ironringer Posted July 15, 2014 Share #1 Posted July 15, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Could users of the ITOOY (#12580), IROOA (#12571) and other similar lens hoods with "clamping teeth" (e.g. #12585 for several 50 mm and 35 mm lenses) please identify (product code, and number) the thin reverse cap (marked "42" inside) as shown in the pictures? These lens hoods/shades that clamp-on lens barrels of approximately 42 mm outside diameter can use the thick, slotted, reverse plastic cap shown (also marked "42" inside). I believe this slotted plastic cap has product #14033 (unknown code) as listed in a 1982 Handbook of the Leica-System. The thin cap shown also fits the ITOOY and similar hoods, clamped in place, with the hood reversed to store on the lens. I would like to know its code and number, if they are contained in a catalog or price list. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/230547-help-identify-thin-plastic-42-reverse-cap/?do=findComment&comment=2630760'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 15, 2014 Posted July 15, 2014 Hi ironringer, Take a look here Help identify thin plastic "42" reverse cap?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
luigi bertolotti Posted July 15, 2014 Share #2 Posted July 15, 2014 (edited) ... Answer looks difficult... I have surfed a number of old catalogs and didn't find a reference to the cap at right (while the slotted at left is indeed a 14033, and is regularly listed in various catalogs) : the cap at right is similar, in priciple, with the 14037 which I have for my Summilux 50, and is also regularly listed on catalogs of the '60s, but of course the item you depict can't be a 14037, given that, as you say, if fits the hoods for 42mm lenses. Note that also the Summilux had a slotted cap similar to 14033 (14163) Edited July 15, 2014 by luigi bertolotti Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc_braconi Posted July 15, 2014 Share #3 Posted July 15, 2014 Usually, the flat one is for use with hood 1st generation I mean with narrow chrome ring Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted July 15, 2014 Share #4 Posted July 15, 2014 Usually, the flat one is for use with hood 1st generation I mean with narrow chrome ring Really, JC ? I thought it was vice.versa... the large chrom rings have a double set of "spring-actuated inserts" (heep... don't know well how to name them.... ) so that, when the hood is mounted reversed, one set engages the inlet of the lens' mount, the other (upper ) engages in the "flat cap" inlet.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironringer Posted July 15, 2014 Author Share #5 Posted July 15, 2014 Interesting that no quick answers are available, although these thin caps are seen almost as often as the thick, slotted cap #14033. Does Leica-Leitz have a service that responds to such questions? Since this is probably a cap dating from the 1980s, there are likely employees who were there at that time, and remember the product. Looking through my few catalogs 1950s-1980s, I realise that Leitz apparently stopped using product codes (word acronyms) in the early 1980s, maybe earlier. Do historians know when Leitz stopped these product codes? I believe these code words were used to shorten telegram messages (use a code word instead of a description), starting in commercial use in the mid-1800's by many industries, when the telegram cost per word was significant. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted July 15, 2014 Share #6 Posted July 15, 2014 Leitz abandoned the famous "five letters" codes around 1960-1961... I do not know the exact date but am sure that : - products announced in 1959 had the old five letters codes - catalog of 1961 has the new five digits codes The five letters codes were indeed conceived for telegraph orders ; they had to abandon them after the big growth of listed products... of course, in strict math terms, with five letters you can manage MORE codes than with five digits... , but the old initial idea of "evocative" codes (ELMAR, LEICA, EKURZ, TELOO... filters always FXXXX...) was unusable by many years... numbers are better manegeable. Is interesting that initially the new coding system was five digits PLUS one letter (see many catalogs of early '60s) , then they abandoned the letter (and the five digits standard survived till today) ... I have an idea about this question... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted July 15, 2014 Share #7 Posted July 15, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) (I just verified on Summilux.net that a French catalog printed in 1960 has the old codes, and another printed in 1961 the new ones) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 15, 2014 Share #8 Posted July 15, 2014 Leitz abandoned the famous "five letters" codes around 1960-1961... I do not know the exact date but am sure that : - products announced in 1959 had the old five letters codes - catalog of 1961 has the new five digits codes The five letters codes were indeed conceived for telegraph orders ; they had to abandon them after the big growth of listed products... of course, in strict math terms, with five letters you can manage MORE codes than with five digits... , but the old initial idea of "evocative" codes (ELMAR, LEICA, EKURZ, TELOO... filters always FXXXX...) was unusable by many years... numbers are better manegeable. Is interesting that initially the new coding system was five digits PLUS one letter (see many catalogs of early '60s) , then they abandoned the letter (and the five digits standard survived till today) ... I have an idea about this question... I think the telegraph story is a bit apocryphal. Telex was used long after the 1960ies. I was still using it for communication with Africa in the early 1990ies. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironringer Posted July 16, 2014 Author Share #9 Posted July 16, 2014 Thank you Leica historians for clarification about the 1960-ish termination of code words for products. Telegram codes are a significant and non-Leica diversion from my enquiry about the thin plastic cap (product number still not identified), but it is interesting history. In fact, short word codes in telegrams through the 1960s were widespread, used in most areas of commerce (to save transmission costs), and developed starting before 1850! Most industries had their official "code books" for international use, typically using 5 letters (like Leica product codes) for thousands of useful expressions. I have seen the reference book (over 200 pages) "The Adams Cable Codex, Tenth Edition, 1896" mentioned on Wikipedia (see "Commercial code"), and our university library has other industry-specific code books, such as a fascinating code booklet for the shipping business. These communications people were very creative, designing a lot of specific meaning into short 5-letter code words. It is almost as interesting as classic Leica equipment ... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dg2mst Posted July 16, 2014 Share #10 Posted July 16, 2014 I faintly remember a story of somebody rather high up in Leica sales was actually illiterate as an explanation for those funny little words. However, the telex explanation sounds way more convincing to me... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted July 16, 2014 Share #11 Posted July 16, 2014 I think the telegraph story is a bit apocryphal. Telex was used long after the 1960ies. I was still using it for communication with Africa in the early 1990ies. True... indeed, what I think is that the evolution/revolution of Leitz codes was driven also by the evolution of "historical" telegraph-related technologies towards the technologies that led to Data Communication / Data Processing / IT... when I started my first job in 1982 (Honeywell Information Systems) "hybrid" Telex machines which acted also as terminals for mainframe computers were rather common... I remember well a typical usage from a big customer (the Nutella manufacturer ) : Telex machines in the branch offices for order input - communicating to an hybrid telex/terminal at central site for validation / control / print and input in the central mainframe : those terminals had already a slight degree of "intelligence"... for instance they could check the consistency / correctness of the codes they received from Telex (which were "dumb" devices and accepted many - not all - kinds of typing errors) ; in consequence of this, customers typically studied new codings given the good capabilities to automatically check errors (BEFORE feeding the precious mainframe... which could make controls of course, but at high cost and long time of back corrections) I think that the Leitz then-new coding (5 digits and one letter - I suppose the letter was a "control code") was related to this... abandoning the letter when evolution of DP tech made available more refined error checking techniques. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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