Wayne Posted January 17, 2016 Share #1 Posted January 17, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) I own the former and, inspired by the extra speed of the latter, am considering the purchase of one. I am having some difficulty getting any real information on the Canon 1.2. Is it pretty much, from an optical quality standpoint, in the same league as the Summarit? I have never seen a rave review of the Summarit; and whatever is written about the Canon 1.2 seems to be more of the same, i.e. some like it and some don't. I like the Summarit but understand why it is not one of the highly rated LTM lenses. Has anyone out there had any side-by-side experience with the two lenses? Aside from being a bit faster, does the Canon offer anything in the way of image quality and useablity that is superior to the Summarit? Thanks for any comments or experience. Wayne Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 17, 2016 Posted January 17, 2016 Hi Wayne, Take a look here Leica 50mm 1.5 Summarit and canon 50mm 1.2 ltm. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lleo Posted January 17, 2016 Share #2 Posted January 17, 2016 From what I've read round, both Canon and Nikon seem to be great lens with a high quality. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeitz Posted January 17, 2016 Share #3 Posted January 17, 2016 I've used the Canon 1.2 on an M9. At max aperture the lens is soft. Stopped down to f5.6 or f8 it is very good. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeitz Posted January 17, 2016 Share #4 Posted January 17, 2016 Canon 50mm f1.2 at f8.0. This image was processed in Photoshop to convert to B&W. No sharpening. The image had to be downsized and saved at low res to be attached. Center is sharp; corners are not. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeitz Posted January 17, 2016 Share #5 Posted January 17, 2016 The attachment seems to have gotten lost. ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Pop Posted January 17, 2016 Share #6 Posted January 17, 2016 I'm not so sure 1.2 vs. 1.5 is going to make or break things from a practical point of view (yes, I know there is of course a total difference in light gathering ability), unless you're really after the fastest possible and shooting a lot in the lowest light. As for bokeh, you're right in that the reviews (also for sharpness at apertures etc.) are going to be highly variable. I've had the Summarit 1.5 and used it on both my film (MP) and digital (M9). I sold it when I got the Summilux 1.4 Asph. This was prior to my emerging obsession with LTM Leicas though, and I wished I'd kept it. Its performance wasn't bad...I'd classify it as another 'character' lens...I recall sharpness in the centre and softness (and some very crazy Van Gogh bokeh) outside. Not that I'm advocating a quiver of lenses for each and every subtlety, but I do find the older glass in particular can be absolutely wonderful for some circumstances, and not so much for others. By circumstances, I don't mean available light, I'm more thinking of the content of the picture itself...the types of things being shot, the background and foreground, how they are arranged in the frame, etc. I've shot some things on my old glass where it all comes together, the vintage, the character - as well as the composition - and wow! Other times (and I recall this with the Summarit which is a Xenon essentially, and I'm not a pixel-peeper) the 'character' is a bit of a distraction...noisy bokeh in all the wrong places, or softness, etc. I liked the colour palette...very vintage. You already have the Summarit of course so probably know a lot of this. In the end, as I hear myself talk here lol, it all depends on what lenses you already have, and what you're going to use either of these for. If you're going to be doing most of your shooting at 5.6 etc., there's better choices of lenses out there at f2 like the Summicron of course. Voigtlander 50mm LTM f1.5 I hear is also very good if you're not wed to an old classic. And the Canon 50mm LTM in 1.4 etc. At this point, (for me) I'm usually only interested in glass that is faster than about 1.8 for use almost always at the widest aperture, for speed reasons shooting indoors in the evening. But that's my view and personal taste. And I accept all the other limitations of those lenses (even the current Noctilux 0.95 has them) for regular uses. But like all of these things, back in the day someone would have been delighted to have a Summarit 1.5 on their iiig or whatever, or the Canon, as their one lens, and just go out and shoot everything...low light, afternoon at the beach, and all things between...and we probably wouldn't notice and just look at the great pics! Let us know if you get the Canon...I've also looked at that one and I do like the construction and rendering of the old Canon LTM lenses. What will you be shooting the Canon on, by the way? I know that it's pretty big when I've seen it mounted on a iiif for example...might block a lot of the viewfinder. