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photolandscape · April 13th, 2008, 04:01 AM

Since the last firmware update for the M8, things on that front seem to have quieted down.

I must say that for my purposes at least, the AWB is dramatically better than what it was in the past.

What other kinds of improvements might be forthcoming in future Firmware updates, and when?

marknorton · April 13th, 2008, 05:33 AM

The most pressing need IMHO is to support SDHC cards, simply because smaller capacity cards may not be available indefinitely. I have a 10Mb CF card in front of me which was used on my first ever digital camera, incredible to think that in less than 10 years, we now have cards which have 1600 times the capcity.

The concern is whether the existing hardware supports SDHC cards; there was talk of a new driver being required, I just hope the hardware isn't proving to be a stumbling block.

Other than that, I doubt there is much in the pipeline.

waterlenz · April 13th, 2008, 06:24 AM

They are supposed to be working on the green banding issue too.

Hopefully they are also addressing the occasional need to have to remove the battery to re-set a non-responsive camera (as if possessed like in Stephen King novels).

Tom (still winter here in AK, over 1 meter of snow in the past week)

diogenis · April 13th, 2008, 06:27 AM

Since they omitted -for simplicity reasons- an external dial for choosing ISO on the spot,
They must enable a menu choice for manually overriding and choosing various lenses, so one don't have to code them anymore. Even if that is counterproductive and dooms coded ones, I think, us having this option is not a bad idea

andit · April 13th, 2008, 08:01 AM

Hi Mark,

I don't know if the M8 is going to be able to take the SDHC cards without a hardware upgrade. I know that Leica says it can take these cards, but I have my doubts. I started using a 4 gb SD card for the first time a few weeks ago with a Ricoh R8. Took the shots, put the card into my Belkin card reader - no go... The card reader does not support SDHC. It seems that they have changed the hardware specs for these cards. At least I was lucky in that the Sandisk III Extreme card that Adorama sent me, came along with its own card reader.

I certainly hope that this will not be a problem with the M8. I must admit that it is very convenient to use these large cards - so lets hope.

Andreas

wlaidlaw · April 13th, 2008, 08:05 AM

I think most of us have given up on the thought that they will ever implement menu lens selection but it would be nice to think that they might be working on ISO/EV implementation on the arrow buttons. When this idea was first mooted, about 15 to 16 months ago, it met with almost universal approval. A second idea that was well received, was a combination button push that would effect a reset (equivalent to removing the battery).

My Becker dealer has installed a firmware update in my Grand Prix 7990 car radio. This other German piece of equipment has a tendency to lock up like the M8 and you used to have to remove it from the dashboard with the removal keys, disconnect the power, reconnect, remount and insert the security key. Now you can just press a combination of buttons on the front to reset.

I agree with others, SDHC implementation is a must.

Wilson

Michael M. · April 13th, 2008, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waterlenz

They are supposed to be working on the green banding issue too.

Bad luck! There was info short time ago that there is no chance to solve the banding problem (high spot lights at frame area of sensor) by firmware as it was targeted by Leica some time ago.
If it will be a hardware solution now (if any!) then it's a huge action to upgrade camera - I think (new sensor?!

)

Michael

mhoutman · April 13th, 2008, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andit

Hi Mark,
Took the shots, put the card into my Belkin card reader - no go... The card reader does not support SDHC.

Andreas

check out belkin for firmware updates. in fact i recently could update my sandisk imagemate 12-in-1 reader to sdhc support.

btw. i am currently not concerned about firmware updates but more on the hardware upgrade path

chris_tribble · April 13th, 2008, 11:52 AM

Also assured by Leica that they were looking at separating shutter release from re-cock to give you a "stealth" mode... (correspondence with Stefan Daniel on this issue was reported in the forum).

andit · April 13th, 2008, 11:54 AM

Hi mhoutman,

Thank you, will check for updates on the Belkin site.

Andreas

marknorton · April 13th, 2008, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael M.

Bad luck! There was info short time ago that there is no chance to solve the banding problem (high spot lights at frame area of sensor) by firmware as it was targeted by Leica some time ago.
If it will be a hardware solution now (if any!) then it's a huge action to upgrade camera - I think (new sensor?!

