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Testing the M(240)


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#1 jonoslack

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 10:54

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HI There
I've just finished reading Ming Thein and Sean Reid's excellent reports. . .

FWIW, here's my piece -

Testing the Leica M(240)



Enjoy (at least, I hope you do).
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kind regards
jono slack

#2 Erik Gunst Lund

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 11:16

Great article Jono,
So the new M was in Copenhagen :) Nice to see.
This have now removed my last doubts about this camera, and by the look of things most likely I will decide to keep it!
Thanks!
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#3 Archiver

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 12:45

Jono, thank you for the preliminary report and thank you for so patiently fielding questions from all of us. And I love it that Leica are doing what almost no other manufacturer does: allowing prototype testers to write their own reports and even post samples, before official release. The reports from you and Ming make me wish I had got on the list of my usual dealer when the announcement was first made! Thanks again.
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~ Loving Every Image Captured Always ~
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#4 k-hawinkler

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 12:50

Hi Jono,

Excellent write up and even better pictures. Thank you indeed!
This is the first time I have seen the term "considered photography", very creative to say the least.

In the chapter, starting with "First of all the bad news." you describe some less than stellar characteristics of the new M.
Thank you for doing that. I really appreciate your candor.

I had heard rumors to that effect, such as "almost a second blackout after taking a picture in Live View (or with the EVF)", etc. but didn't know what to make of it.
Also "the 30 fps refresh rate is slow enough to produce ‘tearing’ with moving subjects" gives me a pause.

I get the impression from your and Ming Thein's write up (The 2013 Leica M Typ 240 – Ming Thein | Photographer) that the M 240 is the best digital rangefinder camera Leica is developing.

It definitely seems to be a rangefinder camera worth having - once finished.

With regards to "The First Full Frame Interchangeable lens Mirrorless Camera" I am ambivalent about its utility for Leica R lenses and the lenses of other makes.

I need to get an M into my hands first and find out what I find it useful for as an ILMC.

Luckily, R lenses are of excellent utility on NEXs and OMDs, I find.

Also, no word on video capabilities yet. I guess one has to read in between the lines.

Thanks again for your very informative and timely write up, expertly done.

Edited by k-hawinkler, 22 February 2013 - 12:57.

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With best regards, K-H.

#5 Paul J

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 12:58

Thanks so much for the the wonderfully written article with really lovely pictures. It's all very balanced and honest.
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Perception. Not perfection

#6 stevelap

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 13:11

A really enjoyable and informative article Jono, many thanks.
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Regards
Steve

#7 sunafan

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 13:22

A really enjoyable and informative article Jono, many thanks.


... and very impressive images!
Thanks a lot
Lutz
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#8 jonoslack

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 13:23

Hi There

With regards to "The First Full Frame Interchangeable lens Mirrorless Camera" I am ambivalent about its utility for Leica R lenses and the lenses of other makes.

I need to get an M into my hands first and find out what I find it useful for as an ILMC.

Luckily, R lenses are of excellent utility on NEXs and OMDs, I find.


Well, actually, I'd much MUCH rather use the R lenses on the M - The resulting images are fantastic. For my normal use there are almost no downsides. It's just that it's not a speed demon in Live mode - only that. But to be honest I can't quite see where you'd actually want it to be. I mean, do you use R lenses on the OMD for sport shooting? (I know I don't). Or even for street shooting - where the rangefinder is still king in my opinion.

As I said, considered photography - that doesn't mean that the 28-90 on the M isn't the most fantastic carry about combo - with image quality to die for (especially compared to the OMD and NEX).


Also, no word on video capabilities yet. I guess one has to read in between the lines..

. . Please don't read between any of my lines :). I know that Ming and Sean are the same, we simply are not qualified to comment on the Video - as far as I can see it's absolutely splendid (no question marks). But what do I know?:o

Thanks again for your very informative and timely write up, expertly done.

Thank you - glad you enjoyed it.

all the best
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kind regards
jono slack

#9 jonoslack

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 13:30

Great article Jono,
So the new M was in Copenhagen :) Nice to see.
This have now removed my last doubts about this camera, and by the look of things most likely I will decide to keep it!
Thanks!


Hi Erik
Yes it was - I was so sorry not to be able to show it around, but I wasn't allowed to for diplomatic reasons (nothing to do with the camera).
If you want a digital M, then the camera is a no-brainer (I love it). If you want a full frame mirrorless then it's peerless as long as you aren't in too much of a hurry. At least, that's how I see it.

Hope to meet up again soon.

all the best
kind regards
jono slack

#10 jonoslack

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 13:31

Jono, thank you for the preliminary report and thank you for so patiently fielding questions from all of us. And I love it that Leica are doing what almost no other manufacturer does: allowing prototype testers to write their own reports and even post samples, before official release. The reports from you and Ming make me wish I had got on the list of my usual dealer when the announcement was first made! Thanks again.


