M8 and Perceived Quality

[ArtZ]

Perceived quality


Consumer's opinion of a product's (or a brand's) ability to fulfill his or her expectations. It may have little or nothing to do with the actual excellence of the product, and is based on the firm's (or brand's) current public image (see corporate image), consumer's experience with the firm's other products, and the influence of the opinion leaders, consumer's peer group, and others.

It thus differs from several related concepts, such as:

a) Actual or objective quality: the extent to which the product or service delivers superior service

b) Product-based quality: the nature and quantity of ingredients, features, or services included

c) Manufacturing quality: conformance to specification, the "zero defect" goal

Perceived quality cannot necessarily be objectively determined, in part because it is a perception and also because judgments about what is important to customers are involved. An evaluation of washing machines (less controversial than cameras or cars) by a Consumer Report expert may be competent and unbiased, but it must make judgments about the relative importance of features, cleaning action, types of clothes to be washed, and so on that may not match those of all customers. After all, customers differ sharply in their personalities, needs, and preferences.

Perceived quality is an intangible, overall feeling about a brand. However, it usually will be based on underlying dimensions which include characteristics of the products to which the brand is attached such as reliability and performance. To understand perceived quality, the identification and measurement of the underlying dimensions will be useful, but the perceived quality itself is a summary, global construct.

Perceived quality depends basically on two concepts: Country of origin of the product and Consumer attitudes depending on his personal, socio-cultural and geographical situation.

Country of Origin

The country, from which a company (product/service/brand) originates, has an effect on the company’s perceived quality and likeability in the minds of consumers – this is the “Country-of-Origin effect” and it’s not a new concept.

German engineering, French wine, Swiss watches, Danish design, Japanese electronics, 100% pure New Zealand… but what makes France the best country for wines, what makes Germany the best in engineering and what makes Switzerland the best to produce watches?

Why “Made is Germany” label has a good reputation and “Made in China” a bad one?

On the other hand, consumers may have different attitudes toward the purchase of products and its perceived quality depending on their own specific situation (culture, origins, social situation, Country, etc.)

Consumer Ethnocentrism

Consumer ethnocentrism is defined as beliefs held by consumers about the appropriateness or morality of purchasing foreign products. Purchasing imported goods is seen as wrong as it will harm the domestic economy, have an adverse impact on domestic employment, and is unpatriotic.

Influence of Animosity

I remember when I lived in Hampstead Heath, London NW3, (1978-1981). Golders Green (wealthy Jewish area on the other side of Hampstead Heath) was called “Volvo City” because every Jewish family had a Volvo Estate Wagon. Even in France nowadays, Jews will buy preferably Swedish and/or Japanese (even French! ) cars rather than German cars. I would define this phenomenon of “Influence of Animosity” as the remnants of antipathy related to previous or ongoing military, political, or economic events.

Interest in Foreign Travel

People in a small country will generally be more exposed to and aware of other cultures. This tends to reduce tendencies towards ethnocentrism where these stem from a lack of experience or knowledge rather than prejudice. Individuals often learn about other cultures in school by reading about them, or by watching programs on television. However, actual experience of visiting or living in another country is likely to have the most profound effect on knowledge about other countries and other peoples' life-styles and increase receptivity towards foreign products. Positive attitudes toward travel abroad will reflect a more international orientation

Availability of Domestic Alternatives

Another issue impacting attitudes towards foreign products is the perceived availability of domestic alternatives. Particularly in small economies, the internal market is not large enough to support a domestic industry. Where no domestic alternatives are available, for example, consumers in countries with no domestic automobile or consumer electronics production will have no choice but to purchase imported goods. Hence, consumers are less likely to have negative attitudes towards foreign products.

In conclusion, I invite you to make your own conclusions about M8 quality “objective or perceived quality?” and the reasons why this forum inflames so many people with contradictory ideas and points of view.
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[Amoment]

Many years ago, when I sold cars for a living, the objective of the salesman was to do a needs analysis with the customer (punter). By carrying out this exercise, it was possible to qualify what the requirements were, and match those to the cars that were available for sale, and thereby secure a sale.

What's in a name?

In the automobile industry, some cars, even by their names, conjour up fantastic images, but once bought can be hell to live with, and yet, who would have thought that cars from manufacturers in East European countries that were once the butt of so many jokes, are now quality products.

Product from China were rubbish a few years ago, but not now.

