Nikon SB 900 and the M8

[Jamie Roberts]

Well, many people know I've been using my Canon 580s (second edition) on the M8. I broke my 580 v2 on my wedding Saturday and so my M8 (and DMR) are sans a dedicated flash (I use my other 580 for my 5d).

I was just going to pick up another 580 v2 when I looked at Nikon's new SB900. It's a sweet, sweet flash, and works really well with the M8.

Like the 580v2 it has an auto mode that is really great with the m8. It also has an improved flash head from the Nikon SB800 and bounces now 360 degrees. It comes with gels and a gel holder and a "stofen" like diffuser to boot!

Nikon has increased the ISO range the flash is capable of, from ISO 3 to ISO 8000 so even if you want Nocti fill you'll run out of synch options before you run out of flash exposure settings

They've also made the menu dead easy to read and set for functions. Canon should take a lesson in ergonomics here: the custom functions, while tricky, are a whole lot more self-explanatory than Canon's (which are, of course "CF x" with no description!)

A final wonderful touch about this flash is the fact that due to some compatiblity miracle (!!) when the flash is attached to the M8 and ready to shoot the "flash ready" indicator actually lights in the viewfinder.

Very nice.

In my brief tests, the flash is excellent, and the exposure algorithm in Auto mode even better than the 580s.

Now, the downside, and it's a little scary. Nikon uses a pin system to lock the hotshoe in place, and while it's "secure" attached directly to the M8 it's more wobbly than I'd like it, for sure. If anyone has any ideas on how to fix this, other than tape, which I'm going to use, please let me know!

I think otherwise it's really, really good, and I'm looking forward to using it!

[Albert4321]

it is good to know. I originally got the 580EX II planning to use on the M8, but it just PITA to change the manual during the busy wedding reception. I have used the Contax 380 in A mode and it works well. SB900 is my next purchase. I like the new 360 rotating head.

[dfarkas]

I can also recommend the Metz 58AF-1N. Works great in A mode, has nice double fresnel lens and a secondary fill flash for use when bouncing the main flash. I've had very good success on my M8 with it.



David

[Jamie Roberts]

David--

Yes, I like the Metz 54C as well. Great on the M8.

What I don't like about the Metz is that the Canons and Nikons are easier to shift for aperture and other settings. My Metz always throws me. It also doesn't have the range of exposure program that the others do. It won't, for example, let me dial in f1.6 at ISO 800--it considers that silly, I guess, which it is, if you're directly using the flash.

The big caveat, as I mentioned, on the SB 900 is that it doesn't mount "very well" to the M8 directly. I'm not saying it will fall off on its own, but it's close. Still need to fix that somehow, and then it's a winner for sure

[dfarkas]

Jamie,

The 58AF-1 can actually go down to 1/256th power in M mode. In A mode it covers a 12 f-stop range. Prettty adjustable flash, actually. I haven't attempted to shoot at f/1.2...yet, but I'll see if Metz made things easier since the 54C.

David

[keithdunlop]

Have you tried it off-camera with an SC-17 cord?

[Jamie Roberts]

Originally Posted by keithdunlop

Have you tried it off-camera with an SC-17 cord?

Nope--but that's next for sure. Should be fine with the right Nikon peice...

Of course, I'd rather not use a bracket to begin with...

FWIW, attached to a Wein Safe Synch, the whole thing is still pretty iffy...

[Shootist]

Originally Posted by Jamie Roberts

The big caveat, as I mentioned, on the SB 900 is that it doesn't mount "very well" to the M8 directly. I'm not saying it will fall off on its own, but it's close. Still need to fix that somehow, and then it's a winner for sure

That seems odd because the mounting for the SB900 should be the same as the SB600-800. A pin in the front of the flash that goes into a hole in the hot shoe. This is the same as the Leica flash and the Leica & Nikon hot shoe.

Could it be you don't have the flash pushed all the way into the hot shoe?
Once that pin on the flash is in the hole in the hot shoe the flash can't come off, unless you didn't lock it in or unlocked it.

[Jamie Roberts]

Originally Posted by Shootist

That seems odd because the mounting for the SB900 should be the same as the SB600-800. A pin in the front of the flash that goes into a hole in the hot shoe. This is the same as the Leica flash and the Leica & Nikon hot shoe.

Could it be you don't have the flash pushed all the way into the hot shoe?
Once that pin on the flash is in the hole in the hot shoe the flash can't come off, unless you didn't lock it in or unlocked it.

Ed--I have a black set screw in the front of the hot shoe that is preventing the lock mechanism from kicking in. Are you saying there shouldn't be one there? Or that it should be there but flush mounted?

That would be one more thing NJ forgot to do, but shame on me for not noticing it...

The flash still fires so I didn't think anything of it...

[Shootist]

Originally Posted by Jamie Roberts

Ed--I have a black set screw in the front of the hot shoe that is preventing the lock mechanism from kicking in. Are you saying there shouldn't be one there? Or that it should be there but flush mounted?

That would be one more thing NJ forgot to do, but shame on me for not noticing it...

The flash still fires so I didn't think anything of it...

