Summilux 50 mm f/1.4

[jimleicam3]

I have been shooting more and more at night with a cron 50 mm f/2. I am thinking of moving up to a Summilux 50 mm, f/1.4. The 50 mm f/1 is out of my price range. Is the difference between the Cron and the Summilux that great, and is there a difference in the black vs silver? Thanks

[RITskellar]

Originally Posted by jimleicam3

I have been shooting more and more at night with a cron 50 mm f/2. I am thinking of moving up to a Summilux 50 mm, f/1.4. The 50 mm f/1 is out of my price range. Is the difference between the Cron and the Summilux that great, and is there a difference in the black vs silver? Thanks

I have both (latest Summicron and pre-asph Summilux 50's), and use the Summilux almost exclusively over the Summicron. The latter is a bit more contrasty, maybe just a tad sharper at larger apertures. I happen to like the way the Summilux 50 pre-asph renders very much, just a little softer/smoother IMHO.

As for silver vs. black... in both the Summicron and Summilux, the silver is significantly heavier. Enough so that I sold my silver versions and now use black ones on everything, even the silver chrome bodies I have.

[cbretteville]

The pre-asph Summilux is also a lot more resistant to flare than the Summicron. If you decide to get one make sure you get one that has a serial number above 1844000. The second generation of the 50/1.4 is quite a bit better than the first generation, especially at f1.4 and f2.

- Carl

[gyoung]

Originally Posted by RITskellar

I have both (latest Summicron and pre-asph Summilux 50's), and use the Summilux almost exclusively over the Summicron. The latter is a bit more contrasty, maybe just a tad sharper at larger apertures. I happen to like the way the Summilux 50 pre-asph renders very much, just a little softer/smoother IMHO.

As for silver vs. black... in both the Summicron and Summilux, the silver is significantly heavier. Enough so that I sold my silver versions and now use black ones on everything, even the silver chrome bodies I have.

My experience tallies exactly with this, I am very happy with the pre aspheric Summilux although I sometimes still use the (1st type rigid) Summicron on the M3, it looks better on that camera than the newer black lens!

Gerry

[Perspectics]

I am currently testing the pre-asph 50mm lux with a "higher" serial and I am not sure if I really like it... my 35cron asph is just sharper, and the 50 lux pre-asph seems to be not very contrasty. I heard people comment on that in a positive way, like you could use the lense in a more challenging light environment. The bokeh is said to be harsher with the asph, I saw examples and can confirm. But I would not confirm that a soft bokeh looks better. Hard decision. Good luck

[thrid]

The pre-asph Lux is an interesting lens.

It was in production for over 40 years and in terms of optical signature and performance it is the bridge between classic and modern Leica designs.

I have the pre-asph Lux (last version), the current 2/50 Cron (M and R), the Summicron DR and collapsible. I also used to own a Noct and have owned and shot most other Leica 50's.

In terms of performance (sharpness at various apertures etc) Erwin Puts describes the pre-ASPH Lux as a 3rd generation 2/50 Summicron, that has been opened up a stop and based on my experience I really agree with that. In English that means it is plenty sharp. ;-) Peak performance is between f8 and f11.

But the Lux has a look of it's own. Contrast is good, but the tonality that this lens produces is outstanding, especially in b/w. Same for the bokeh; it's smooth as slik. Flare resistance is better than the Summicron. Overall the lens delivers that pleasing, but difficult to define Mandler look.

The weak point of the pre-asph Lux is it's performance wide open and close up. It's gets a little soft, but no where as bad as something like the Canon EF 1.4/50. The ASPH version remains razor sharp under these circumstances, due to it's floating element. On the other hand this trait makes the pre-ASPH very good for portrait work.

The optical design of every lens is a balancing act between various performance traits.
I've shot a lot of 50's over the past 10-15 years and in my opinion the Lux pre-ASPH is the best balanced design I've used and therefore my main 50.

[nobbylon]

Originally Posted by Perspectics

I am currently testing the pre-asph 50mm lux with a "higher" serial and I am not sure if I really like it... my 35cron asph is just sharper, and the 50 lux pre-asph seems to be not very contrasty. I heard people comment on that in a positive way, like you could use the lense in a more challenging light environment. The bokeh is said to be harsher with the asph, I saw examples and can confirm. But I would not confirm that a soft bokeh looks better. Hard decision. Good luck

I was of the same opinion when I first got my pre asph lux 50. After getting used to the 35 asph cron images it was at first a little disappointing. However I stuck with it, learned it's focus softness at 1m wide open and adjusted accordingly and now think this lens is superb. For portraits it's fantastic, giving a very creamy oof look wide open. Stop down a couple and it's plenty sharp if that's what you need. Mine front focus's by about 2-3cm wide open at 1m and I just tweak the focus a tad. Definately a great lens. I've uploaded a few examples, all shot wide open from memory apart from my boy in football shirt at f2.

[Perspectics]

thrid and nobbylon, very interesting contributions, thx! BW & portrait are obviously within the sweetspot of the pre-asph 50/1.4, and that happens to be what I want the lense for. (Until now I had to portray with the 90/4 and results look great but its just too long.) What I also like is that the pre-asph does not obscur any of the viewfinder but I'm missing the little nibble that helps you focus with one finger, which you find at the asph version. Matter of taste I guess.

[budrichard]

Simple answer: Except for the ASPH Summilux, the Summicron will be sharper and considerably so wide open that the Summilux. So if you want sharp, stick with your Summicron unless you want to to pay for ASPH Summilux.
I have the 50 DR Summicron and found that wide open it's one the sharpest lenses i have ever used and at night its a dream!-Dick

[lonersam]

I use the Noc F1, Cron (latest version), Elmar collapsible, Tri-Elmar (28,35,50) these 50mm lens. They all have different characters:

The Noc paints dreamy pictures, the Cron draws like a hard 1H pencil, while both the Elmar and TE excel in their own specialties and that is portability and convenience respectively. My description does not meant to be poetic 'cuz indeed they are just like that.


