From M4 to......?

[FrozenInTime]

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. Also, with the M7, you can lock in a desires exposure and then recompose. Not possible with the MP.

 

 

 

err.. with the M6 and MP the exposure is always 'locked in'   so no worries about it changing when you recompose.

But I think I know what you meant - point , AE lock , recompose is quicker than  point, twiddle rings to match LEDs, recompose.

[gberger]

Yup, that's what I meant

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[ReturningToFilm]

Let me suggest you consider the difference between using the internal meter in an M7 vs the meter in the MP. In the M7, you set the aperture you want, taking into account whether or not you desire a shallow or an extended DOF. With AE, the aperture remains fixed, and the exposure varies, and there's no twiddling of the aperture to obtain the desired exposure. In the MP, you set the desired shutter speed, and then manually vary the aperture to obtain the desired exposure. Two different beasts. Also, with the M7, you can lock in a desires exposure and then recompose. Not possible with the MP.

 

With the M7, you'll have both AE and the ability to pretend it's an M4. Get a incident / reflective meter (such as the Sekonic 308S) and you have the best of both worlds - - - a reflective meter in the M7/Sekonic, an incident meter for shooting where you select both aperture and speed, just like the M4.

 

BTW: Since 1946,I've owned a IIIc, M4, M6, M6TTL, M7, and now a a la carte MP. IMO, for sheer shooting experience, the M7 tops the list.

Thank you for this- this probably the most persuasive post thus far. If adding to an M4 the M7 does offer more features that would make it stand apart as being different - I think (as said elsewhere above) that if a viewfinder update to MP +/- personalised flourishes like engraving then this could be done at leisure later. Looking at newish second hand M7's it's almost a no brainer (as also stated earlier!) - they are 1k less than an MP giving more room to invest in lenses, the primary reason for using the M system after all.

This has been a really informative thread- thanks to everyone for expressing your views.

 

On the basis of everything considered I shall be on the look out for as new as possible 2nd hand M7 black paint.....watch this space!

Regards

Paul

[BerndReini]

I don't think Leica made an M7 in black paint. Only black chrome as far as I know.

[ReturningToFilm]

Ah! Thanks for the clarification...

[Franek_]

more room to invest in lenses, the primary reason for using the M system after all.

 

Not for everyone. I honestly tell, that I can't distinguish photos taken (on film camera) for example with Leica's 50/2 and Zeiss 50/2. Or Konica. Or something other. For years, many of those great Leica shooters in the 50's and 60's were shooting with Leica cameras and nikon or canon lenses. For me, the greatest thing in M system is their fantastic film bodies.

 

I shall be on the look out for as new as possible 2nd hand M7 black paint.....watch this space!
 

Only black chrome. Which in fact is better, because for many years it will look like new, and don't get that hipster's pretending it was on duty since 1950 and saw the Vietnam war.

 

 

 

I think that M7 is the way to go.

[asiafish]

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I thought it might also, but it didn't turn out that way in practice.  Unlike matrix/evalutative metering, the M meter is easily "fooled" in many situations, eg when the subject is much smaller than the metered area, and darker or lighter than the surroundings.  Merely composing, focusing and accepting the meter reading led to many gross errors in exposure, so I found myself using exposure lock often, and that was a time-waster.  In manual mode, or using a separate meter, I tended to take a reading off a middle tone and as long as the light didn't change I stuck with it or shifted shutter speed or aperture according to my experience if I felt the subject itself needed more or less light to be rendered as I wanted it to be. 

 

Hence the M5, which is not "fooled" as it is a true spot meter.

[pgk]

Dear Film experts

You have probably gleaned from various posts that I have an M4 and now a 35mm Cron Asph....and I'm very happy....but and this might be an element of GAS...but I'm prepared to save up (I don't have a huge disposable income) over the next year to get an M with an in built meter, that's newer and therefore perhaps will be in better shape to hand on to one of the kids. I don't want to sell the M4. This is with a view to a second M body.

A cheaper option might be a full CLA on your M4 from Leica. M4s are minimally 40 years old and many are still going strong (mine is being rebuilt or has been, I'm awaiting its arrival, but has had a very hard life and whilst it was working it really needed to be serviced and have a new body shell fitted). A full CLA will probably set it up well for another 40 years. My favourite film Leica by far. The perhaps save up for more glass .....

[michaelwj]

Wandering around Marseille today with m4 and handheld- can see built in would be less cumbersome but most of the readings are sunny 16 compatible, so maybe don't need a meter at all lol!

 

Yep, you don't.

 

I took the battery out of my M6 last year and rarely take a handheld meter with me. As a child of the digital age, it's so liberating.