HI There
Thank you - just worth mentioning again that Leica really really do give us a free hand with this. I think it's great as well.
Nice for me to be able to show off some images which I'm personally pleased with.

all the best
kind regards
jono slack

#11 k-hawinkler

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 13:54

Hi There



Well, actually, I'd much MUCH rather use the R lenses on the M - The resulting images are fantastic. For my normal use there are almost no downsides. It's just that it's not a speed demon in Live mode - only that. But to be honest I can't quite see where you'd actually want it to be. I mean, do you use R lenses on the OMD for sport shooting? (I know I don't). Or even for street shooting - where the rangefinder is still king in my opinion.

As I said, considered photography - that doesn't mean that the 28-90 on the M isn't the most fantastic carry about combo - with image quality to die for (especially compared to the OMD and NEX).



. . Please don't read between any of my lines :). I know that Ming and Sean are the same, we simply are not qualified to comment on the Video - as far as I can see it's absolutely splendid (no question marks). But what do I know?:o


Thank you - glad you enjoyed it.

all the best



Hi Jono,

Well I had Doug Herr in mind and his amazing BIF, all manually focused with his Leica R cameras.
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With best regards, K-H.

#12 andyedward

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 13:54

I read Sean's review first, and whilst positive, I got the impression the M240 isnt significantly better than the M9 in terms of image quality (with the exception of better high iso performance, of course). Whilst I'd prefer the M240, Sean's review perhaps highlights how good the M9 is.

#13 jonoslack

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 14:06

Hi Jono,

Well I had Doug Herr in mind and his amazing BIF, all manually focused with his Leica R cameras.


HI There
I did too - and have as well. In my experience this sort of shooting is reasonably 'considered', and I've found it fine for shooting deer and dogs - I'm sure that birds would also be fine - as long as they aren't flying!

We shall see.
kind regards
jono slack

#14 jonoslack

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 14:10

I read Sean's review first, and whilst positive, I got the impression the M240 isnt significantly better than the M9 in terms of image quality (with the exception of better high iso performance, of course). Whilst I'd prefer the M240, Sean's review perhaps highlights how good the M9 is.


HI Andy
We all agree that the IQ of the M9 is excellent (at low-middle ISO)

In terms of IQ, we all seem to agree that the M is between one and a third, and one and a half extra stops better. That's pretty significant in low light. The dynamic range is also noticeably improved (which mitigates against the camera in terms of 'snap' compared to the M9) but of course, you can always limit the dynamic range, but it's not so easy to increase it.

In terms of the camera itself (as a digital rangefinder). It's wonderful - it's such a huge improvement over the M9 in every respect. Whilst there are some limitations to use as a mirrorless camera - there are no limitations to the IQ, which is wonderful.

You Will Not Be Able To Resist (I have 2 bodies on order).

all the best
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#15 k-hawinkler

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 14:14

HI There
I did too - and have as well. In my experience this sort of shooting is reasonably 'considered', and I've found it fine for shooting deer and dogs - I'm sure that birds would also be fine - as long as they aren't flying!

We shall see.



I understand your point.
But Doug apparently is looking for a replacement for his R cameras to shoot also birds in flight. This M simply doesn't fit that bill IMHO. We'll see what Doug has to say to this point.
With best regards, K-H.

#16 kdriceman

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 14:45

Thank you Jono for this well written report. I read both Sean Reid's report and yours this morning. It has been quite enjoyable as both are well written but very different. They complement each other well.

#17 jonoslack

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 14:53

Thank you Jono for this well written report. I read both Sean Reid's report and yours this morning. It has been quite enjoyable as both are well written but very different. They complement each other well.


Thank you!
Don't miss Ming Thein's interesting report. Different again, but you will notice that we agree about the camera in large measure.
All the best
kind regards
jono slack

#18 luigi bertolotti

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 15:34

Thanks for the report, Jono !! I got this morning Ming Thein's and now yours... and tonight hope to give a look at Reid's...
Very useful remarks, and, let me say, finally we have seen really GREAT pictures form M !!! The abstract-first one is a masterpiece of its own, the WATE one is pure beauty... and (admit ;)) there is also a blink to W.E. Smith...

#19 mirekti

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 15:43

You wrote: "I’ve written something like 20 lines on Image Quality - I wonder how many thousands of lines will appear on the internet over the next few weeks!"

Does this mean the shippment is around the corner? ;)

#20 krooj

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 15:43

Thanks for the review. Between yours and all the others that have recently hit, I'm glad to have put down a deposit for one of these cameras. The one thing that somewhat concerned me from Ming's review was startup lag. That hasn't been an issue in any digital camera I've used in a long, long time. Hopefully that lag is just a firmware bug that will be corrected.

The other thing which too many people are giving Leica the pass on is dropping the USB port. I almost always use the built-in port with my cameras, and I don't see an advantage to removing the port. Granted, they do include one with the higher-end grip, but that's a $900 part. You'd expect that they would build a pass-thru into the basic grip, considering how cheap it is to actually do that. Frankly, for a $7000 body, they could have built 802.11 into it.




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