)

Michael

That's a pity, they obviously didn't like the firmware solution I suggested or couldn't make it work or it was too much effort.

I think we need to regard the M8 as a done deal now, pretty much, the idea of perpetual upgrades is so much hot air.

I think after the R10 is done that they really need to reinvent the M concept from the ground up.

Michael M. · April 13th, 2008, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marknorton

That's a pity, they obviously didn't like the firmware solution I suggested or couldn't make it work or it was too much effort.

I think we need to regard the M8 as a done deal now, pretty much, the idea of perpetual upgrades is so much hot air.

I think after the R10 is done that they really need to reinvent the M concept from the ground up.

You're that right! Anyhow the M8 is still not a collection of problems covered by a camera casing.
Regarding the upgrade philosophy of Leica ... yes it might look actual like a bubble of hot air only ... better not to talk that much about this marketing issue from Leicas side - remembering the old days of Leitz, it was real normality to send an older camera to CS and ask for specific upgrade - no problem at all and no big story arround ... you got it! Leica remember those old days!

There will be a M9 some time in future. Leica has to rework issues in general at the actual concept. But we have to face also the fact that there is always a kind of learning curve when you start with new things. So - to be fair - what we got is not much worse and some years later still some guys will use M8 and others will be touched in positive sense by the fact that they are with the story just from the beginning on ... and I think my M8 'personally' will feel also good to shine then in my Leica vitrine beside the M7, M6, M5 .... nothing hurts more today then the problems of yesterday by knowing that they will went away earliest tomorrow ...

Michael

Michael

Tony C. · April 13th, 2008, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris_tribble

Also assured by Leica that they were looking at separating shutter release from re-cock to give you a "stealth" mode... (correspondence with Stefan Daniel on this issue was reported in the forum).

I hadn't noticed this before, Chris, at least with respect to the fix being applied in a firmware update. It would be fantastic if they could do it!

Michael M. · April 13th, 2008, 05:29 PM

To unlock schutter release from re-cock ... I'm not that sure that it's a perfect idea

Schutter itself is noisy - as we all know. OK - if we think about the "new" slow motion shutter it might be a little different ... but still there is a noticeable noise too. And then?
One shot only? And I have to leave the theatre to re-cock shutter outside? Or to put camera into noise damping bag to re-cock? Think that actions will cause more turbulences then actual ...
May be that this solution will delight some people and it's better then nothing, but ...

Michael

thompsonkirk · April 13th, 2008, 05:32 PM

"I think most of us have given up on the thought that they will ever implement menu lens selection...."

Not me! It's profitable but arrogant to try to create a lens monopoly, & a customer has a right to ask for common-sense features. Why should I buy new bodies if they won't help me use old lenses?

Albert4321 · April 13th, 2008, 05:40 PM

I am very happy with the new FW. But I want to see hi ISO capability in the future FW.

bill · April 13th, 2008, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael M.

To unlock schutter release from re-cock ... I'm not that sure that it's a perfect idea

Schutter itself is noisy - as we all know. OK - if we think about the "new" slow motion shutter it might be a little different ... but still there is a noticeable noise too. And then?
One shot only? And I have to leave the theatre to re-cock shutter outside? Or to put camera into noise damping bag to re-cock? Think that actions will cause more turbulences then actual ...
May be that this solution will delight some people and it's better then nothing, but ...

Michael

...seems to me that it would make it behave just like a film M. Of course as soon as it was implemented it would only be a matter of time before the first "Do you leave your M8 cocked or uncocked?" thread.

Seriously, I could see it being implemented in practical terms as recock only when you remove your finger from the shutter release.

Regards,

Bill

scott kirkpatrick · April 13th, 2008, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris_tribble

Also assured by Leica that they were looking at separating shutter release from re-cock to give you a "stealth" mode... (correspondence with Stefan Daniel on this issue was reported in the forum).