When a photographer, as distinct from a snapper, purchasing new item of photographic equipment, they should, and I'm sure the majority do, go through this process themselves. The problems arise when the item that you choose does not live up too your expectations, and this is can happen when a product is bought on the strength of its reputation or its cache.

I finally took the leap and bought an M8 because digital was more convenient for me, and having previously owned an M3 and M6, I was impressed with them due to the quality of the product and ithe longevity. So far I am very happy with the M8, but if it doesn't meet my requirements, because Leica take notice of all this talk that I hear, for upgrades and model changes, our it fails prematurely, then my perception of the product will diminish.

Stuart

[fotografr]

New thread category needed: Esoteric

[ArtZ]

Originally Posted by fotografr

New thread category needed: Esoteric

Of course... Amen.

[Goldie]

Interestingly, or not, the reason why so many Jewish families bought Volvo cars was for the very simple practical fact that they had enough headroom to allow the men to wear their particular style of hat whilst driving. The style I belief is the Homburg.

[Samir Jahjah]

Or a BS thread...

I owned Canon 1d M II, 5D, and M8 and a few lenses from Canon, Leica and VC!

After one year evauating my stuff, I sold the bulky 1d...because it was bulky, and I sold my 5D, because when I compared the quality of the files, the M8 stands out, and I had no real need for an slr (no MACRO and no need for long telephoto).

Am I pissed by the IR issue, the reliability, and the noise at ISO 2400 concern? Yes! But I weight things and have to arbitrage.

I never had any problem with any of my cameras (call me lucky) so my experience is a very positive one. If I had to send the M8 to Solms once, or twice, I would still be with my 5D, and the M8 would have been gone.

At least I went through the process...and I dont theorize about the country of origin (I owned lens made in canada, germany japan) and other marketing 101! I have sold a few Leica lenses that I replaced with VC after I came to realize they were outperforming or being on par with the leica. I kept a few Leica because I felt they were simply outstanding.

But then we have these condescending threads, like this one, that portray us as stupid and fool! Get a life!

[stevelap]

Good grief ArtZ, socio-economics 101, as our American cousins would say (or pseud's corner for you, as Private Eye might put it).

Please, please.....spare us

[SJP]

OK some homework if you insist.

Country of Origin => positive
Germany probably (one of the) best in engineering, somewhat conservative & sensible, nothing fancy - no frills, 'bomb proof', (very)high prices

Consumer Ethnocentrism => neutral
For consumers in most countries cameras are foreign and are expected to be foreign. I would be surprised if this was a factor of importance. (I believe that in Japan Leica is not perceived as a camera that should be used but as an icon for preservation in a blister pack & safe. Anyone like to coment on that? Do we have Japanese forum members? I really would be interested to know.)

Influence of Animosity => neutral or mild positive
Maybe some residial versus Germany with older generations (?), none or positive versus Leica for anyone who cares to look into that part of history.

Interest in Foreign Travel => neutral
Could be a factor for some, Germany may be easier to relate to than Japan & Japanese. I would be surprised if this was a factor of importance.

Availability of Domestic Alternatives => positive
There are no alternatives. Anywhere!

Total score = clearly positive

[ArtZ]

Originally Posted by Goldie

Interestingly, or not, the reason why so many Jewish families bought Volvo cars was for the very simple practical fact that they had enough headroom to allow the men to wear their particular style of hat whilst driving. The style I belief is the Homburg.

I must admit I loved your explanation... but where I live in Paris there's an important Jewish religious community and I see those hats 10 times a day. I doubt a person can keep his cap on even in a Volvo car

BTW, I heard the hat explanation before but for the London taxis... "But the taxis do retain the distinctive extra headroom required under old London Public Carriage Office rules that ensured they could accommodate a gentleman's top hat"
.

[ArtZ]

Originally Posted by SJP

Consumer Ethnocentrism => neutral
For consumers in most countries cameras are foreign and are expected to be foreign. I would be surprised if this was a factor of importance. (I believe that in Japan Leica is not perceived as a camera that should be used but as an icon for preservation in a blister pack & safe. Anyone like to coment on that? Do we have Japanese forum members? I really would be interested to know.)

Concerning to "Consumer Ethnocentrism", I agree it probably doesn´t apply to cameras but my point was a general one. This was very clear, for instance, here in France 10 years ago concerning cars.

