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400 Leica photographers agree: we love CCD!


Prosophos

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A permanent technical solution could aso be a replace the camera at a concessionary price. (...)

The following extract from Leica's statement above makes this appear an additional option. 

We (...) are currently concentrating our efforts on finding a permanent technical solution.  (...) Should you, as an M customer, be considering an upgrade from your camera to a Leica M or M-P (Typ 240), Customer Care would be pleased to make you an attractive offer following a check of your camera and under consideration of the model and its age.

 

A trade-in would not be called a technical solution, I believe. Besides, they mentioned the amount of money it costs them to repair a camera with a faulty sensor, and it seems to me it might still be cheaper to repair the cameras instead of replacing them by later models. I can't quite recall the amount mentioned, but it seemed to be in the vicinity of some €1600. 

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"Many of us who appreciate the M9 sensor are not really interested in trading-in, or trading-"up" (I've owend two M-240 cameras and one M-P(240), and by far prefer the image rendering of the M9/MM1)."

 

Exactly! Many are not interested in being left with no alternative except to upgrade their CCD sensor based M9, MM1 or even possibly a recently purchased M-E...which they may have purchased not due to the M-E being an entry level camera but specifically due to their preference for its rendering. I doubt if that was the case and they possibly spend $5400...now want to be told just a few short yeats later...sorry we can't fix your camera so you'll not only have to upgrade but spend quite a bit of sum of money doing so.

 

I don't think or believe if Leica decided to investigate a new CCD based camera...that its in place of CMOS...simply an optional alternative. Whats also not to say that some form of new CCD sensor might investigated that has far more capbilities or advantages of what we perceive are its current capabilities.

 

Dave (D&A)

Edited by DandA
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Leica is very lucky to have such a loyal customer base. This situation could be a death knell, or at the very least, a huge concussion to the company, but it has not and will not be. That said, I for one am really quite displeased with the m9 sensor's corrosion. I bought my M9 it the height of it's price, and then I got it upgraded to an M9-P.
While I understand that cameras of today have a shorter life than their older film brothers, I am still mad that my expensive, and awesome Leica, is having problems at this time, a time far too quick and short. My camera is going in to Leica USA-NJ, in early July, and I am going to choose to go for the replacement sensor.
Mark 

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I used to have a Leica Monochrom (M9). I owned it from new in 2014 - but just for a short time - 2 months and only 800 shots. I had been spoiled by the handling of the M240.

 

But, I decided recently that I wanted one again. A new listing appeared at my local dealer for a "user grade" one the same day I decided I wanted one again. I decided to buy it... and discovered it was exactly the same camera I used to own - I was its first owner and now I'm its third owner.

 

My previous grumpiness with this camera was all about the handling - poor buffer / writing issues, buzzy noisy shutter, poor rear screen, etc. I never had an issue with nor felt I needed more from the sensor. Let's see what I can get from the camera this second time around. Perhaps I will have more patience this time, and really learn to use it and accept its foibles. Far better photographers than me have demonstrated what can be done with it... including this copy's last owner.

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I used to have a Leica Monochrom (M9). I owned it from new in 2014 - but just for a short time - 2 months and only 800 shots. I had been spoiled by the handling of the M240.

 

But, I decided recently that I wanted one again. A new listing appeared at my local dealer for a "user grade" one the same day I decided I wanted one again. I decided to buy it... and discovered it was exactly the same camera I used to own - I was its first owner and now I'm its third owner.

 

My previous grumpiness with this camera was all about the handling - poor buffer / writing issues, buzzy noisy shutter, poor rear screen, etc. I never had an issue with nor felt I needed more from the sensor. Let's see what I can get from the camera this second time around. Perhaps I will have more patience this time, and really learn to use it and accept its foibles. Far better photographers than me have demonstrated what can be done with it... including this copy's last owner.

 

 

Congratulations!  Hopefully you will find satisfaction with this camera the second time around.

 

On a related note, I quite consistently have 1 or 2 emails sent to me each week by individuals who have "returned" to the M9 after trying out other cameras.  That sort of behaviour (returning to an "old" model) is unusual with respect to digital cameras — but then again the M9 is unique. 

 

Peter.

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Congratulations!  Hopefully you will find satisfaction with this camera the second time around.

 

On a related note, I quite consistently have 1 or 2 emails sent to me each week by individuals who have "returned" to the M9 after trying out other cameras.  That sort of behaviour (returning to an "old" model) is unusual with respect to digital cameras — but then again the M9 is unique. 