Can you find that thread, as I missed it. I'm in favor of unlocking recock so that it occurs when you lift your finger in single shot mode. The noise of the recock is more obvious (much more after the shutter upgrade) than the noise of the shutter itself. I guess it is still worth a usability study to see if when you take a series of shots in the space of, say, a minute, it is more distracting to have "snip-crunch......... snip-crunch...." for 10 shots or "snip.... crunch.... snip.... crunch" with twice as many sound bursts, each shorter. Maybe we wouldn't want that after all. I'd appreciate hearing from one of the audio maestros that have looked at the tapes with the new shutter to see what repeated shots sound like with a 1-2 sec separation.

scott

4season · April 13th, 2008, 06:57 PM

"Classic Mode": Requires you to remove baseplate and extract card every 36 exposures, whether card is full or not. Frees photographer from the tedium of uninterrupted shooting. Also adds simulated sound of slow speed shutter mechanism, including bouncing BB effect at the lowest speeds.

Memo: For those who miss the M4-2's blank memo plate that you could write on, this new feature simply whites out the M8's screen, Markers not included.

Cuteness enhancer: Enhances the charm of any person, pet or situation.

Magenta remover: Turns any pink or magenta subject black. For situations where a UV/IR filter isn't available. Also referred to as the "Gothifier"

Photo limiter: After X number of photos (user configurable) the camera will begin to overwrite. Guarantees you will come home with no more than X photos. Really saves on disk space!

wstotler · April 14th, 2008, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4season

"Classic Mode": Requires you to remove baseplate and extract card every 36 exposures, whether card is full or not. Frees photographer from the tedium of uninterrupted shooting. Also adds simulated sound of slow speed shutter mechanism, including bouncing BB effect at the lowest speeds.

Memo: For those who miss the M4-2's blank memo plate that you could write on, this new feature simply whites out the M8's screen, Markers not included.

Cuteness enhancer: Enhances the charm of any person, pet or situation.

Magenta remover: Turns any pink or magenta subject black. For situations where a UV/IR filter isn't available. Also referred to as the "Gothifier"

Photo limiter: After X number of photos (user configurable) the camera will begin to overwrite. Guarantees you will come home with no more than X photos. Really saves on disk space!

This? I about fell off my chair. Thanks for sharing.

-Will

April 13th, 2008, 04:01 AM	#1 (permalink)
photolandscape Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: September 16th, 2006 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 300	Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? Since the last firmware update for the M8, things on that front seem to have quieted down. I must say that for my purposes at least, the AWB is dramatically better than what it was in the past. What other kinds of improvements might be forthcoming in future Firmware updates, and when? __________________ See some of my images on www.pbase.com/photolandscape. And, you can see my growing collection of photo books at www.blurb.com under "Photolandscape".

April 13th, 2008, 05:33 AM	#2 (permalink)
marknorton Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: November 12th, 2002 Posts: 4,950	Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? The most pressing need IMHO is to support SDHC cards, simply because smaller capacity cards may not be available indefinitely. I have a 10Mb CF card in front of me which was used on my first ever digital camera, incredible to think that in less than 10 years, we now have cards which have 1600 times the capcity. The concern is whether the existing hardware supports SDHC cards; there was talk of a new driver being required, I just hope the hardware isn't proving to be a stumbling block. Other than that, I doubt there is much in the pipeline. __________________ Mark

April 13th, 2008, 06:24 AM	#3 (permalink)
waterlenz Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: October 9th, 2005 Location: Alaska Posts: 437	Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? They are supposed to be working on the green banding issue too. Hopefully they are also addressing the occasional need to have to remove the battery to re-set a non-responsive camera (as if possessed like in Stephen King novels). Tom (still winter here in AK, over 1 meter of snow in the past week)

April 13th, 2008, 06:27 AM	#4 (permalink)
diogenis Benutzer Join Date: January 19th, 2008 Posts: 59	Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? Since they omitted -for simplicity reasons- an external dial for choosing ISO on the spot, They must enable a menu choice for manually overriding and choosing various lenses, so one don't have to code them anymore. Even if that is counterproductive and dooms coded ones, I think, us having this option is not a bad idea