And, indeed, it will be interesting to have some feed back from Japanese forum members.

I believe German Marketing is very good because most German products give us high perceived quality but I doubt that objective quality will be always superior to their equivalent in other countries.
.

[larryk34]

GM is losing money in the US; making all its profit overseas. It has one of the most popular cars in China. 5-6 years ago when GM was laying off thousands of workers here, it was investing 2 billion dollars in China. Seems to have paid off. By the way, the GM cars in Europe are not the same ones sold here. So, no GM is laying off more workers, while Toyota plans to build a new plant to make its hybrid and Volksvagon is building a new plant in Mississippi. Why have the American "brands" given up on the US?

Back on point: the GM and Ford brand names must seem exotic and represent quality somewhere else in the world.

Meanwhile, Leica has made the digital M that we were all begging for 3 years ago. And it works quite well.

[Goldie]

[quote=ArtZ;608535]I must admit I loved your explanation... but where I live in Paris there's an important Jewish religious community and I see those hats 10 times a day. I doubt a person can keep his cap on even in a Volvo car

Oh, ye of little faith.

[overgaardcom]

When people ask me – amongst them many students of my photo seminar – "what camera should I choose that can take good pictures?" my response is "choose with yoyr hearth"

Long story short, if you love your camera, you will use it. If you were just told in a shopto buy this brand because it's the most advanced and most value for the money, chances that you will use is is smaller.

And after all, it's the person who sees pictures, not the camera.

Hence, love is important.

And I guess perceived quality is then all – and the only real quality – that matters ;-)

[SJP]

I wouldn't even consider objective quality as something worth discussing too seriously as there are many non-tangibles involved. It is clear that Leica is in the top echelon but where exactly relative to model xx by manufacturer yy is just guesswork and opinion. That they are still there is amazing enough.

Although I have a hard time to admit this (being a physicist) the only relevant measure is perceived quality.

Just like the Dow Jones which seems to be recovering from perceived value depression.

[AlanG]

However you cut it, the "perception of quality" has to be earned by "actual quality."

The Japanese camera industry didn't surpass the German camera industry because the world fell in love with Japan and Japanese products.

Dr. Strangelove - 1964

General Jack D. Ripper: Were you ever a prisoner of war?
Group Capt. Lionel Mandrake: Well, yes I was, matter of fact, Jack, I was.
General Jack D. Ripper: Did they torture you?
Group Capt. Lionel Mandrake: Uh, yes they did. I was tortured by the Japanese, Jack, if you must know; not a pretty story.
General Jack D. Ripper: Well, what happened?
Group Capt. Lionel Mandrake: Oh, well, I don't know, Jack, difficult to think of under these conditions; but, well, what happened was they got me on the old Rangoon-Ichinawa railway. I was laying train lines for the bloody Japanese puff-puff's.
General Jack D. Ripper: No, I mean when they tortured you did you talk?
Group Capt. Lionel Mandrake: Ah, oh, no... well, I don't think they wanted me to talk really. I don't think they wanted me to say anything. It was just their way of having a bit of fun, the swines. Strange thing is they make such bloody good cameras.

[jimrivers]

I have a Leica M8. I use it. I like it.

[offshore]

Originally Posted by ArtZ

Perceived quality


Consumer's opinion of a product's (or a brand's) ability to fulfill his or her expectations. It may have little or nothing to do with the actual excellence of the product, and is based on the firm's (or brand's) current public image (see corporate image), consumer's experience with the firm's other products, and the influence of the opinion leaders, consumer's peer group, and others.

It thus differs from several related concepts, such as:

a) Actual or objective quality: the extent to which the product or service delivers superior service

b) Product-based quality: the nature and quantity of ingredients, features, or services included

c) Manufacturing quality: conformance to specification, the "zero defect" goal

Perceived quality cannot necessarily be objectively determined, in part because it is a perception and also because judgments about what is important to customers are involved. An evaluation of washing machines (less controversial than cameras or cars) by a Consumer Report expert may be competent and unbiased, but it must make judgments about the relative importance of features, cleaning action, types of clothes to be washed, and so on that may not match those of all customers. After all, customers differ sharply in their personalities, needs, and preferences.

Perceived quality is an intangible, overall feeling about a brand. However, it usually will be based on underlying dimensions which include characteristics of the products to which the brand is attached such as reliability and performance. To understand perceived quality, the identification and measurement of the underlying dimensions will be useful, but the perceived quality itself is a summary, global construct.

