DwF Posted December 30, 2016 Share #41 Posted December 30, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) Gentlemen: Thank you for posting those -really superb stuff here! When I locked on to the first image Peter posted here, the last thing I could care about is whether it was made with MM1 or MM2. While I prefer MM1 myself, I have no doubt the newer "better" version could also produce a great image. It's so not a competition but more about making great images that among other things, celebrate what a good piece of equipment in the right hands can do! And Horea, I am particularly taken with your third image above! ...your self-portrait and others grabbed me too:) Thank you for sharing and Happy New Year! David 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted December 30, 2016 Posted December 30, 2016 Hi DwF, Take a look here Monochrom 1 v. Monochrom 2. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Bill Livingston Posted December 30, 2016 Share #42 Posted December 30, 2016 I really like the second image in Horea's recent post.... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DwF Posted December 30, 2016 Share #43 Posted December 30, 2016 Let me suggest now that we are on a new page of this thread, viewers should definitely go back and view those last images! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post mmx_2 Posted January 2, 2017 Popular Post Share #44 Posted January 2, 2017 (edited) I have only used the MM1 briefly and was very tempted to buy it when it came out, but I saved my money and waited for the M240 instead. When the M246 was announced I immediately decided to get it, so I have it since it came out (actually one of the first 300 made) and I really, really like it. Can't contribute so much to the MM vs MM2 but here are a few photos from the MM2 that I took a few days after I got it: They are all from this album: https://flic.kr/s/aHskPjxWC6 Edited January 2, 2017 by mmx_2 21 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geotrupede Posted January 9, 2017 Share #45 Posted January 9, 2017 Never tried extensively the second implementation. It did sound better and had a smoother feel, but with a detectable increase in weight. File quality, cannot comment.For what is the experience I have with Rev1, it is a fantastic tool. Very good files, with the ability to push / burn / dodge ad libitum.Noise is random and does not bother, sharpness is extreme and in some cases it is necessary to remove post sharpening as it would look unnatural.Some pictures here, all MM apart one or two. https://www.leica-fotopark.com/images/projects/XaJc9ZUBQhCwcVZwRNBXtgRegardsG. PS it is possible to get very close to MM quality from RGGB, however there are some limitations when the colours are very saturated or when using filters for contrast. Furthermore the push capabilities of a standard camera are limited by the RGGB pattern, thus for dark areas smudge and blobs of colour become an ugly noise pattern in BW while with the MM they stay as nice pixel level random noise. So if you plan to edit a lot or plan to use at night with saturated lights, the MM is better than the converted RGGB. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geotrupede Posted January 10, 2017 Share #46 Posted January 10, 2017 oops! a link that works: https://www.leica-fotopark.com/discover/photographers/546baac30cf267d4ceda6db5/project/XaJc9ZUBQhCwcVZwRNBXtg 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmx_2 Posted January 11, 2017 Share #47 Posted January 11, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) oops! a link that works: https://www.leica-fotopark.com/discover/photographers/546baac30cf267d4ceda6db5/project/XaJc9ZUBQhCwcVZwRNBXtg Nice shots! When looking at your photos and comparing them with my own it strikes me that the MM1 is more "black" than the MM2 (which is a bit more greyish in tone). Both are beautiful but in different ways. The MM1 looks to me like very fine grain Ilford film (like the Pan F 50) where as the MM2 with it's more greyish tone resembles more something like the Kodak T-max 100. 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DwF Posted January 11, 2017 Share #48 Posted January 11, 2017 (edited) Nice shots! When looking at your photos and comparing them with my own it strikes me that the MM1 is more "black" than the MM2 (which is a bit more greyish in tone). Both are beautiful but in different ways. The MM1 looks to me like very fine grain Ilford film (like the Pan F 50) where as the MM2 with it's more greyish tone resembles more something like the Kodak T-max 100. I would agree with your assessment but from a slightly different angle. Similar to the way I recall thinking about the difference in 35mm film vs Medium format, I see a correlation to comparing fabric. The MM1 would resemble denim and the MM2 more of a fine twill....or worsted wool. This comparison works for me in that both are good fabrics for their respective purposes. Where these difference reveal themselves may be more as you suggest in the blacks and grays. It's subtle and not always evident, so it is easily possible to mistake one for the other depending on the conditions of light, exposure and maybe even subject matter. ....just my take. Edited January 11, 2017 by DwF 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geotrupede Posted February 7, 2017 Share #49 Posted February 7, 2017 Thanks! One thing to add is that the MM files out of the camera are usually not ready. There is a decent amount of editing involved. I usually increase contrast and apply a S curve to the files. In other instances there is dodge burning to bring out a detail. So what I value is that the camera is only BW, which means you need to look for BW pictures without distraction. Once the picture get to the computer, then there is a standard recipe that it is applied, my own, and some editing to correct. So the end results are consistent. I am not sure about the MM2 as I never had a file to play with, but probably it is possible to get the same look from MM1 and MM2 and possibly a colour one. Beside some colour limitation in specific saturated pictures, the real difference is the ease of editing. and MM1 is very easy to edit. G. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmx_2 Posted February 7, 2017 Share #50 Posted February 7, 2017 Your right about the edit comment, I feel that shooting anything but RAW is a waste with both cameras . I usually also increase the clarity to 25 in LR, apply a lot of black, add a S-kurve and sometimes increase the contrast. But basically anything from very black to quite grey can be achieved. The files are very, very easy to work with, actually I find them a lot easier to work with than converting from M240. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffreyg Posted February 13, 2017 Share #51 Posted February 13, 2017 (edited) Shot with the MM1 and 28 ASPH Elmarit. Like the medium format quality of the CCD sensor, hand held and with higher ISO capabilities. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited February 13, 2017 by geoffreyg 7 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/266317-monochrom-1-v-monochrom-2/?do=findComment&comment=3211803'>More sharing options...
