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A question of choice


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Looking for a few ideas from the knowledgeable folk here.

 

I may be in the position to re-enter the world of Leica this summer (having had an M8 a few years ago and, despite its shortcomings, enjoyed using it a lot).

 

If you had the money to get

 

a) A used M9 (or derivative : M-E, M9P, Monochrome) and one very good lens of your preferred focal length

 

 

B) A used M9 (or derivative : M-E, M9P, Monochrome) and two moderately decent lenses (which together add up to the price of one very good lens) - something like a 28 and a 50. Non-Leica lenses (Voigtlander, etc) considered.

 

 

or

 

 

B) An M240 (or derivative : M262, etc) with a moderately decent lens (Non-Leica lenses considered).

 

Assuming the M9s had new sensors and a guarantee, which would you choose and why?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

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I reached the summit (in terms of my own priorities) with an M (Typ 240) and a set of Summarit-M lenses, with the 50mm being  most frequently used. The 50mm can be had for quite reasonable prices, too, I'd think.

 

Before that, I had an Epson R-D1 with some Voigtländer lenses, an M8 and an M9 with various lenses, one after the other.

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For me..    ..the M9 has everything I want - more recent bodies offer features I have no interest in..  ..do you want video?  ..higher resolution?       ..as long as I have used rangefinders (M4-P, now M9) I only used one focal length - 35mm - it just seems right for me..      ..that said, I have always had Nikon DSLR with various focal length lenses..     ..I think most folks on here are different from me and have a selection of lenses for their M cameras..     ..lots of folks are very impressed with non-Leica glass - if I were you I would buy a used Leica lens in your favourite focal length..then you either stay that way, or, depending on budget, add more Leica glass or swap your Leica lens for a couple of non-Leica ones..   ..you'll likely not lose much money on trade-in..    ..finally - I would think long and hard about max aperture - obviously faster ones are more expensive and larger / heavier - I'm happy with my 'cron..

 

Hopefully this post will attract lots of other views and will help you work out the best direction for you - good luck! 

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I wouldn't claim to be knowledgeable as I've been in Leicaland for barely two and a half years, but I have had both the M9P and the M, and after six weeks of the latter I gratefully returned to the former. The M has some advantages, there's no doubt, but the simplicity of the M9, and what comes out of it, make it for me a much superior tool. This must be a personal thing of course, as must be the decision whether to go for fast modern glass at considerable cost, or slower and/or older glass for much less outlay. If I had to cut down to, say, three lenses, the relatively cheap 'thin' Tele-Elmarit 90, the tiny and cheap Elmar-M 50 and my relatively inexpensive Elmarit 28 - all three of them 'only' f2.8, but still capable of great results -  would stay, and the wonderful, but heavy and expensive Summiluxes would go. Voigtländer glass can be very good too, but I don't get as much pleasure from using it as I do Leica. But that's just me. Of course, if you're after older glass you can't always just go to a shop and buy what you want - but hunting it down can be part of the fun.

 

The price of entry to Leica is always going to be higher than with other brands - but it doesn't need to be prohibitive if you don't insist on the latest and 'greatest'.

 

In short, for me: a good condition M9P with a relatively cheap Leica 50 and  one 28/35/90, depending on your taste - and if you hanker after something faster/more modern, save up, but enjoy what you have in the meantime.

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Having returned to the fold myself with an M8.2 I'd have to say that nowadays 90% of my stuff is shot on an M9-P and 50mm Summicron (v4) and if I was offered your three options that would be my choice (IMO the Summicron V4 qualifies as a 'Very Good Lens'). It's not necessary to get the P version of the M9, of course. I have no need for live view nor video etc. so the newer 240-based stuff is not of interest to me in the slightest.

 

The Monochrom is a fascinating idea - I quite fancy one myself - but as I do occasionally require the option to shoot colour if I was limiting myself to one body then, for me, the Monochrom is a non-starter.

 

I also have a couple of the Voigt lenses which I bought for use with the 8.2 - the 28mm f2 Ultron and the 40mm f1.4 Nokton Classic - and they are very capable performers (in 'real world' photographic usage) and are beautifully made. FWIW both were bought brand new for much less than the price of my 30-y-o Summicron...

 

Good luck and keep us posted!

 

Pip.

 

EDIT : I was typing as Mustographer was posting so missed his post but I'd pretty much second everything he says.

In addition to the 50mm Summicron I also have the 'thin' 90mm f2.8 Tele-Elmarit and a 3.5cm f3.5 Summaron. These latter two lenses can be found for very reasonable prices and can pretty much hold their own (again, in 'real world' photographic usage) in the performance stakes against much more modern glass.

They are also very small and light in comparison to 'faster' alternatives. As I've mentioned somewhere else my M9-P and those three lenses together weigh 140g less than does my main DSLR body and grip on it's own.