Here are my feelings towards using these lens:

See I don't feel very comfortable carrying the pricey and rather large Noc everyday. As I am much into portraits photography which the Cron just illustrates too harshly for most of my pictures. The Elmar is indeed portable but it is not particularly sharp while its OoF is just mellow 'cuz its strength is really on its physical properties/outer-appearance. The TE's F/4 makes it less versatile for low-light environments, not to mention that it is not as contrasty as the other 3 lens above.



I take their good and I am accepting their bad. They are all tools for different needs. Like I wear my pair of Jordan when I b/ball and wear the New Balance when I jog.


And now, what the tool I need is:

1) to have better shooting capability in low-light environments;
2) to have a noticeable Leica-feel bokeh as well an average plus grade sharpness;
3) to have good contrast;
4) not outrageously expensive to the point that I keep worrying about it as I shoot daily;
5) to have a descent size and weight.


After researching diligently everyday from the internet for almost 2 weeks, I think I can conclude that the 50mm Lux pre-ASPH is just what I need. I ain't giving up my existing tools for the moment 'cuz they all serve different purposes.



-Sam

[darkstar2004]

I would get the pre-ASPH Summilux over the f/2 'cron; JMHO. I have one and it is a great lens.

As far as low light shooting, just pretend it is a Noctilux and shoot wide open. You won't get the Noctilux "boker" but you will get better quality images and your wallet will be about $4500-4700 American heavier...

[lonersam]

Originally Posted by darkstar2004

I would get the pre-ASPH Summilux over the f/2 'cron; JMHO. I have one and it is a great lens...

That is exactly what I am gonna do.

[j. white]

I've had the opportunity to shoot with both and by far preferred the pre-aspherical Summilux to the Summicron. It simply has more character in its rendering. The thought that keeps coming back to me in comparing the two is that perhaps the Summicron is just a bit too well corrected.

For those familiar with vintage microphones (anyone?), it recalls the time-honoured comparison between the Neumann U47 and the U47-FET.


-J.

[lct]

Originally Posted by budrichard

Simple answer: Except for the ASPH Summilux, the Summicron will be sharper and considerably so wide open that the Summilux...

Not my experience as far as my lenses are concerned. My late 50/1.4 pre-asph is sharper at f/2 than my 50/2 # 11819.

[lonersam]

Originally Posted by lct

Not my experience as far as my lenses are concerned. My late 50/1.4 pre-asph is sharper at f/2 than my 50/2 # 11819.

This makes me wonder if it is possible that say even the same period of late 50/1.4 pre-ASPH lenses could perform rather differently? I tend to trust Leica's quality control while perhaps it is simply a matter of the eyes of different beholders.

[lct]

Haven't got any QC problems with my 20+ M lenses so far.
The last version of the pre-asph 50/1.4 has lost its 'glow' but gained obviously some sharpness at fast apertures. The bokeh remains smooth and the flare resistance very high fortunately.
The asph version is more contrasty generally. It is also sharper at fast apertures, its bokeh is still smooth there but becomes somewhat harsher from f/2.8 to f/5.6. Resistance to flare is very good as well.
For more details, see:
http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-...tml#post175206
http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-...tml#post516055

[Rolo]

I've just traded my very latest pre-asph 50mm Summilux for a Summilux 50mm asph.

My experience with the pre-asph was very disappointing and the results gave me nothing like the quality of the prior late Summicron I traded. I wanted an f1.4 for using wide open for weddings inside churches. All I wanted was an extra stop - what I gained was an extra stop that was unusable.

In fact, in spite of proving focus and returning it to Solms for checking, I didn't like the results at all until it got to f4. What's the point of that ??

Maybe it's alright for soft portraits, but so's a Holga. I like snap and then OOF, so I'm expecting that the Asph will do it. I had a 35mm Cron asph and sold that to get the extra stop, and I'm not convinced that the money was well spent.

Latest Summicrons are fabulous performers wide open, small, light and easy to operate quickly. Wide open with 1/8th second, you can get great images in the dim glow of a building. Lux's are expensive, so make sure that you need/like/want one.

Unfortunately, few of us can loan one for sufficient time. If it's to join a kit bag with a number of lenses, it can take years to realise the capability of a single lens. That could well be my problem and I don't know my lenses well enough to get the very best out of them. To rectify this, I've recently done close focus sharpness testing and infinity testing on every lens I own. Taken me 20 years to get around to it, but back focus issues with the M8 prompted me to do it.

The results were informative, identified which lenses I need to stop down to improve the quality. It also added the 50mm Summilux M to my disposal list, clarified Leica v Canon issues for me and also identified a major issue with a Hasselblad zoom lens caused by a loose component inside that had to be fixed. Using digital capture it only takes a few hours to do this.

Hope this helps.

Rolo

[wizard]

Originally Posted by Rolo

I didn't like the results at all until it got to f4.

Although I wouldn't go as far as saying I don't like the results of my pre-asph. Summilux 50 lens at apertures between 1.4 and 2.8, there's no denying that if you want real snap at 1.4 you better get the new Summilux 50 asph. No other 50mm lens I own (and that's way too many ) even comes close to this lens wide open. I even prefer the way the 'lux asph draws over the current Summicron, colors are more vivid, the tonality is fantastic and the lens is sharp as hell without giving that 'harsh' impression.

Andy