Perceived quality depends basically on two concepts: Country of origin of the product and Consumer attitudes depending on his personal, socio-cultural and geographical situation.

Country of Origin

The country, from which a company (product/service/brand) originates, has an effect on the company’s perceived quality and likeability in the minds of consumers – this is the “Country-of-Origin effect” and it’s not a new concept.

German engineering, French wine, Swiss watches, Danish design, Japanese electronics, 100% pure New Zealand… but what makes France the best country for wines, what makes Germany the best in engineering and what makes Switzerland the best to produce watches?

Why “Made is Germany” label has a good reputation and “Made in China” a bad one?

On the other hand, consumers may have different attitudes toward the purchase of products and its perceived quality depending on their own specific situation (culture, origins, social situation, Country, etc.)

Consumer Ethnocentrism

Consumer ethnocentrism is defined as beliefs held by consumers about the appropriateness or morality of purchasing foreign products. Purchasing imported goods is seen as wrong as it will harm the domestic economy, have an adverse impact on domestic employment, and is unpatriotic.

Influence of Animosity

I remember when I lived in Hampstead Heath, London NW3, (1978-1981). Golders Green (wealthy Jewish area on the other side of Hampstead Heath) was called “Volvo City” because every Jewish family had a Volvo Estate Wagon. Even in France nowadays, Jews will buy preferably Swedish and/or Japanese (even French! ) cars rather than German cars. I would define this phenomenon of “Influence of Animosity” as the remnants of antipathy related to previous or ongoing military, political, or economic events.

Interest in Foreign Travel

People in a small country will generally be more exposed to and aware of other cultures. This tends to reduce tendencies towards ethnocentrism where these stem from a lack of experience or knowledge rather than prejudice. Individuals often learn about other cultures in school by reading about them, or by watching programs on television. However, actual experience of visiting or living in another country is likely to have the most profound effect on knowledge about other countries and other peoples' life-styles and increase receptivity towards foreign products. Positive attitudes toward travel abroad will reflect a more international orientation

Availability of Domestic Alternatives

Another issue impacting attitudes towards foreign products is the perceived availability of domestic alternatives. Particularly in small economies, the internal market is not large enough to support a domestic industry. Where no domestic alternatives are available, for example, consumers in countries with no domestic automobile or consumer electronics production will have no choice but to purchase imported goods. Hence, consumers are less likely to have negative attitudes towards foreign products.

In conclusion, I invite you to make your own conclusions about M8 quality “objective or perceived quality?” and the reasons why this forum inflames so many people with contradictory ideas and points of view.
.

Vs impulse purchase.

[zernikepolynom]

Underlying motivations for buying a product - some people are annoyed, if the beautiful woman on the advertisement is not actually delivered with the product...

I guess for me it is the feeling of taking a picture rather than having a picture taken for me...

[earleygallery]

Originally Posted by ArtZ

Perceived quality

I looked at this thread a couple of times, it just made my head hurt.

Anyway its not hurting so bad now - percieved quality is one thing but Leica has a reputation based upon determined quality and that's what people buy into.

A brand such as Lexus when they first came onto the market had to generate a perception of quality so that potential Merc buyers would pay the same kind of money for a Toyota albeit by another name.

Most M8 buyers are exisiting or past Leica users.

[Shootist]

Originally Posted by earleygallery

I looked at this thread a couple of times, it just made my head hurt.

Anyway its not hurting so bad now - percieved quality is one thing but Leica has a reputation based upon determined quality and that's what people buy into.

A brand such as Lexus when they first came onto the market had to generate a perception of quality so that potential Merc buyers would pay the same kind of money for a Toyota albeit by another name.

Most M8 buyers are exisiting or past Leica users.

Well stated, especially the last part.
"IF" "I" had never owned a Leica M I'm not sure I would of bought the M8.
IMHO it is flawed in some ways but I still really like using it and the images I get from it. More then any other camera, digital or film, I have used. I guess that's why I have 2 of them and sold all other cameras except a Canon P&S.
It really wasn't about the Perceived Quality. It was about the overall quality of the images I know a Leica M can produce.
Let me add that if the first M3 with Leitz glass I had used, back in 1972, didn't show better images then the Nikon and Nikon glass I had at the time I wouldn't of even looked at the M8 or this forum.