What lens would you suggest? 75 Summarit or 75 Summicron

[Hartmut-2]

Hello everyone,
right now I think about another lens for my M8. I use the 28 Elmarit and the 50 Summarit until yet. I'd like to do another "investment" into a tele lens. The new Summarit lenses are much cheaper than the Summicron - ok, this means, there is normally as well a downside of the lower price. Is there anybody who used the two versions and found remarkeable differences? - except the price? Do you think the quality and usability of the two lenses are comparable?

Thanks in advance for your suggestions.

[lars_bergquist]

I own the 75mm Summarit. My own view of it is one that I do share with both Sean Reid and Erwin Puts: It's a superb lens. Optically, the Summicron does have marginally better colour correction (as advertised by the word 'Apo') but this is noticeable only under un-realistic conditions – such as scrutinising a meter-size print with a magnifier (admittedly, a strange sport that some strange people indulge in). The Summarit puts out a very good image indeed. Resistance to flare is remarkable. Mechanical quality too is very good. Who would put a luxurious eleven-blade iris diaphragm in a second rate lens? Focusing action is smooth. This is not a Japanese plastic lens. It's Leica.

The Summicron may be more glamorous, but what price glamour? In euros or dollars, to be exact? The proof of the pudding is in the picture. The Summarit line contains the best buys that Leica have produced so far, and the 75mm is arguably the best of them all. These are not bragging lenses, they are lenses for taking pictures.

The old man from the Age of Elmar Lenses

[cbretteville]

If you're unsure of the focal length is the one for you get a Voigtländer Color Heliar 75mm f2.5 an excellent little lens that from CameraQuest.com costs a mere $319 + $55 for a LTM-M adapter + shipping. Available in chrome and black. At a $1000 off from the Summarit it is a steal. This is my 75. Don't use it much as I'm not comfortable with the framing, but at the cost I can afford to not use it all the time.

This said I understand if you want a Leica lens because it is after all a Leica lens.

- Carl

[jaapv]

If you have an Elmarit and a Summarit already I would advise you to get the Summarit 75. Despite Lars'opinion, which I happen to disagree with, no way is the Summicron a "prestige"lens", there is a clear difference in fingerprint between the Summicron and the Summarit ; the Summarit will render images that blend in better with the ones you take with your other lenses.

[lxlim]

Have both a CV 75 and the Summarit. Both are great lenses.

I got the Summarit because I was shooting wide open a lot, the CA of my CV was more work than I want to put in.

Both are tack sharp. But the Summarit does shine in the details.

Strangely enough, I get more focus hits with my 90F2.8 than with the Summarit. Have not had time to figure that one out.

[ndjambrose]

I was in the same position myself a few months ago. I tried both the summarit and summicron side by side. I bought the summicron. To my eyes there was a clear enough difference for me to have a preference.

[jaapv]

Originally Posted by lxlim

Strangely enough, I get more focus hits with my 90F2.8 than with the Summarit. Have not had time to figure that one out.

Different throw on the focussing ring.

[Ecaton]

I happen to have all three of them. To try the focal length, I bought the CV Heliar and was quite pleased with its performance. Shortly thereafter, Sean Reid´s review of the CV and the Cron 75 came out and since the inexpensive CV gave the Cron a run for its money, I thought upgrading was not urgent.
Now, there came this opportunity of a demo Summarit and I couldn´t resist as was the same with a mint 75 Cron, coded and with filter.
My advice: subscribe to Sean´s web page and read his excellent reviews of the many lens options available, it is worth the money.
Concerning which 75mm, if speed is needed, the 75 Cron is the one to get. In a non scientific comparison and if I wanted to see a difference between the Cron and Summarit, I might see a slightly punchier rendering of colours by the Cron, maybe higher contrast, but would have to look hard. As far as I´m concerned, the Summarit balances nicer on the M8 with its lower weight and I find it particularly easy to focus, with its short throw. And then there is this CV Heliar, which perfomance wise might fall a slight tad short of the Leicas, if any at all. From a pure rationale point of view this is the one to buy, unless 75mm (100mm on M8) is one of the more often used focal length and Leica build quality and name are important.
I will keep the Summarit, not a fully rational decision, I admit. But might ad a Lux 75 sometime to have speed and unique rendering available as well.
The Summicron 75mm is among the highest praised Leica lenses. But unlike for the Elmarit 24 and the Lux 50 asph, I cannot share the enthusiasm it gets. I think it is just an excellent lens, whereas the latter two I find spectacular.

[Ecaton]

Maybe one additional aspect to consider is the minimum focusing distance.
75 Cron 70cm, 75 Summarit 90cm, CV Heliar 100cm. Speed and minimum focusing distance wise, advantage Cron.

[lars_bergquist]

Originally Posted by jaapv

If you have an Elmarit and a Summarit already I would advise you to get the Summarit 75. Despite Lars'opinion, which I happen to disagree with, no way is the Summicron a "prestige"lens", there is a clear difference in fingerprint between the Summicron and the Summarit ; the Summarit will render images that blend in better with the ones you take with your other lenses.

Jaap, I did never suggest that the Summicron is for bragging ONLY – it is certainly a great lens (and of course a big one ...) Remains that the Summarit produces images that can stand comparison with the 'cron under all circumstances but the most extreme, and that some testers say that it superior in some respects. See www.reidreviews.com/ Now if you're made out of money ...

The old man from the Age of Cheek

[Hartmut-2]

Hello everyone,
thanks for your thoughts and suggestions ..... It is always difficult to find a decision in this regards .. but I think I will go for the Summarit ... I could find as well some pictures taken with this lens and to me they looked very good.