 

Peter.

 

Thanks Peter.

 

My first digital M was the M240. I have never tried an M9 (apart from the MM).

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I'm totally invested in Leica CCD - M9, MM and S2. About the only hmm the M240 invokes is the ability to use a EVF with 21, 90 and 135 lenses. But these are my least used lenses so it is a very quiet hmm.

 

The image quality of these cameras is stunning. Here is a shot from yesterday taken with the S2. And another from the day before taken with the Monochrom.

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"Many of us who appreciate the M9 sensor are not really interested in trading-in, or trading-"up" (I've owend two M-240 cameras and one M-P(240), and by far prefer the image rendering of the M9/MM1)."

 

Exactly! Many are not interested in being left with no alternative except to upgrade their CCD sensor based M9, MM1 or even possibly a recently purchased M-E...which they may have purchased not due to the M-E being an entry level camera but specifically due to their preference for its rendering. I doubt if that was the case and they possibly spend $5400...now want to be told just a few short yeats later...sorry we can't fix your camera so you'll not only have to upgrade but spend quite a bit of sum of money doing so.

 

I don't think or believe if Leica decided to investigate a new CCD based camera...that its in place of CMOS...simply an optional alternative. Whats also not to say that some form of new CCD sensor might investigated that has far more capbilities or advantages of what we perceive are its current capabilities.

 

Dave (D&A)

I just bought my M-E seven weeks ago for just that reason.  I could have bought an M240 if that was what I wanted, but bought one of the last M-Es (to use with I my 2 year old M Monochrom) because it (the M-E) was what I wanted to own and shoot.  I like the look, and while I am sure I could get close with an M240, I also know it would take a lot of work in post that I'd rather skip.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Just to be clear: this is NOT about a new sensor, it is about a corrosion-resistant IR filter on the existing sensor.

 

Exactly, this would be the neatest outcome.They then understand the problem and can take this into consideration with future developments (which may include CMOS, who knows), they provide a permanent technical solution, they further underpin the Brand by demonstrating technological progress and full customer support. 

 

There is nothing naive about that as seems to have been suggested. Don't forget the S is CCD, haven't even looked to see if there are issued there.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Sorry to break the news but nobody cares about the perceived needs of 400 photographers. A camera built for 400 (or 1000) customers would have to be ludicrously expensive and I rather doubt those 400 photographers would be prepared to pay that price.

 

How about crowd funding :)

 

But maybe 400 are the ones bothered to sign and in fact it represents less then 1% of those actually interested ?

 

I think the M9 is different from the M240. Not sure how much its due to sensor and how much software but as the same comments have been made about the Pentax 645D vs the 645Z and other cameras such as the Nikon D2x, there might be something in it. I still prefer photos from the M9 at base ISO to the 240. Not that I don't love the 240 pics .....

 

Rgds

Edited by colonel
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Printmaker:

 

Your images above are a perfect example of why I prefer the CCD sensor.  They contain a drama that's more than just a composition, and PP.  To me they go straight to a place in my psyche that CMOS sensor images seldom reach.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I just bought my M-E seven weeks ago for just that reason.  I could have bought an M240 if that was what I wanted, but bought one of the last M-Es (to use with I my 2 year old M Monochrom) because it (the M-E) was what I wanted to own and shoot.  I like the look, and while I am sure I could get close with an M240, I also know it would take a lot of work in post that I'd rather skip.

Could not agree more.  I also just purchased an M-E because I like the way the CCD renders light, and as much as it was a stretch financially, I knew if I didn't get one now that they would soon be gone, and I would not have a CCD sensor for my Leica glass.

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Here are some recent shots from my M-E on a trip to Korea last month.  The first two shot with a 50mm f/2 Summicron v5, the rest with a coated 1963 Zomz 5cm f/1.5 Jupiter 3 (Zeiss Sonnar knock-off).

 

18508606214_c44e5b101b_b.jpgL1001501.jpg by Lawman1967, on Flickr

 

18944980639_7f0f0e529d_b.jpgL1001471.jpg by Lawman1967, on Flickr

 

18784238539_1e9cb6bfc4_b.jpgL1001077 by Lawman1967, on Flickr

 

18347674423_3d89a08465_b.jpgL1001062.jpg by Lawman1967, on Flickr

 

18780620200_c7ece6c875_b.jpgL1001037.jpg by Lawman1967, on Flickr

 

18761886118_0b252be57e_b.jpgL1000971.jpg by Lawman1967, on Flickr

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