Anyone attempt to adjust their M8 rangefinder?

[eleskin]

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I am just wondering who on this forum adjusts the rangefinder on the M8. Most, me included, send theirs out to Leica. I could imagine situations where you would want to know how to do it (away on a long trip in a third world location, cost savings, not wanting to wait for your camera to come back after a few weeks, etc,,,.

 

So what are the steps for this and what tools are necessary? How hard is it to do?

[wstotler]

In the early days after the M8's release, many forum members tinkered with the M8's roller wheel to solve RF patch alignment issues for infinity focus.

 

The description of the procedure (photos by Pascal) is here:

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m8-forum/13933-new-backfocus-thread-solution.html#post146014

--> Note that you should read the whole thread on the issue before you decide to do it, if you're thinking about it. Caveats for the procedure are to get it right and perform it with care.

 

You can search the forum to get a sense of how many people did this--it was a fair number of the "adventurous early adopters" that were part of the forum's culture at the time. (As an aside, I believe most of the issues were not caused by poor QC at Leica but rather by: (1) vibration/handling during shipping de-calibrating rangefinders, (2) "pixel peeping" on screen leading to detection of focusing issues by users that would have been "missed" if shooting film, and (3) existing lenses owned by users that were near the limits of their tolerances, which, when coupled with the tolerance of the rangefinder's adjustment, could end up being "out of tolerance" when the two systems were mated.)

 

Other adjustments are possible--such as vertical RF patch alignment--and some forum members (a few) have done these themselves.

 

You may already know this, but I'll hit the issue in case readers that weren't around in 2007 are viewing this thread. Pertains to self-adjustment of the rangefinder, in general.

 

It has also been reported that "any skilled technician" familiar with rangefinders can perform the adjustments. However, it has also been reported that Leica NJ and Leica Solms have dedicated rangefinder focusing rigs for adjusting focus.

 

The key point of debate is that the Leica adjusts the rangefinder focusing to certain tolerances--self-tinkering, without a rig, puts you in the position of potentially having a rangefinder that works for the existing tolerances of your lenses--but not necessarily within the generally specified tolerances.

 

In other words, you run the risk of adjusting your rangefinder for your set of lenses but at the same time remove the compatibility with the full Leica lens range--that's the argument against self adjustment.

 

Here's where I say I wish I knew the Latin phrase to capture the meaning of "whatever works" because in practice if your camera is adjusted to your lenses and works. . . . Why does it matter? Especially if you won't be adding any lenses to your lineup or will be selling the body.

 

I have the sense that if there was a one-week turnaround time available at a reasonable price, many more people would send their body in for calibration during a CLA on a fairly regular basis. Investigation into adjustment tinkering looks to me to be a reaction to long service turn-around times coupled with a lack of faith in QC. (Hmmmmm. Adjust myself or lose my camera for 6 weeks to Leica and maybe they don't get it adjusted properly.)

 

Cheers!

Will

Edited October 1, 2010 by wstotler

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[eleskin]

Will

 

Turnaround time for me is the issue. Another is if you are traveling, and your rangefinder goes out of whack, you may not be near any Leica service facility, hence knowing how to do this is not a bad idea, even if it means not having perfection to leica tolerances, you can at least get by and take photos with your lenses. It seems this should be easy. I have even built my own camera out of an old Polaroid and converted it to 4x5 and had to modify the rangefinder with no problems at all. In my book, this was a much harder task than any simple turns of screws on a Leica Rangefinder it seems to me.

 

It is kind of like how to improvise when your car breaks down in the middle of nowhere. I carry duct tape, basic tools, etc,,,,. We should have the same philosophy with a Leica M as well when we are shooting on location. I am an intense user of my M8 with over 70,000 exposures so far, and this new (used) one is my new backup (only 4,000 shots so far on its shutter!!! Mint condition and the sensor is fine! Not bad for $2,350 USD!).

 

Ed

[eleskin]

Will,

 

Thanks for the link on the thread associated with this issue. If I can tune my car up and build my own computers and a newtonian telescope, this should not be difficult at all for me. The photos are a real help too!

 

Thanks!

 

Ed

[eleskin]

The only thing here is what actually happens when you use the hex on the roller cam? Does the slight turn bring it a little in or out? I am guessing that is the case.

[don_panko]

The camera lens still has a distance scale so why not just use it if the rangefinder fails while travelling? Opening the camera in a dusty environment with rudimentary tools is a recipe for problems, in my experience. When you get back from your travels send it in for adjustment and cleaning and until then estimate the distance to the subject and set the lens. It's the simpler solution.

