What would Kodak, Fuji or Illford have done?

[Beewacker]

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It's hard to feel good about Leica's announcement to replace sensors as they begin to corrode, instead of just recalling all cameras manufactured with the defective sensor.

 

If any one of the film manufactures sent out a batch of film that didn't meet spec's, they'd recall it rather than risk the rath of thousands of customers with ruined photos. Yes, a roll of film might have cost $9.99, but multiply that by a couple hundred thousand rolls and you'd have an expensive recall.

 

When will mine fail?

On the trip of my lifetime, when I leave for my retirement sail down the North and South American coasts?

No joke here about the sailing, I have the boat and those are my plans.

You plan well ahead for such a trip, and photography happens to be one of the things that I've been planning the most for.

Should I use my iPhone for all critical photographs?

 

Come on Leica, do the right thing and issue a recall for ALL M9 sensors, before they ruin the trip of a lifetime for someone.

 

Ron Rowe

[Manoleica]

Sell it,  buy a new camera.........

(bleating will not cure anything)..

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[johnloumiles]

Well first of all I don't think it's a certain batch of cameras that are susceptible to this particular problem, rather every camera with the original M9 sensor has the potential for corrosion. So that would mean recalling every single M9 at once. Leica is a relatively small company; can you imagine the wait if they brought in all the cameras together? I think it's 2-4 weeks as is. Second, if your sensor looks clean before the trip then there's more then a good change you'll be ok. Anyone please correct me If I'm wrong but I don't think it pops up overnight in its worst form. It's starts as a tiny speck and grows larger. Most people are fine with the arrangement as is. I know speaking for myself my camera was built in 2009 and the sensor is perfectly clean. Meaning I don't want to have to send it in unless I have to, but it's nice to know its there just in case. While I can understand your trepidation, your situation is 1 in 10,000 and shouldn't really warrant everyone sending in their M9. The great thing about digital is that it's not film in that way. Instead of a important roll being ruined pre-exposure we can see immediately after only one shot that something is wrong. So while Kodak may issue a recall, it's an apple as and oranges situation.

Edited September 4, 2015 by johnloumiles

[250swb]

As you say John, it doesn't pop up overnight, and I would imagine there are some people spotting out the initial small blobs caused by corrosion thinking it dust many months before they recognise it is a more serious problem. I think the answer for any M9 owner is to be on top of dust so when the tell tail blobs appear which can't be cleaned off they can make a plan of action in good time. But it's not a cause for panicking.

 

Steve

[jaapv]

It's hard to feel good about Leica's announcement to replace sensors as they begin to corrode, instead of just recalling all cameras manufactured with the defective sensor.

 

If any one of the film manufactures sent out a batch of film that didn't meet spec's, they'd recall it rather than risk the rath of thousands of customers with ruined photos. Yes, a roll of film might have cost $9.99, but multiply that by a couple hundred thousand rolls and you'd have an expensive recall.

 

When will mine fail?

On the trip of my lifetime, when I leave for my retirement sail down the North and South American coasts?

No joke here about the sailing, I have the boat and those are my plans.

You plan well ahead for such a trip, and photography happens to be one of the things that I've been planning the most for.

Should I use my iPhone for all critical photographs?

 

Come on Leica, do the right thing and issue a recall for ALL M9 sensors, before they ruin the trip of a lifetime for someone.

 

Ron Rowe

The false presumptions are :

1. that it will fail at all, there is no proof, the number of cameras sent in is only a fraction of all cameras made, the rest is just speculation.

2. That this is a sudden failure. It will take corrosion months if not longer from the first signs to full unusability.

[fiftyonepointsix]

Any camera can fail at any time. Sensor corrosion can be easily inspected, and it takes a long time to set in.

 

"Trip of a Lifetime": Backup to the Backup camera is required. Five is Two; Two is One; One is NONE. Good rule to follow for field trips and trips of a lifetime.

 

The S8612 cover glass has the best optical characteristics available for passing visible light and absorbing IR. If it is not corroded: I will NOT replace it. I want the S8612 to last forever. If it does not, the M9 and/or M monochrom goes in for sensor replacement and the M8 and M3 would be used on the trip.

Edited September 4, 2015 by fiftyonepointsix

[earleygallery]

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Why recall a perfectly good camera (sensor) ?

 

When and if your camera shows signs of the issue you send it in and get the new sensor.

 

I don't know if Leica will be prepared to replace good original sensors with the new one free of charge though.

 

If it's a worry for you why not just ask them?

[tobey bilek]

Buy something new.   Now way would I go on a trip with one camera of any kind.