April 13th, 2008, 08:01 AM	#5 (permalink)
andit Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: December 15th, 2006 Location: White River, South Africa Posts: 297	Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? Hi Mark, I don't know if the M8 is going to be able to take the SDHC cards without a hardware upgrade. I know that Leica says it can take these cards, but I have my doubts. I started using a 4 gb SD card for the first time a few weeks ago with a Ricoh R8. Took the shots, put the card into my Belkin card reader - no go... The card reader does not support SDHC. It seems that they have changed the hardware specs for these cards. At least I was lucky in that the Sandisk III Extreme card that Adorama sent me, came along with its own card reader. I certainly hope that this will not be a problem with the M8. I must admit that it is very convenient to use these large cards - so lets hope. Andreas

April 13th, 2008, 08:05 AM	#6 (permalink)
wlaidlaw Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: December 19th, 2004 Location: Tourtour, France and Sussex UK Posts: 1,689	Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? I think most of us have given up on the thought that they will ever implement menu lens selection but it would be nice to think that they might be working on ISO/EV implementation on the arrow buttons. When this idea was first mooted, about 15 to 16 months ago, it met with almost universal approval. A second idea that was well received, was a combination button push that would effect a reset (equivalent to removing the battery). My Becker dealer has installed a firmware update in my Grand Prix 7990 car radio. This other German piece of equipment has a tendency to lock up like the M8 and you used to have to remove it from the dashboard with the removal keys, disconnect the power, reconnect, remount and insert the security key. Now you can just press a combination of buttons on the front to reset. I agree with others, SDHC implementation is a must. Wilson

April 13th, 2008, 11:52 AM	#9 (permalink)
chris_tribble Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: May 4th, 2006 Location: London / Cheshire Posts: 726	Re: AW: Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? Also assured by Leica that they were looking at separating shutter release from re-cock to give you a "stealth" mode... (correspondence with Stefan Daniel on this issue was reported in the forum). __________________ Chris Tribble www.ctribble.co.uk

April 13th, 2008, 11:54 AM	#10 (permalink)
andit Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: December 15th, 2006 Location: White River, South Africa Posts: 297	Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? Hi mhoutman, Thank you, will check for updates on the Belkin site. Andreas

April 13th, 2008, 05:29 PM	#14 (permalink)
Michael M. Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: December 14th, 2006 Location: Bochum Posts: 502	AW: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? To unlock schutter release from re-cock ... I'm not that sure that it's a perfect idea Schutter itself is noisy - as we all know. OK - if we think about the "new" slow motion shutter it might be a little different ... but still there is a noticeable noise too. And then? One shot only? And I have to leave the theatre to re-cock shutter outside? Or to put camera into noise damping bag to re-cock? Think that actions will cause more turbulences then actual ... May be that this solution will delight some people and it's better then nothing, but ... Michael

April 13th, 2008, 05:32 PM	#15 (permalink)
thompsonkirk Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: May 27th, 2003 Location: CA Posts: 106	Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? "I think most of us have given up on the thought that they will ever implement menu lens selection...." Not me! It's profitable but arrogant to try to create a lens monopoly, & a customer has a right to ask for common-sense features. Why should I buy new bodies if they won't help me use old lenses?

April 13th, 2008, 05:40 PM	#16 (permalink)
Albert4321 Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: November 8th, 2006 Posts: 153	Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? I am very happy with the new FW. But I want to see hi ISO capability in the future FW.

April 13th, 2008, 06:57 PM	#19 (permalink)
4season Erfahrener Benutzer Join Date: October 16th, 2006 Posts: 190	Re: Will There Be New Firmware Updates for the M8? "Classic Mode": Requires you to remove baseplate and extract card every 36 exposures, whether card is full or not. Frees photographer from the tedium of uninterrupted shooting. Also adds simulated sound of slow speed shutter mechanism, including bouncing BB effect at the lowest speeds. Memo: For those who miss the M4-2's blank memo plate that you could write on, this new feature simply whites out the M8's screen, Markers not included. Cuteness enhancer: Enhances the charm of any person, pet or situation. Magenta remover: Turns any pink or magenta subject black. For situations where a UV/IR filter isn't available. Also referred to as the "Gothifier" Photo limiter: After X number of photos (user configurable) the camera will begin to overwrite. Guarantees you will come home with no more than X photos. Really saves on disk space!