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35 mm Summilux Asph - weird Fog - Irreperable?


diddus

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Hi,

 

the first part is a bit of a long story, skip right to the point if you prefer :)

 

earlier this year I have fallen in Love with a 35mm Summilux at a local store, after a bit of back and forth (and sleeping over it for a few nights..)  I had to get it.

 

I did use the lens everyday for about a couple of weeks, when I went to NYC and someone at Adorama took a look at it. He pointed out a weird "dust" or Haze that was rather circular but not perfectly so. 

The middle of the lens is not at all effected and I cannot see parts of the picture being any less sharp or contrasty. 

I continued the use of my lens, as it did not bother me.

Eventually I went back to my hometown and showed it to my dealer, who apologized and promised to have it cleaned/ fixed free of charge of course. 

 

So far so good. Now a month has passed and I have dearly missed my Lux as it still was my always on lens. 

 

I was informed yesterday, that the lens has been returned from three different repair facilities in Germany. Apparently the lens is irreparable. 

Now the Dealer did offer me a full Refund or if I so wished a reduction in Price. 

 

At the prospect of not getting my lens back I took the price reduction and drove home. 

 

The Dealer was not able to specify what exactly hat happened or what that is, I could not find anything on the internet either.

So I would like you guys to take a look at it.

Can you tell me what that is?  It does not seem like fungus to me. What kind of haze could be irreparable and how much can this worsen over time?

I planned on this lens to be with me for a long long time. The lack of repairability does worry me a lot though, now. 

 

Best Regards from Germany

 

Daniel

 

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Difficult to say but I would lean towards separation of cemented elements. Since later lenses (like yours) use a UV cured adhesive which is extremely strong it might be impossible to separate them without damaging them. As to the cause, well, dropping a lens could create sufficient impact to crack the adhesive I suppose, even though it might not show any physical signs of a drop. So, whilst you may not see any sign of a lens being dropped externally, it might just show as optical damage. But be aware this is conjecture based on what you've said/showed so may not be what has happened.

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Hi Daniel,

 

I'm sorry you seem to have an issue with your 35 Lux... but I'm surprised by your choice when offered an opportunity for a full refund. Why not take up the dealer on his offer and buy a replacement 35 Lux from him?

 

If for no other reason, when you maybe decide to replace it in the future, you will not, in all good faith, be able to sell it to someone without full disclosure and that will impact dramatically on its resale value.

 

Also, if you happen to have an accident with it in the future, you may end up with a 'unrepairable' diagnosis, not maybe due to the damage you would be returning it with, but its inherent issue that you have recently discovered.

 

If it was me, I would have had absolutely no hesitation in accepting a refund and buying a replacement, preferably from that same retailer given that he has behaved admirably over this whole unfortunate issue.

Edited by Bill Livingston
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Am pretty sure my Summilux 35 has the same issue, but not as far gone yet.   It's the cement.  At the time I found someone who knew what it was, it was a 'maybe' it could be repaired but at a high cost which essentially made the lens worthless, but still usuable.  I bought on EBay which I would never pay that much for a lens sight unseen again.  I assumed was just dust when I got it. Nope!  It's one if the earlier Aspherical versions, early 90s I think.  Also titanium version.  Sorry you had this too.

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I'll offer an odd suggestion. Over the many years I've found some antiquated, what we might consider inferior large format lenses that have a certain look I like. I feel the same about the version-1 35mm Summilux (I'm on my third one.)

 

If you like how the lens renders, then keep it; use it! By its very accidental nature, it is unique.  Enjoy.

Edited by pico
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Can I just add a further thought. If it is de-cementing, then unlike earlier lenses I would suspect that its probably unlikely to worsen. Earlier lenses used Canada Balsam which can deteriorate but can also be repaired. Later UV cured lenses probably won't deteriorate so you may find that you have what you have and if it works ok then its likely that it will continue to do so. I'd just check it under 'difficult' conditions (into the light) to see if veiling flare is significant and at worst unacceptable.

 

Lastly, if it ever endures a further 'shock' and the elements do in fact separate rather than crack then repair should then be possible - you never know ;) .

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I had a similar issue with my first 75mm APO , sent it to Solms, report back was ....."separation of elements due to thermal shock"  and due to the adhesive used the effected elements would have to be changed and the charge would be in the region of £600.00 GBP + VAT ( Tax ) . I don't know about thermal shock but given I had handled the lens with 'kid gloves' I was certainly "in shock" at the size of the repair bill :o

 

Sorry to learn of your issue with your 'Lux, if I were you I think I would have accepted the refund and looked for another.

 

Kind regards,  Simon

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I have no idea what's wrong, but I'm curious about it being irreparable. Can't the affected elements be replaced or are replacements not available? I had a similar question about some older lenses, which it seems were made with notoriously soft glass at the front element, and are commonly scratched from cleaning. Maybe it's not economically worthwhile to make replacement elements/groups for lenses?

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Thank you guys for all the input!

 

Usually I would have had no hesitation in returning the lens for a refund, but I'm really attached to it. Even after only a relatively short while of owning it I missed the lens immensely when it was gone. 

 

I wasn't able to notice any focus shift on this lens despite the many reviews etc. 

 

There is something about the rendering that really speaks to me, so the idea of this lens rendering special due to it's defect is kind of "romantic" as well.

 

Still, some people say it will get worse, some people say it will stay this way.

 

If it stays, I don't really mind. If it were to worsen to the point that it would show in my pictures, that would be a different story. 

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Try contacting someone like http://www.focalpointlens.com (there must be others too) to see what their take is on it - they may be able to give a better opinion on its potential to worsen. AFAIK later adhesives are more likely to de-cement due to stress (thermal or impact) rather than anything else, and I know that it can be very difficult/impossible to separate elements glued together with such adhesives - hence the problem of repair - so to me it seems logical that the problem won't worsen on its own.

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I'd have taken the refund, but if you like this particular lens so much then so what! Keep it and use it as much as you can. It will be difficult to sell on again should you ever want to, but that doesn't seem a consideration for you. 

 

Anyway, having already turned down the offer of a refund the dealer may not be willing to give you a second chance! You may be stuck with your lens regardless.

 

Why not post up an image taken with it for us. 

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Send the lens to Leica Wetzlar for a inspection and a definite quote.

Ask the dealer for a price reduction by exactly this quote.

Continue to use the lens a you like it's imaging as is.

 

When the issue deteriorates, get the lens repaired.

 

This way you received a fair deal - take any lesser offer and the deal is fair for the dealer only.

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That looks like separation. Some  specialists will attempt a repair but it is risky, when separating the elements they will often crack. Basically you should have returned the lens, the price reduction should have been 95%.

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