[jaapv]

If I were to go on an extended sailing trip I would not worry too much about sensor corrosion, I would be more concerned about internal condensation. That can kill a camera overnight...

[Printmaker]

As a sailor and Leica photographer my advice would be to invest in a Pelican case and keep your Leica in the case. Everything gets wet on a sailboat. The case will protect the camera. I know because my 1200 case flew out of its locker and floated in the bilge water for an hour after an open ocean knock down with the main hatch open. The camera was fine... the rigging, well that's another story. Ever lost your spreaders?

 

I wouldn't worry too much about the sensor. If it looks fine now, then it should hold together for the trip. And, even if it develops some crud, a little time in Photoshop with the bandaid will fix your images. But if you can't sleep at night worrying about the sensor, then sell your M9 and buy a used M240. The difference isn't all that much. And the weather seals are better.

 

I know what you are going through planning a voyage. There are hundreds of details and they all cost thousands of dollars. You always seem to need something more, something better. Take a deep breath, relax and take things in order of importance. Good foul weather gear, an unbreakable harness and a spare manual bilge pump is far more critical than your camera. After you have planned for the worst then you can relax and enjoy the best.

 

My first real boat was a grand old 1936 Tahiti Ketch. I put a lot of miles on her including a solo Pacific crossing. Wonderful boat for a younger sailor (all block and tackle). I replaced her with a Cheoy Lee Offshore 40 which I eventually found to be a bit too big. If you don't mind me asking, what is your choice of a retirement boat?

[Ted Lemon]

It's hard to feel good about Leica's announcement to replace sensors as they begin to corrode, instead of just recalling all cameras manufactured with the defective sensor.

 

If any one of the film manufactures sent out a batch of film that didn't meet spec's, they'd recall it rather than risk the rath of thousands of customers with ruined photos. Yes, a roll of film might have cost $9.99, but multiply that by a couple hundred thousand rolls and you'd have an expensive recall.

 

When will mine fail?

On the trip of my lifetime, when I leave for my retirement sail down the North and South American coasts?

No joke here about the sailing, I have the boat and those are my plans.

You plan well ahead for such a trip, and photography happens to be one of the things that I've been planning the most for.

Should I use my iPhone for all critical photographs?

 

Come on Leica, do the right thing and issue a recall for ALL M9 sensors, before they ruin the trip of a lifetime for someone.

 

Ron Rowe

 

I am a blue ocean sailor and last year sailed across the Atlantic and around the West Indies - took a Lumix DMC-FT5 - great little camera and weather sealed. Took it diving too. I leave it on my day boat at the moment and its nice not to have to worry about the Leica kit when really you should be more concerned with weather and sail setting! Good luck on your trip - sounds fantastic.

Edited September 6, 2015 by Ted Lemon

[Ted Lemon]

As a sailor and Leica photographer my advice would be to invest in a Pelican case and keep your Leica in the case. Everything gets wet on a sailboat. The case will protect the camera. I know because my 1200 case flew out of its locker and floated in the bilge water for an hour after an open ocean knock down with the main hatch open. The camera was fine... the rigging, well that's another story. Ever lost your spreaders?

 

I wouldn't worry too much about the sensor. If it looks fine now, then it should hold together for the trip. And, even if it develops some crud, a little time in Photoshop with the bandaid will fix your images. But if you can't sleep at night worrying about the sensor, then sell your M9 and buy a used M240. The difference isn't all that much. And the weather seals are better.

 

I know what you are going through planning a voyage. There are hundreds of details and they all cost thousands of dollars. You always seem to need something more, something better. Take a deep breath, relax and take things in order of importance. Good foul weather gear, an unbreakable harness and a spare manual bilge pump is far more critical than your camera. After you have planned for the worst then you can relax and enjoy the best.

 

My first real boat was a grand old 1936 Tahiti Ketch. I put a lot of miles on her including a solo Pacific crossing. Wonderful boat for a younger sailor (all block and tackle). I replaced her with a Cheoy Lee Offshore 40 which I eventually found to be a bit too big. If you don't mind me asking, what is your choice of a retirement boat?

Losing spreaders on the ocean must have been an interesting challenge! Been knocked down and lost masts before but happily all within sight of shore. It can be an expensive business sailing  - may even put Leica purchasing in the shade!

[tobey bilek]

You need a back up camera anyway.

 

I understand most failures are in humid areas.   

[sblutter]

I wonder how many bodies there are with corroded sensors sitting on shelves never to be used again.  40%, 50% that were made?  A large percent for sure.  Collectors that wont dare break the seals etc.

 

Why bother recalling?  No point if they're not being used

[fiftyonepointsix]

The only digital cameras worth collecting are old ones that are 2cents on the dollar. 