[eleskin]

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That makes sense, although I have fast glass and I love the focus to be on. Because of that, it would be worth my effort to adjust the camera. I am one of those f1.0 to f1.4 people.

[wstotler]

Turnaround time for me is the issue. Another is if you are traveling, and your rangefinder goes out of whack, you may not be near any Leica service facility, hence knowing how to do this is not a bad idea, even if it means not having perfection to leica tolerances, you can at least get by and take photos with your lenses. It seems this should be easy.

 

This is where I say "get a second body" if you want iron-clad piece of mind. Because while it seems this adjustment should be easy--and the infinity focus adjustment *is* easy--it wasn't designed to be end-user-servicable, not really.

 

There have not been a spate of complaints on the forum about the RF becoming "unadjusted" due to handling or a "whack," just as an FYI. People reported out-of-the-box issues with their M8s and RFs a lot in 2007. For many folks, the infinity focus issue was the primary problem. Mainly because of a freshly discovered "bad pairing" of M8 plus a lens they already owned.

 

I think my main point is that with care you can adjust infinity focus in the field--and maybe even the vertical alignment issue--because you can test what you're doing. The other focus adjustments are tricky and really require a test rig to "get it right," especially if you're going to be shooting at f/1.0 or f/1.4 and require critical focusing accuracy. This is my understanding, anyway. Me? If I had a problem now other than with infinity focus, I'd be shipping my M8 off to Leica.

 

Have a look here:

Leica FAQ — Rangefinder adjustment

 

And this supporting document, that mentions the test rig/jig:

http://leica.nemeng.com/binz/rf_adjust.txt

--> It's in an M6 context, but methodology applies.

 

I applaud your DIY spirit with this--it's a reasonable thing to think about--and agree about turn-around time.

 

Cheers!

Will

 

P.S. If you *really* want to dig into this issue, bug Leica Service about it to figure out, precisely, what they do during the calibration process . . . and then bring it back to the forum. I've not seen a detailed description about the adjustment process anywhere.

Edited October 1, 2010 by wstotler

[eleskin]

I am very pleased to report that I have been very successful in adjusting the rangefinder for myself. I used the 2mm Allen wrench inside the roller and ALL of my lenses focus dead on! That is including my Noctilux at f1.0! This was a very simple procedure, and I will now keep the 2mm Allen wrench with my camera all the time. I do not anticipate it going out of focus too often, but it is nice to be prepared just in case. I would consider that for anyone who uses the M Leica often, knowing how to adjust the rangefinder is absolutely necessary to give piece of mind when working in all kinds of locations.

[wstotler]

As an addendum to this thread, above I mention the test rig used for checking focus--not mandatory for infinity focus, but for fine focus adjustments, absolutely required.

 

Jeff posted about the rig itself in this thread (thanks, Jeff):

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m8-forum/144335-adjusting-rangefinder-m8-very-easy.html#post1473918

 

Cheers!

Will

[bocaburger]

I am very pleased to report that I have been very successful in adjusting the rangefinder for myself. I used the 2mm Allen wrench inside the roller and ALL of my lenses focus dead on!

 

Have you actually taken shots with all of them and viewed them at high magnification? Here's the reason I ask. I have 3 lenses (35 Summicron III, 35 Summicron IV, and 50 Summicron 11819) all of which don't quite coincide at infinity (on either my M8 or M9); however all the rest of my lenses do. Nonetheless all my lenses including those 3, when shot wide open at either infinity or the nearest distance, are dead-on (and if they were "out" at infinity they would be way out at near distance where DOF is much less). If I were to readjust my rangefinder with any of those lenses so the images coincide exactly at infinity, I would not only throw the focus accuracy off throughout the rest of the range, but for all my other lenses as well. So my advice is to make some careful test shots if you haven't already.

[efix]

I did some fiddling with my M8's RF alignment when I first got the CV 35/1.4 Nokton, which was terribly off everywhere. So I adjusted the RF to be spot on with the Nokton at f/1.4 and .7m. Then, when I decided to send the Nokton back and get the 35/2 Biogon, it was naturally off, so I aligned the RF again wide open and close. With the Biogon, though, infinity was then off (due to the lens, though, not the RF). When I then decided I didn't like the 35mm all that much on the M8, I got a 28/2.8 M-Rokkor, with which I had no focusing problems whatsoever due to its larger d-o-f, despite the RF being misaligned at infinity. Then I got the 50/1.5 Nokton in addition to the 28/2.8, which I then used to realign the RF again wide open and close focused. And behold - even though I was using a cheap adapter that lets me focus beyond infinity with the Nokton, the RF is now spot on. I tried it with a 50/0.95 Noctilux recently, and focus was perfect at 0.95.

 

I guess fortune favoured me fool there ...