LorenzoLandini]

The OP could overcome most of the issues you raised by considering a 007 instead of a 006. High ISO, live view and camera responsiveness.

 

However, I think you've hit the nail on the head. They're very different systems that just don't feel the same in use. Although the IQ of the S006 is definitely superior at lower ISO's it's also a lot more to lug up a hill if that's your intentions. To me the differences are:

 

S006:

 

- Large and heavy.

- Mandatory LENR

- Short maximum exposure times

+ Great IQ at lower ISO's.

+ Battery life.

+ Build Quality

+ S lenses are the best money can buy.

 

A7R2

 

- Short Battery life.

- Questionable ergonomics and menus.

+ Flippy screen.

+ High ISO IQ.

+ Smaller/Lighter

+ Smooth reflections App (costs 10 bucks but worth it)

+ Lots of available and adaptable lenses.

- Not so good with M lenses wider than 50mm (some are good but not all).

 

Personally I think if you're considering the A7R2 then the next step up is the 007 because it has a CMOS sensor which allows live view and higher DR than the Sony.

 

Gordon

 

 

Gordon,

 

I don't disagree with you on the 007 being able to overcome a few of the 006 shortcomings. The question was about the 006, presumably because of the budget as a 006 is more close to the A7R and once you're considering a new Sony at $3,200 is very tempting to step up to a used 006 at $5-6,000. The 007 is on a different league and costs 5 times more than a sony. Honestly. I'd be puzzling to understand someone really undecided between a $3,200 Sony and a $17,000 Leica. At that point, if really undecided one should buy both.... and don't even bother to understand the difference or ask for advice. 

 

cheers,

Lorenzo 

[andreleon]

Thanks to all . I think that the best could be awaiting the new Blad and/or the Fuji MF. , for I can't get a S007 by now . Cheers .

[John McMaster]

The Hasselblad will be starting with new lenses (yours won't work) and the Fuji is still even more of an unknown...

 

john

[andreleon]

Hi all, I've had the opportunity to buy a S2 with an S70 and I'm quite happy with this combo  . I now have another opportunity to get a Planar 100 for Hasselblad V for a good price ( $430) But the seller specifies that "the cocking shaft is locked and the shutter is now fully open". So can such a lens with the S adapter work on the S2?  Thanks for your answer .Regards .

[BernardC]

Andre,

 

The important thing is that the aperture stop-down lever works. It is located on the left-hand side (as seen from the top) on CF, CFe and CFi lenses, or on the right on older C lenses. Other than that, make sure that the focusing ring is smooth, and that the glass is clear.

[andreleon]

Bernard , please have a look at the seller's answer :"yes, I confirm: you can do stop-down and it works well. I did the same thing for a long time. 

Only a caveat: don't touch the little release pivot on the back, otherwise the shutter and the diaphragm are released and then the recocking is problematic."Is it safe to buy such a lens? Thanks . Cheers

[BernardC]

Andre,

 

That is how those Hasselblad lenses work. There is a release pin and a winding screw at the back of the lens, activated by the body.

The shutter remains closed after release, until it is re-wound. This can be done with a small screwdriver or coin.

 

You need to find-out what the seller means by "recocking is problematic." Is it problematic in the normal way (described above), or is it more problematic because of a shutter issue.

 

You can do better if you are looking for inexpensive lenses to fill-out your set. For instance, last time I was in Paris I purchased a perfect Hasselblad 150 for around that price. I see that the same shop lists four Mamiya 645 lenses for less than 100€ each. It's MacMahon Photo, three blocks from the Arc de Triomphe.

[andreleon]

Thanks a lot Bernard . I give up withe this lens . I do know Mac Mahon Photo and the sellers . I'il pay a visit since this shop is at about one mile from my office. Have a nice day (rather cold here). Cheers .

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Hallo,

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