OK, the Cron ist clearly the better lens ,., more versatile, apo ... etc ..... but costs simply the double price ,,,, ,,, I need as well some other equipment to work with --- some software etc - as I learned from some of you in another thread where I asked some other newcomer questions ...
Overall I think I can win more when I take the cheaper lens and spend the money in some software and training ( books, videos etc) ... Finallly I'm convinced that I can create better results with this combination.
THANKS again for the time you took to answer my questions !

Hartmut

[Pointcolville]

I bought a used 75mm Summilux and sent it to NJ for coding and calibration. It has become my favorite lense. Stopped down it is sharp enough as to be nearly indistinguishable from my 75mm Summicron. Wide open it offers a universe of narrow DOF effects that are matched only by a Noctilux. After coding and calibration you will still pay less than a new Summicron.

Just a thought. YMMV.

[innerimager]

Hartmut- PM sent.....Peter

[jackal]

definitely the 75 lux

[wlaidlaw]

I have the 75 Summarit and I am not 100% convinced. I think it is, albeit by a very small margin, the least good of all my Leica lenses (WATE, 35 ASPH Lux, 50 ASPH Lux, 90/2.8 Elmarit and 135/4 Tele-Elmar). It forms nevertheless, a very practical travel lens set with the 35 Lux and WATE. I also don't like the reversible hood, which I have to reverse to get it in my Billingham M. The lens cap always falls off the lens with the hood reversed. I think its rendition/drawing can be a little flat. It seems better in difficult lighting situations than in nice easy bright sunlight.

I know that the lenses vary, as the first one I had was just terrible and went straight back to the dealer. My second is also from very early in the production (1st batch) and maybe they have got better - practice makes perfect. The only downside of the 75 Summicron as far as I can see is the price. It has to be a lot better than the Summarit to justify close to double the cost. In that the 75 is not a lens I use a whole lot, I could not justify the Summicron.

Wilson

[innerimager]

I own the 75 lux and cron. I really love the lux wide open and tend to use it much more than the cron, but the cron is really a spectacular lens. No experience with the new summarit to compare.
If anyone is looking for a 75 cron, I have my mint one for sale on our forum, it's just not getting used and deserves to be! best......Peter
Leica User Forum Classifieds - 75 cron asph mint - Powered by PhotoPost Classifieds

[Philippe D.]

Hello, hallo!
I would say, the Summilux 75 on M8 is a very difficult lens. Nice one up to 2-3 meters, but difficult, just because i use it mostly wide open. Otherwise, i would have a Summicron.
It is also quite expensive now on the second hand market.

For the price of a new Summarit 75 (without hood), you could get a pretty nice Summicron 90 Apo Asph second hand.
This is one of my favorite lens on the M8. Razor sharp with beautiful color rendition.

[DuquesneG]

I've tried all of the 75 options. My findings agree with Sean Reid's in terms of comparing their performances. Therefore my feeling is this: If speed isn't a deal-breaker, the C/V performs so well (I've never noticed any CA, let alone enough to call bothersome) that it seems frivolous to spend the extra money for the Summarit...especially as its build-quality isn't quite up there with the top-rung Leica lenses. If OTOH speed is a deal-breaker, then I would go straight for a Summilux and accept the massive excess of weight, bulkiness, viewfinder intrusion, and long, stiff focusing which is quite temperamental on the shrunken effective rangefinder baselength of the M8 . IMHO the Cron is too much of a compromise considering how much it costs. BTW none of these lenses needs coding, and in fact I found the coding actually detrimental, weird as that sounds. I got reddish corners, as if it applies some cyan-corner-correction to a focal length where there aren't any cyan corners to correct.

[wlaidlaw]

Originally Posted by Philippe D.

Hello, hallo!
I would say, the Summilux 75 on M8 is a very difficult lens. Nice one up to 2-3 meters, but difficult, just because i use it mostly wide open. Otherwise, i would have a Summicron.
It is also quite expensive now on the second hand market.

For the price of a new Summarit 75 (without hood), you could get a pretty nice Summicron 90 Apo Asph second hand.
This is one of my favorite lens on the M8. Razor sharp with beautiful color rendition.

Philippe,

Great to meet you for lunch today - enjoyed every minute.

In the UK second hand 75 Summicrons in very good condition are fetching about £1450. I got my Summarit including hood for about £875. In that I had a credit of £800 at the dealer from selling a 50 Summicron and 50 Elmar-M, it seemed like the Summarit only cost me £75 against the Summicon 75 would have cost me £650. I suspect at some time, I will change my 75 Summarit for a 75 Summicron but not just now in case there is a new Noctilux to buy at Photokina :-}}

Wilson

[jackal]

Originally Posted by DuquesneG

I've tried all of the 75 options. My findings agree with Sean Reid's in terms of comparing their performances. Therefore my feeling is this: If speed isn't a deal-breaker, the C/V performs so well (I've never noticed any CA, let alone enough to call bothersome) that it seems frivolous to spend the extra money for the Summarit...especially as its build-quality isn't quite up there with the top-rung Leica lenses. If OTOH speed is a deal-breaker, then I would go straight for a Summilux and accept the massive excess of weight, bulkiness, viewfinder intrusion, and long, stiff focusing which is quite temperamental on the shrunken effective rangefinder baselength of the M8 . IMHO the Cron is too much of a compromise considering how much it costs. BTW none of these lenses needs coding, and in fact I found the coding actually detrimental, weird as that sounds. I got reddish corners, as if it applies some cyan-corner-correction to a focal length where there aren't any cyan corners to correct.

you don't just buy the Summilux for speed