fotografr Posted February 16, 2017 Share #52 Posted February 16, 2017 I'm a big fan of the CCD sensor, particularly due to the more film like appearance of the files. CMOS files look a bit too smooth for my taste. 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Printmaker Posted February 20, 2017 Share #53 Posted February 20, 2017 (edited) Ok, I have a question. Of those that prefer the original MM to the 246, which lenses are you using? Reason I ask, I find I much prefer the older non Aspherical lenses on the 246 as they render more of that 'organic' look to my eyes. I am just wondering if using the modern lenses between the two monochromes, maybe those that have the M9 version are comparing the two with Aspherical lenses? It's just a guess. I haven't had the original MM, but I see such a difference in the old vs newer lenses, am getting rid of all my Aspherical lenses eventually. The older lenses, to my eyes, are much better on the 246. The same might not be true on the M9 version. I originally used a 1969 vintage 50 Summicron on my MM1 thinking I'd like a more classical look. A year later, I changed to a current (non-Apo) 50 Summicron and am very happy with the results. The older Summicron was moved to my M9 where it does an admirable job. I found that I like a little more bite in my B&W images and a slightly softer, more vignetted look in my color images. Still, my tests show there is not a great deal of differences between the two 50 Summicrons other than the older one flares a bit more when pointed into the sun and the micro contrast is higher in the newer Summicron. Both are sharp. I've been toying with the idea of selling the older lens and replacing it with a 75 Summicron when I move from the M9 to the M10 but I doubt if I will ever take the current 50 Summicron off of my MM1. The MM1/50 Summicron is just a perfect combo. I have other Leica lenses made in the late 90s and am very happy with their performance on either camera. But my newish 21 SEM is almost never mounted on the MM1 due to the very reasons you expressed. Here are a few samples of the MM1/50 Summicron combo: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/268117-gibson-nudes-viewer-discretion-advised/ Edited February 20, 2017 by Printmaker 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramosa Posted February 20, 2017 Share #54 Posted February 20, 2017 but I doubt if I will ever take the current 50 Summicron off of my MM1. The MM1/50 Summicron is just a perfect combo. /[/url] I agree 100%. While I have had quite a few Leica lenses, as well M bodies, across the last 10 years, I'm now down to just the MM1 and the same version of the 50 Cron that you have (latest non-Apo). 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lanetomlane Posted February 22, 2017 Share #55 Posted February 22, 2017 I had the MM1 along with the M9 and really liked it. However, when I upgraded the M9 to the 240, after a year or so, I started to really miss the 240's superior handling characteristics and also got fed up with having to pack two chargers and six different batteries every trip (three for each camera). I read all the posts regarding the difference in the CCD sensor when compared with the CMOS and after a lot of thought and doubt made the decision to buy the 246. Thankfully it was a decision I didn't regret as I found that with altering my PP I could achieve the same quality of print. I have since added an SL to the arsenal and have tried a couple of B&W conversions from those files, the result of which is very comparable to the 246. However, I can't see selling the 246 anytime soon. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted March 5, 2017 Share #56 Posted March 5, 2017 (edited) The MM1/50 Summicron is just a perfect combo. Also true for the MM1 and 50mm Summilux asph. That's a perfect pairing for my shooting. Edited March 5, 2017 by fotografr Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerndReini Posted March 6, 2017 Share #57 Posted March 6, 2017 (edited) MM1 and 50Apo. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited March 6, 2017 by BerndReini 8 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/266317-monochrom-1-v-monochrom-2/?do=findComment&comment=3228138'>More sharing options...
BerndReini Posted March 6, 2017 Share #58 Posted March 6, 2017 MM1 and 50Apo again. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/266317-monochrom-1-v-monochrom-2/?do=findComment&comment=3228160'>More sharing options...
horosu Posted March 6, 2017 Share #59 Posted March 6, 2017 (edited) MM2 and 50 Rigid Edited March 6, 2017 by horosu 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto.f Posted March 6, 2017 Share #60 Posted March 6, 2017 (edited) MM2 and 50 Rigid Thanks! You're about the first who posts an MM2 image. Edited March 6, 2017 by otto.f Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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