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Posted January 17, 2016 Author Share #7 Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) Thanks for the responses. I do like the Summarit, but, it is the lens that, for me, brought meaning to things I had read about lens flare. Is the Canon 1.2 afflicted as severely? I would be shooting the Canon on a IIIC and IIIG. For whatever reason, I find myself absorbed lately with the LTM cameras. The film M cameras sit by as I go through this phase where I am drawn to the fiddlyness (sp?) of the Barnacks.....Its odd. Edited January 17, 2016 by Wayne Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.noctilux Posted January 17, 2016 Share #8 Posted January 17, 2016 Viewfinder blockage with IIIc + Canon 1.2/50 (even with IIIg) may be a problem. SBOOI may be needed to frame. Arnaud Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JMF Posted January 17, 2016 Share #9 Posted January 17, 2016 I have both and enjoy both of them ! The Canon has more roundness for lack of a better term ... the Summarit is a bit sharper wide open maybe, just different characters. https://www.flickr.com/photos/talegal/albums/72157630005599014 https://www.flickr.com/photos/talegal/albums/72157629899152848 Hope this helps (it's all very subjective though ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Posted January 18, 2016 Author Share #10 Posted January 18, 2016 Thanks for the example images. I really like the beach scenes with the Canon 1.2. Wayne Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JMF Posted January 18, 2016 Share #11 Posted January 18, 2016 Thanks for the example images. I really like the beach scenes with the Canon 1.2. Wayne You're welcome Wayne. Hope you'll find a nice sample of the Canon 1.2 LTM ! Cheers Jean-Marc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted January 22, 2016 Share #12 Posted January 22, 2016 Clean 1.5 Summarits are hard to find. Rendition is a little soft at 1.5. Quality is unique stopped down and I do not know how to describe it. Buy the correct shade for it. I kept mine all through 40 + years of Summilux when I finally decided the ASPH Lux was better. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aoresteen Posted January 28, 2016 Share #13 Posted January 28, 2016 (edited) I had my first Canon 50mm f/1.2 in 1980 to use with an M3. Sold it nine years later & the M3 and regretted it. I bought another when I got my 2nd M3 around 2005. The main problem with the Canon 50mm 1.2 is that they need to be adjusted to your camera to get sharp pictures wide open. I sent my M3 and the Canon 50mm 1.2 to Don Goldberg who made sure it was focusing properly on my M3. While Don had the M3 he did a CLA on it, converted the loading to M4, converted the X-sync to PC, and converted it to motor drive. The lens shade for the Canon 50mm f/1.2 are scarce and expensive - $150 or more is not unusual for one. While I have the correct Canon shade, I use an Olympus OM shade for the Zuiko 55mm f/1.2. It fits perfectly and can be found for about $50 or less. Most users of the Canon 50mm f/1.2 have never had the focus checked and I believe that this is the cause of the bad press that the lens gets. Edited January 28, 2016 by Aoresteen Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JMF Posted January 28, 2016 Share #14 Posted January 28, 2016 The main problem with the Canon 50mm 1.2 is that they need to be adjusted to your camera to get sharp pictures wide open. I sent my M3 and the Canon 50mm 1.2 to Don Goldberg who made sure it was focusing properly on my M3. Most users of the Canon 50mm f/1.2 have never had the focus checked and I believe that this is the cause of the bad press that the lens gets. Exactly, thanks for bringing this up ! I've had 3 Canon 50 1.2 LTM lenses and had to adjust each one of them, same for my 2 Canon 85 1.8 LTM. Had copper shims machined of various widths and even made some up from Lee cine gels then ajusted each lens till I reached the M collimation standard . 50 Canon 1.2 LTM on the M8: Milan Alram by JM__, on Flickr Best, JM. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikonosguy Posted January 29, 2016 Share #15 Posted January 29, 2016 maybe i'm a minority or heretic -- i traded my radioactive cron for a good canon 50/1.2 -- no regrets -- i've always like the look of the canon and not willing to pay collector prices for the noctilux 1.2- - a 500 dollar investment vs a 20k investmet Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaques Posted February 1, 2016 Share #16 Posted February 1, 2016 (edited) i have the canon 1.2 lens- it is a fine beast. Currently mine is being serviced as the RF calibration was not accurate. Here some wide open samples: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited February 1, 2016 by jaques Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/255706-leica-50mm-15-summarit-and-canon-50mm-12-ltm/?do=findComment&comment=2980511'>More sharing options...