 

My 2c is whatever you get, hang on the the M4 for a little while to make sure you prefer the new one.

 

Cheers,

Michael

[pico]

If you have enjoyed the M4, then why get an MA which is over-priced compared to pristine M4s on the market? It makes no sense to buy an MA today. If you wish to spend money on an M4, I have one from 1968, black enamel, never used.

.

Edited October 14, 2015 by pico

[ramarren]

If you have enjoyed the M4, then why get an MA which is over-priced compared to pristine M4s on the market? It makes no sense to buy an MA today. If you wish to spend money on an M4, I have one from 1968, black enamel, never used.

.

Because someone might like a new camera with warranty that isn't 45+ years old...?

[pico]

Because someone might like a new camera with warranty that isn't 45+ years old...?

 

Compare the cost of an MA with an M4, and if one chooses wisely he can buy three M4s instead of an MA.

It is a no-brainer. The MA is not a wise choice. IMHO, of course. Is it now always that way?

.

[sumolux]

I think it is great for film lovers everywhere that the M-A is being produced by Leica, and therefore let's applaud those who purchase the M-A.

 

But I have to agree with pico; an M4 in good condition is in my view just unbeatable, a joy to use, which is why I have 2 of them.

Buying an M-A is fine for the feeling of ownership, the support of Leica, and being a first time owner of a new camera.

You just have to be prepared to pay a premium for the honor.

I'll stick with the M4 

[Broadside]

I would imagine that a '68, black enamel, mint M4 is the pinnacle of Leica M's.

Maybe one day.

[ramarren]

I think it is great for film lovers everywhere that the M-A is being produced by Leica, and therefore let's applaud those who purchase the M-A.

 

But I have to agree with pico; an M4 in good condition is in my view just unbeatable, a joy to use, which is why I have 2 of them.

Buying an M-A is fine for the feeling of ownership, the support of Leica, and being a first time owner of a new camera.

You just have to be prepared to pay a premium for the honor.

I'll stick with the M4 

 

Oh if you've got a nice film M there's no reason to pay the premium; nothing wrong with that. I have my favorite film M already—M4-2—so I'm not inclined to buy an M-A myself at the moment. But I see nothing "right" or "better" about buying a 48 year old M4 over a new M-A. If everyone thought that way, Leica would stop making film cameras and eventually parts supplies and film Leicas would die out of the world. That's the reality of it. So you save some money... Big deal. Buy a Leica M-A, new, use it a lot, keep it for thirty-forty years: the price premium becomes irrelevant. 

 

Being so so obsessed with just saving money isn't healthy. Saving money isn't why I buy camera equipment and do Photography. I economize where I can but I get the equipment I want/need/think is sensible/think will do what I want. Someone has to buy new lenses, new bodies or the manufacturer goes out of business. Is that what you all want?

[sblitz]

Had an M4, looking to buy another, own an MA. Why? Viewfinder is brighter and no flare. Found the finder on the M6 flared much more than the M4. In my hands, the MA and M4 feel the same and sound the same. Love 'em both but I do enjoy knowing each scratch on the MA is mine (unfortunately it is unlikely to get almost 50 years of use out of this owner, but such is life). I am grateful that I can pay for that privilege and the better viewfinder, but if I couldn't I would be and was very very happy with the M4.

[sblitz]

Pico -- PM me on your price for your M4.

[pico]

One thing to consider when comparing an M4 with M-A is frame lines.

The M4 has 35, 50, 90, 135,  the M-A and M4-P have 28, 35, 50, 75, 90, 135.

 

I got an M4-P for the 75mm lines, and just put up with the cluttered view.

Edited October 14, 2015 by pico

[wattsy]

One thing to consider when comparing an M4 with M-A is frame lines.

The M4 has 35, 50, 90, 135,  the M-A and M4-P have 28, 35, 50, 75, 90, 135.

 

I got an M4-P for the 75mm lines, and just put up with the cluttered view.

 

This is true but, as modern Leicas go, the M-A does have a comparatively uncluttered view. Unlike the MP and M7, the M-A has 75 and 135 frames that are barely noticeable, just tiny little tick marks.

 

 

 

It makes no sense to buy an MA today. If you wish to spend money on an M4, I have one from 1968, black enamel, never used.

 

The trouble is you won't sell it (I asked you to sell it to me quite some time ago) and I dare say it is worth as much, if not more, than a new M-A.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[pico]

The trouble is you won't sell it (I asked you to sell it to me quite some time ago) and I dare say it is worth as much, if not more, than a new M-A.

Sorry about that. There have been some daunting changes here.

 

$4,500 USD OBO. When I say unused I mean that not even the rewind switch has any wear/brassing and that is usually the first part to show use. The strap is still in the original plastic baggie.