Edited by pippy
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I'd go late low shutter secondhand M9-P and decide which focal length is right for your main lens, for me that would be 35 over 50 is then decide how much low light shooting I would decide if the summilux is worth it for cost and size

 

Personalky I was go M9-P (sapphire glass) nicer look and more sought after, so an easier sell if you move on, I haven't 

 

I'd choose the pre FLE 35mm ASPH. Summilux. Then get to really know it and think about a 50 or 21. I have the Monochrom and its superb, but lack colour ! So it is wonderfully restrictive if you are that way inclined. The 50 Elmar-M f2.8 is a very nice affordable lens, as already noted.

 

Another thought, as funds grow. A Monochrom 35mm summaron and M9-P 50 Elmar-M. Why ? The Monochrom is superb low light with this lens and generally you are more intimate at night plus the combination is great. The Elmar-M is lovely with the M9-P and great in the daylight (okay in low light with the 9, I wouldn't go any slower then f2.8 for any lens unless I have no option)

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I switched from the M9 to the M240 without hesitation, but my reasons were ones which are vital to some people (including myself) and totally irrelevant to others: there is no right answer here:

- Far better LCD: I found it embarrassing showing others the images I had just taken on the M9.

- Quieter, more silky shutter sound: less like a SLR.

- EVF/LV for checking RF and lens calibration.

- EVF for lenses and attachments not in the 28-90 range: in my case, for close-ups with the OUFRO.

- Wider dynamic range.

- Better high ISO performance.

- Better colour quality and Auto WB (I don't subscribe to the CCD is better than CMOS viewpoint).

 

Extra pixels were not important to me, but nice to have.

 

Now the criteria above were important to me, but I know well that they are not to others. They are all real objective differences (except for the colour preferences), but it is up to you whether these or others will sway your choice.

Edited by LocalHero1953
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One question I would like an answer to is the effective maximum iso of the M9. When it first came out I recall something about 1600 being tops but one thing which has also improved in recent years is the noise recovery in Lightroom so I am wondering if this still applies or whether you can push colour higher?

 

 

LouisB

 

That depends on one's tolerance level and on the subject (which are interrelateed). I would still max out @ 1250, but have some shots that I find quite acceptable @ 3200.

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The one piece of advice I would offer to the OP is if you are shooting 28 mm consider the V4 Elmarit,  which I has less vignetting than a Summicron and great colour rendition on the M9.  It's one of the few bargains to be had with Leica lenses.  Big Louis, I would not consider shooting the M9 at 1600,  even with better LR post production. Unless you like Seurat.  The M9 is still a terrific camera even if the shutter sounds clunky -- something I didn't notice until I started working with a Q as well (which has very good low light capacity.) Again to the OP -- the difference between good and very good is kind of meaningless in terms of lenses. Also the Zeiss ZM are technically formidable.  With Voigtlander, watch out for quality control.  I bought a 28 that was excellent except for a strip on one side -- decentering.

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I'm still very happy with my M-E (with latest sensor) and the lens combo 35 Lux ASPH pre-FLE and 75 Cron.  I would invest in the best glass at your preferred focal length for your primary lens.  My 35 Lux is glued to my camera 90-95% of the time.

 

I'm heading to Iceland next weekend for 12 days and I'm not worried a bit that I need to have every focal length in my bag for a successful trip.  It's really not a photo trip per se as I will be with my son but I will have a tripod and the other landscape essentials just in case.

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I think the answer to this old question is as old as photography - money is always in the glass.

 

This answer has gained substance several fold since the introduction of digital imaging as of the extremely fast depreciation in digital camera bodies.

 

Short answer: Find out which is/are your favorite focal length/-s. Find out which maximum aperture you need. buy the best glass in that/those focal length/-s you can afford. The rest of the budget determines the camera body.

 

I would take a beaten M9 with the best glass (read your favorite lens) over a brand new digital M over good glass any day.

 

 

Now on to a much, much more difficult question - what's your favorite lens, how to find it and how long (how many lenses) will it take to find out?

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B) An M240 (or derivative : M262, etc) with a moderately decent lens (Non-Leica lenses considered).

 

 

Probably option three.  The M240 (and M262) improves upon the M9 in a bunch of ways that I like.  I'm ok with a moderately decent lens.

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Looking for a few ideas from the knowledgeable folk here.

 

I may be in the position to re-enter the world of Leica this summer (having had an M8 a few years ago and, despite its shortcomings, enjoyed using it a lot).

 

If you had the money to get

 

a) A used M9 (or derivative : M-E, M9P, Monochrome) and one very good lens of your preferred focal length

 

 

B) A used M9 (or derivative : M-E, M9P, Monochrome) and two moderately decent lenses (which together add up to the price of one very good lens) - something like a 28 and a 50. Non-Leica lenses (Voigtlander, etc) considered.

 

 

or

 

 

B) An M240 (or derivative : M262, etc) with a moderately decent lens (Non-Leica lenses considered).

 

Assuming the M9s had new sensors and a guarantee, which would you choose and why?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

 

 

 

Nicest M9 and 35 FLE

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Nicest M9 and 35 FLE

 

I prefer the Pre-FLE ... 

 

I just received an M 240   and am rather overwhelmed and at the same time underwhelmed by it. ... It seems I have to put in a lot more effort to get a shot than I used to with my M9 ... the new shutter is quite nice though ..     

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