Wayne Posted February 1, 2016 Author Share #17 Posted February 1, 2016 Thanks again for the responses. I did wind up buying a Canon 50 1.2. I have taken a couple photos with the lens mounted to my IIIc but have not developed the roll. I see the reason some mention the size of the lens. It does block the viewfinder quite a bit. But I think I will be able to live with it. The example I purchased has near perfect glass; however, the filter ring is bent.....not a great deal, but enough to prevent use of a filter. Additionally, the aperture ring is very stiff. It can be rotated but only with considerable effort. There does not appear to be any damage to aperture blades: they are clean and oil free. I have contacted one of the recommended service providers, with the response that he would be happy to CLA and service the aperture ring, but cannot help me with the bent filter ring. Is it possible to straighten a filter ring, once bent? Anyone out there have any recommendations/suggestions? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JMF Posted February 1, 2016 Share #18 Posted February 1, 2016 Thanks again for the responses. I did wind up buying a Canon 50 1.2. I have taken a couple photos with the lens mounted to my IIIc but have not developed the roll. I see the reason some mention the size of the lens. It does block the viewfinder quite a bit. But I think I will be able to live with it. The example I purchased has near perfect glass; however, the filter ring is bent.....not a great deal, but enough to prevent use of a filter. Additionally, the aperture ring is very stiff. It can be rotated but only with considerable effort. There does not appear to be any damage to aperture blades: they are clean and oil free. I have contacted one of the recommended service providers, with the response that he would be happy to CLA and service the aperture ring, but cannot help me with the bent filter ring. Is it possible to straighten a filter ring, once bent? Anyone out there have any recommendations/suggestions? Congrats on the purchase! Can you post a photo of the damaged filter ring? Best JM Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spydrxx Posted February 1, 2016 Share #19 Posted February 1, 2016 There are a variety of ways to "fix" the filter ring, some a little more precarious than others. I picked up a tool a couple of years ago and it has done an ok job for several old lenses (not Leica). I take my time and don't push my luck, so things usually come out so the filters or hoods fit, but visually there is a slight indication that repair work has been done. It is essentially a vise operating in reverse, with thread grabbers in 2 sizes, you gently apply expansion pressure and rotate it for circular symmentry. Readily found on Ebay. I remember, I think it was in one of Tomosy's repair books, the suggestion of a piece of rounded wood approximating the curve, covered with a thin layer of leather and lightly tapped with a hammer in similar fashion...but that was always too iffy for me. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/255706-leica-50mm-15-summarit-and-canon-50mm-12-ltm/?do=findComment&comment=2980686'>More sharing options...
Guest JMF Posted February 1, 2016 Share #20 Posted February 1, 2016 There are a variety of ways to "fix" the filter ring, some a little more precarious than others. I picked up a tool a couple of years ago and it has done an ok job for several old lenses (not Leica). I take my time and don't push my luck, so things usually come out so the filters or hoods fit, but visually there is a slight indication that repair work has been done. It is essentially a vise operating in reverse, with thread grabbers in 2 sizes, you gently apply expansion pressure and rotate it for circular symmentry. Readily found on Ebay. I remember, I think it was in one of Tomosy's repair books, the suggestion of a piece of rounded wood approximating the curve, covered with a thin layer of leather and lightly tapped with a hammer in similar fashion...but that was always too iffy for me. Thanks for sharing, I only knew of the second method you're mentioning ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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