Yes there is a small round, no head, slotted screw/post in the front of the hot shoe and then there is a small hole just behind this screw/post.
Just my logical thinking that IF the Nikon SB600 & 800 lock into that hole on both my M8 hot shoe's (and the Leica 24D locks in that same hole) that Leica and Nikon put that lock hole in the same place. If it's in the same place on both camera (and I suspect every camera made these days) then the Nikon SB900 MUST have the locking pin in the same spot as the SB600 & 800. Otherwise the SB900 wouldn't lock into any current Nikon camera.
That's not to say your SB900 isn't a sloppy fit in the Leica hot shoe but what you were describing sounded like the flash locking pin DIDN'T go into the hot shoe hole at all and that you could pull the flash off the camera even with the locking lever on the back of the flash set to LOCK.
So that's why I said "Did you push the flash all the way into the hot shoe. You may only have it in far enough for the contact on the flash to hit the contacts in the hot shoe but not far enough for the pin and hole to line up.

[Jamie Roberts]

Ed--that is what I'm saying--there is no lock effect on the M8 with my SB 900. It locks on the DMR, but not the M8.

I'm pushing it in as far as it will go, and it's not going far enough. I'll check to see if it's the flash or not--you're right, the hotshoe could be sloppy.

[marknorton]

I'm waiting for a SB-900 to arrive, seems a fabulous flash and not that much more to buy than the SB-24 runt. I'll feedback on the hot shoe issue...

[Shootist]

Originally Posted by Jamie Roberts

Ed--that is what I'm saying--there is no lock effect on the M8 with my SB 900. It locks on the DMR, but not the M8.

I'm pushing it in as far as it will go, and it's not going far enough. I'll check to see if it's the flash or not--you're right, the hotshoe could be sloppy.

Jamie, maybe it going in a little to far? So the pin is just past the hole?
Easy way to check this is to measure from the post in the hot shoe to the hole and on the flash from the front of the flash to the pin. You must have a dial/digital caliper laying around.

My SB800, and the 600 that I sold, locked into the M8 shoe but both are/were somewhat a loose fit in the shoe. IIRC it was the same on the Nikon D200.

[ho_co]

Originally Posted by Jamie Roberts

... I have a black set screw in the front of the hot shoe that is preventing the lock mechanism from kicking in. Are you saying there shouldn't be one there? Or that it should be there but flush mounted? ...

Jamie, I may not be understanding at all or just late to the party.

On my M8 there's a small hole at the part of the flash shoe nearest the front of the camera, in the metal part of the shoe just in front of the plastic insulation section. (There may be a screw at the bottom of it; all I can see is something black and shiny.) There's another flathead pin about 3mm forward of that hole; it's silver on my camera, and protrudes above the shoe.

My Nikon SB-800 flash slides onto the M8 shoe with no trouble. There's a lever at the back of the SB-800 just above the shoe. Rotating that lever 45 degrees clockwise, the flash drops a locking pin into the hole mentioned above.

I assume the same happens with SB 900.

If you have a protruding screw instead of a hole, screw it in.

BTW--thanks for the thread; I've never had any idea why that hole was threaded. I guess the screw has some function making sure the shoe is in the right position.

I hope there's something here you can use.

[Shootist]

That screw/post at the front of the shoe is there to hold the spring load plate in the shoe and to position/stop the flash in the right place so the locking pin on the flash lines up with the hole in the shoe. There are NO threads in the locking hole on my chrome M8.

[ho_co]

Originally Posted by Shootist

... There are NO threads in the locking hole on my chrome M8.

Thanks, Ed, you're right. I don't know where I got the idea that the hole was threaded.

There goes my theory from post 14.

[Jamie Roberts]

Ok, so here goes...

First, Ed--I don't have a caliper lying around But I'll get one for the definitive answer...

Next, the more I play with the SB900, the more I like it. It's an awesome flash in A mode, and the best I've seen to date.

Finally--and this is the main point--Nikon has changed the mount ever so slightly on the SB900 such that it doesn't lock on my M8.

At least, the three I tried today did not.

However, all three SB 800s I tried *DID* lock just fine on the M8.

Now, here's the weird part. The two locking Nikon "off-camera" cords *also* work on the M8. No problems And they work with the 900 of course.

So there is some very small but pertinent difference in the way the 900 shoe fits into the M8 and into the hole (it doesn't). But every other Nikon accessory for the 900 works just fine...

(Oh, I mentioned this elsewhere, but the SB900 fits the DMR just fine as well and locks. But to get the flash to fire I needed to tape one of the back pins. Then it's fine.

Mark--let us know how it goes when you get yours...

Looks like I'll be using my SB900 on a bracket for now...

[benkelley]

Over on strobist there was some talk about the new foot design...

The review:
Strobist: Hands-On Review: Nikon SB-900 Speedlight

And a short post with a link to a discussion about what fits and what doesn't...

Strobist: Nikon SB-900 Foot: Size 16 EEEE

[JT07]

Sorry, I'm late to the thread here but I have an SB800 and have never used it on the M8.'

Can someone give me a brief bullet point explanation as to how I would set it?

I've used it only on the D200...

My thanks in advance...

JT

[Shootist]

Originally Posted by JT07

Sorry, I'm late to the thread here but I have an SB800 and have never used it on the M8.'

Can someone give me a brief bullet point explanation as to how I would set it?

I've used it only on the D200...

My thanks in advance...

JT

Use it in A mode. Set the ISO to what your camera ISO is set to, lens zoom set one higher then what lens you have on the camera and aperture set to what the lens is set to. then you can start playing around to see what setting work best for the type of flash effect you want.