 

I have a few of those.

 

Anyone buying a Digital Leica for a collection and not using it is in for a rude awakening when they go to sell it, thinking they will be making a profit.

[shootinglulu]

I read this topic each time.."What would Kojak ..have done"!

Edited September 21, 2015 by shootinglulu

[jevidon]

It's hard to feel good about Leica's announcement to replace sensors as they begin to corrode, instead of just recalling all cameras manufactured with the defective sensor.

 

If any one of the film manufactures sent out a batch of film that didn't meet spec's, they'd recall it rather than risk the rath of thousands of customers with ruined photos. Yes, a roll of film might have cost $9.99, but multiply that by a couple hundred thousand rolls and you'd have an expensive recall.

 

When will mine fail?

On the trip of my lifetime, when I leave for my retirement sail down the North and South American coasts?

No joke here about the sailing, I have the boat and those are my plans.

You plan well ahead for such a trip, and photography happens to be one of the things that I've been planning the most for.

Should I use my iPhone for all critical photographs?

 

Come on Leica, do the right thing and issue a recall for ALL M9 sensors, before they ruin the trip of a lifetime for someone.

 

Ron Rowe

First if all, the failure is  not sudden nor is it catastrophic. When it does appear, it will appear as small "dust" spots of a distinctive character much like a tiny water spot for lack of a more precise description. You can continue to use the camera and eliminate the spot (s) by the usual means in photoshop or lightroom, etc. The camera will continue to take excelllent images until you decide that it is time to get the sensor replaced, at which time you will send it in to Leica. They will return it in a few weeks together with a complete CLA for which there will be no charge. My sensor weas replaced with one of the then current old batch, but for a few months now, Leica has or will have the new sensor which is the same sensor design with a non-corroding replacement cover glass which was the culprit subject to the corrosion in  the first place.

 

To compare a complex and expensive assembly like the M9 made by a relatively small company to a roll of film made by a one time and nows defunct corporate giant is hardly fair.

 

Maybe your best option is to to get rid of your Leica now and buy a Sony, Nikon, Canon or Fuji so you won't lose any further sleep over the sensor issue. If you decide to do so, please let the forum users know. I'm sure you will get plenty of offers. Otherwise, like most of us, continue to enjoy your camera and take other action when, and if the problem should arise.

[hepcat]

Losing spreaders on the ocean must have been an interesting challenge! Been knocked down and lost masts before but happily all within sight of shore. It can be an expensive business sailing  - may even put Leica purchasing in the shade!

A  sailboat, by definition is: "a hole in the water surrounded by wood (or fiberglass) into which one pours money."  

 

I'm a freshwater, fair-weather trailer-sailor, so my expenses are relatively limited compared to a blue-water boat, but nonetheless lake sailing on the prairie can come with some unanticipated and startling, violent weather.  The closest I've come to being knocked down was the second week of boat ownership as a novice sailor.  I got hit with a 45+ knot gust of wind while flying the full main and a 150 genoa on a tall-mast 24' Neptune.  Fortunately, I was scared to death and instinctively let go of the sheets ('cause I didn't know what else to do) and the boat righted itself, but not after the cabin windows were under water.   No damage, but it gave me a life-long respect for what the wind can do.

 

I admire you blue-water sailors.

 

Oh, and I have a Fuji X-T1 that goes out on the boat instead of my M9.  it's splash-proof.   Oh, and my M9 had its sensor replaced with the original replacement just a couple of months before they announced the new sensor... I'm hoping mine will be good for another three or four years before it has to go back.  Frankly, though, the process was quite painless and as I had some commercial work to shoot during the time they had it, they actually sent me a loaner M-E.  It all worked out.

 

And I don't ever recall Kodak, Fuji, or any other manufacturer recalling film.  And in the '70s, 3M should have recalled every roll they ever produced! 

[jdlaing]

Rog.......

 

Lest we forget you ARE a blue water sailor.

 

:-)

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[hepcat]

Rog.......

 

Lest we forget you ARE a blue water sailor.

 

:-)

Jim, I was in the Brown Shoe Navy.  In the five years I was in,  the only real blue-water time I had was flying in P3 Orions on the "Yellow Brick Road" from Moffett Field to Adak looking for Soviet shipping and teaching the aircrew how to use their 5" belly cameras, and then three years at NAS Agana, Guam.  I don't think that either counts.  I did cross the quarterdeck of the USS Proteus (AS-19) one afternoon to visit a buddy on a boomer, the USS Ethan Allen SSBN-608.  Does that count?  Ha ha ha!!!