Prospects for making the M8 flash system more functional?

[dante]

Last night I was tasked with taking pictures at a party with an M8 and an SF-24D. Ugh.

I did find my first subject in two years who reacted fast enough to the TTL preflash to blink in six consecutive tries. Even outside of this unique individual, it's annoying to have the pop-pop in TTL mode - it's the longest preflash sequence I've seen outside of a pocket camera. And it induces lag in taking the picture. I switched to A sometimes, but it's really not as good as TTL.

The other thing that seems to still be a problem is occasional preflash but no main flash. This seems to be related to the meter "waking up" and results in blank frames.

Has there been any discussion from Leica about fixing these issues? I'm not asking for 3D Matrix TTL operation with multiple flashes. But we're now into the second model revision and second major firmware upgrade, and it would be nice to have simple flash exposures operate promptly and reliably.

[jaapv]

I have never been able to discern the advantage of TTL flash -on any camera. Just put any old flash on it and use "A"

[stnami]

I have never been able to discern the advantage of TTL flash -on any camera. Just put any old flash on it and use "A"

Jaap...another way of saying "I am out of my depth" ...... I am sure the wedding guys will know ..contact one of them

[george]

I am using my old SF-20 in A mode.
The thought of a double flash just does not appeal to me.
(So I saved the update cost)

But I would like a Leica flash with a swinging head.
And I can wait.

And if that means being out of my depth; so what?

[jaapv]

Originally Posted by stnami

Jaap...another way of saying "I am out of my depth" ...... I am sure the wedding guys will know ..contact one of them

Maybe - Metz makes two flashes that support M TTL. There was an excellent article in LFI. I just don't see the need.

[63strat]

Which issue of LFI would was that? I don't have a subscription yet, which Metz models? Thx.

[jaapv]

Help! I would have to dig through and I am at work...Maybe if you sent a PM to Michael (Mjh) he is Mr. LFI.
As an aside I agree the M24D is suitable only for fill-in flash. I get the best results by using an old Metz MZ3 on SCA 3502-M5 on A. With the reflector at 45 degrees it gives very smooth results. It couples with the M8 sync system and the M8 drives the zoom reflector (albeit without considering the crop). No TTL of course. The adapter cost me 5 times the price I paid for the flash

[lars_bergquist]

I like the SF-24D. The preflash does not irritate me or my subjects. A bit more power would be nice, but I bounce the thing regularly from even pretty high ceilings. Apertures of f:4 and f:5.6 are perfectly useable. The Metz flashes are quite ungainly, and the adapter technology makes for a longer preflash lag.

I do very seldom use the thing on camera, I hold it at the end of a Nikon cable. And while a tilting head would be good for horizontal pictures only, I can bounce the light from anything in the vicinity that I fancy. With the wide angle attachment, I can even use a mixture of bounce and direct flash, and get good exposure.

That is what TTL metering is good for. If you have not understood that yet, you might as well go back to when I began. Or read Sean Reid on 'Working With Flash'.

The old man from the Age of Flashpowder
Übrigens bin ich der Meinung dass die M9 muss wettersicher sein

[jaapv]

Not having three hands, the cord method is not really practical for me. I like to focus the camera as well as releasing it. Have you measured the lag? it is virtually nil, certainly less than the time needed for the preflash by the SF24D. I go by the results. And that means either using a flash on A or buying one of the new flashes (and go TTL), which, as you say, are quite lumpy. The old Metz M series, to which I refer, is a bit more elegant.(And tilt/swivel btw)

[enboe]

I have been playing with a Metz 54+3502M4. This combination supports the GNC mode for M8 TTL flash metering. The downside - no flash exposure compensation unless I go to A mode. Maybe there is another way to achieve output adjustment that my shallow knowledge doesn't know about. In the mean time, There's a future upgrade wish for.

Eric

[MP3]

I'm one who used a nikon cable with SF24D before, trying to benefit from a light weight flash and tilted bounce. After some practice, I'm still lacking hands to hold fast the setup, not to mention to do manual focus.

Bought a Metz 54MZ4i and no regret that on, so reliable with excellent color and light volume, always on A mode. Pardon me, I think the GNC/TTL with such long pre-flash is simply stupid. Cheers !

[DwF]

I chose to try the SF-20 and just this week a Nikon SC17 to use the flash off-camera. Here is one using that set up. I cropped in and only raised the mids slightly for the file here.
No doubt it does take some attention (at least for me) to keep the cord from swinging in front of the lens. Of course with a rangefinder it is easy to miss that until you've taken the picture.

Best,
david

[lars_bergquist]

The trick is to attach a wrist loop to the flash-end shoe of the cord (there's a tripod thread there). Works beautifully.

The old man from the Age of Flashpowder
Übrigens bin ich der Meinung dass die M9 muss wettersicher sein

[asmith]

There are various flash brackets that screw into the tripod socket and have a tilting head. I have hsd one for years.
Alwyn

[jaapv]

And they all point to the left, making focussing akward

[rosuna]

Originally Posted by jaapv

I have never been able to discern the advantage of TTL flash -on any camera. Just put any old flash on it and use "A"

I do the same...

[lars_bergquist]

Originally Posted by jaapv

And they all point to the left, making focussing akward

Changing film with a M3 camera took five hands: One each for camera, baseplate, old film, takeup spool and new film. This has been standard equipment ever since, except in India, where photogs have eight. I am amazed to hear that you are Leica-challenged, especially since you have been in the game for such a long time. ---But everything is going to the dogs in this digital age, of course.

But seriously, how challenging is focusing a wide angle lens at 5.6?

The old man from the Age of Flashpowder
Praterea censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

[stnami]

But seriously, how puzzling is focusing a wide angle lens at 5.6?

[jaapv]

Originally Posted by lars_bergquist

Changing film with a M3 camera took five hands: One each for camera, baseplate, old film, takeup spool and new film. This has been standard equipment ever since, except in India, where photogs have eight. I am amazed to hear that you are Leica-challenged, especially since you have been in the game for such a long time. ---But everything is going to the dogs in this digital age, of course.

But seriously, how challenging is focusing a wide angle lens at 5.6?

The old man from the Age of Flashpowder
Praterea censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

It seems some of us are smiley-challenged...
My baseplate and takeupspool have teeth-marks on them
And you may have missed it, but there is preciously little left of Carthago these days.

[leicamr]

Using flash on 'A' is the only way to go on the M8 and the DMR. How I wish that both systems had TTL flash with compensation adjustments. Using a long lens on the DMR I regularly have to compensate on the flash as it measures off something in the forground that does not appear in the viewfinder. I have to confess that my Nikon D200, SB 800, 17-55 f2.8 combination come into play for most reportage flash situations. A descent sized flash on an M8 is too top heavy and does not make for comfortable use anyway.

I hope that the R10 will have the same flash functionality as my Nikon D200. If it also gets autofocus I am sure the Nikon kit will be up for sale.


Merry Christmas
Happy snapping

Mark