Ilford Witness & Dallmeyer Septac 2" f1.5

[John E Robertson]

Originally Posted by luigi bertolotti

NICE NICE : the "Leica-inspired-cameras" that are not trivial "Leica-copies" are very very interesting cameras: one day in Paris I saw a FOCA at a nice shop next to Montparnasse Cemetery... it was very fine... does some of our french friends have some pictures of it to show ?

I have been looking for a nice used Foca Standard (the one with no r/f and a 35mm lens.)for some time, the make was never imported into UK, despite the mere twenty odd miles that divides the two countries!! There are a couple of good Foca sites but their photographers never seem to visit other sites
Willy Ronis used Foca cameras for a while.
OPL FOCA: materiels, appareils photographiques, accessoires et documentations

[John E Robertson]

Duncan
Just looking at some pictures of the Witness, I notice the close proximity of the lens release button to the lens mount. I sure some screw thread lenses will not mount on this camera, one I can think of is the current Nokton 50mm f1.5. Have you tried other lenses on it??

John.

[dkpeterborough]

Originally Posted by John E Robertson

Duncan
Just looking at some pictures of the Witness, I notice the close proximity of the lens release button to the lens mount. I sure some screw thread lenses will not mount on this camera, one I can think of is the current Nokton 50mm f1.5. Have you tried other lenses on it??

John.

John, I have fitted 5cm and 90mm Elmars without any problems ... I am not familiar with the Nokton but just Googled a picture of one and it looks as if it will fit.

Dunk

[dkpeterborough]

Originally Posted by John E Robertson

MW had this Daron lens for sale a few weeks ago



think its sold now.
I have and use the Witness' little brother the Advocate. These were used on the Successful 1953 Everest Expedition.

MW Classic are offering another DARON lens s/n 1087 with interrupted thread for the Witness camera this week 15/03/2008 priced £2495

http://www.mwclassic.com/acatalog/CD146L.jpg

... and have been advised by Mahendra that they sold a Witness complete with a Daron lens to Japanese collector recently for £5000 .

dunk

[John E Robertson]

I noticed this Dunk, a bit too expensive for my taste!!!!
Taylor Hobson supplied large numbers of camera lenses to various UK government departments, I bet there are some lying on a shelf in some store somewhere. Perhaps that is where these surfaced from!!!
John.
BTW I have now got a Foca and love it to bits, its a delight to use!! I bought it from a guy in the Focaforum, fully serviced, gives great results.

[dkpeterborough]

[quote=John E Robertson;514330]I noticed this Dunk, a bit too expensive for my taste!!!!
Taylor Hobson supplied large numbers of camera lenses to various UK government departments, I bet there are some lying on a shelf in some store somewhere. Perhaps that is where these surfaced from!!!
John.
QUOTE]

John, The Daron lens was made by Dallmeyer not TTH . Ilford did supply some Witness cameras to HM Govt. Prisons but these had 9cm lenses according to Andrew Holliman's ILFORD book. Incidentally, Andrew Holliman's "MAX No." table on page 46 of his book shows 164 Daron lenses and 335 Witness cameras ... but these totals appear to have been miscalculated and must be 1 short ... ie if lowest and highest serial numbers are 5004 and 5339 ... and 942 and 1106 ... then totals s/b 165 and 336.

336 cameras of which only 75 are known to exist according to A. Holliman's last published census is a very small figure and thus explains the current premium price. By the way, I think I have identified just a few more known serial numbers (probably maximum of 5) Witness cameras not listed in AH's full census figures (he sent me his spreadsheet showing all the individual cameras serial numbers he has traced)... I found the additional numbers in old Sotheby and Christies auction catalogues but need to back-track and document them properly when have a few spare hours.

There are probably some almost as scarce Leica cameras which command nowhere near the current Witness £3k body price. Consider the Leicaflex SL2 MOT with reputedly just 1020 made many of which would have been subject to heavy professional use ... so it is unlikely that there are many SL2 MOT models in collectible condition ... but the few that appear for sale seldom sell for more than £1k (ish)

Cheers

dunk

[John E Robertson]

Sorry Duncan
I didn't mean that the Daron was made by TTH, I meant to say that I often wonder what is lurking in the Government's "drawers" if you know what I mean. As Wray, Dalmeyer, TTH and others supplied them with equipment.
My TTH Anastigmat turned up that way, I bought it about 20 years ago, brand new in its original wraping with a couple of test negatives included. Its absolutely superb, and is used on my Bessa R2. A relative who worked at Aldershot found it, it cost me £20, he said there was other "stuff" there.
British lenses and camera equipment is often "written off " when compared to German and Japanese stuff, but it should not be.
My Foca lens is also a bit rare, according to Focagraphie only about 200 Oplex 35mm lenses made, and mine has a serial number only 20 less than the last recorded one.
The French were another government who hoarded a lot of camera equipment made in their own country.
Have you shot much with the Witness yet??

[dkpeterborough]

Have not used the Witness yet ... but just taken early retirement so should have more time now to use cameras as well as collect them. Your Foca camera is a good find.

Cheers

dunk

[michael_boylan]

Originally Posted by dkpeterborough

the 39mm screw thread has 3 'gaps' or 'slots' cut into it enabling the thread to be 'bayoneted' onto the body ... but the similarly interrupted body thread will also accept normal L39mm thread lenses.

How totally brilliant is that. I want one.

[John E Robertson]

Another Daron has appeared in MW classics site this weekend. Where are these suddenly surfacing from???

[ecdysiast]

I have a Witness, but with the 2"/1.9. I'll have to check the serial number and post it.

The cutaway-thread lens mount is similar to that on the Steinheil Casca and Casca II, which were designed at about the same time. See

Casca

[dkpeterborough]

Originally Posted by ecdysiast

I have a Witness, but with the 2"/1.9. I'll have to check the serial number and post it.

The cutaway-thread lens mount is similar to that on the Steinheil Casca and Casca II, which were designed at about the same time. See

Casca

Please post the serial numbers of your Witness and lens

Thanks

dunk