R5 or...

[nobbylon]

Originally Posted by andybarton

At the end of the day, the body is merely a box to hold the film, and make a shutter open at an appropriate speed.

The glass is what makes the image.

IMHO, Leica glass makes a better image than Zuiko glass.

YMMV

I probably didn't say it properly, camera make, lens make, at the end of the day it's the photographer who makes the images. I've seen some rubbish posted up on the net taken with posh and expensive glass, I've taken plenty myself but hopefully only put the nicer stuff on! equally some beautiful pics taken with some cheaper lenses can be found on various forums. I'm not an anti leica guy at all, but equally I don't wear Leica blinkers.
Ps your co-ords intrigued me so I looked them up. I used to fly over your place quite often when out of Hawarden and Liverpool in the late 80's,
all the best j

[rogera]

I have an R9 (digital module also) and I must say that despite what appears to be an enormous unweildy camera, it is smooth and the viewfinder is magnificent. I really feel that any viewfinder difficulties I have occur only when I use my 35-70mm f4. And that is strictly my own fault. My vision is not what it used be and I have some difficulty with the focus. R3-R9, they are all magnificent!

[Camera Obscura]

I agree with John and other R8 users. They look and are a little heavy, but they are a true pleasure to work with and all controls are exactly where they should be.

Stay away from the R4 though. Just took one out last weekend and she blocked every time I put her down. Repair is so expensive that it is better to buy another body.

I got my R8 body 2 years ago, "new", and the price was very very good.... My humble suggestion to go for....

[zernikepolynom]

It might also depends on the size of your hand. In my rather large hands, even a R8/R9 with DMR feels actually just right.

[earleygallery]

Originally Posted by andybarton

At the end of the day, the body is merely a box to hold the film, and make a shutter open at an appropriate speed.

The glass is what makes the image.

IMHO, Leica glass makes a better image than Zuiko glass.

YMMV

Getting OT but wanted to add my comments on this point. Whilst I agree that the glass makes the image, the feel/handling and functionality of the camera body is important and does IMO affect the way one works. Some cameras feel awkward to use, others are just ergonomically 'right' and it differs for everyone.

After all, no one needs to use a Leica body to use Leica glass! But we do of course.

I recall an author who uses different types of pen/pencil and paper depending on what they are writing because the feel of say a biro and notepad makes them inclined to write differently than using a fountain pen and quality paper.

Likewise an artist will adapt to different styles depending on the materials they use.

As for Leica glass v others, the image is the image. If its made with a Tamron lens and its still a great image that's really all that matters to me - we use what we have and I don't lose sleep worrying about how much better a given image would have been if I'd used this or that lens.

[nobbylon]

Originally Posted by earleygallery

As for Leica glass v others, the image is the image. If its made with a Tamron lens and its still a great image that's really all that matters to me - we use what we have and I don't lose sleep worrying about how much better a given image would have been if I'd used this or that lens.

Exactly!

[storybrown]

It all depends on what you want to do, of course, but if you're a film guy, and an SLR person, any of the Rs will be great - something to be said for all of them, and each will have their champions. I use an R4sP & R8, along with an SL, tho I have others. You can't miss with any of them. I think the R3s are cheapest now, and everyone I know who has one brd on it. Any R3/4 working now is fine, and if it isn't for "original" reasons, can often be easily fixed. Or, you could get an SL or SL2 & work up with all the lenses.

Good shopping & shooting!

[bill]

This is a really helpful thread. I wouldn't be buying an R as a main camera - my Ms and LTMs do that, and I also have a DSLR. This is all about the glass, for me, and about having a body I get on with. I accept the ergonomic comments about the R8/9 and am not ruling them out, but I think I need to do some "window shopping" to see what suits me best.

Thanks again everyone.

Regards,

Bill

[rob_x2004]

Bill the R8/9 is less ergonomic than the R6/7. It is however more streamlined, and some say .... stylish. The only thing easier to reach on hte R9 is the shutter speed dial, a moot point if you arent a fully manual sort of guy.

[masjah]

Originally Posted by rob_x2004

Bill the R8/9 is less ergonomic than the R6/7. It is however more streamlined, and some say .... stylish. The only thing easier to reach on hte R9 is the shutter speed dial, a moot point if you arent a fully manual sort of guy.

Hmmmm.......

Some may disagree.

[rob_x2004]

Some of us have opposing thumbs. By what measure do you make the r9 ....ergonomic?

[Photoskeptic]

I had an R5. Not a bad body, but that shutter noise - oh,my! Of course that is always the reaction when your first Leica was an M
Watch out for gummy seals - easily repaired but have it fixed before you go shooting.
If you get one email me with your address and I'll send you a genuine Leica owners manual for it.

[rob_x2004]

You think the r6 is loud. You wait till you hear the r9. Make sure you have the neck strap on the mirror slap just about has it out of your hands.

[earleygallery]

The R3 has a very quiet shutter.

[andybarton]

Originally Posted by rob_x2004

You think the r6 is loud. You wait till you hear the r9. Make sure you have the neck strap on the mirror slap just about has it out of your hands.

Rubbish.

[rob_x2004]

Have you got a 6.2 Mr Tighten My Tripod Screw with multigrips?
:

[masjah]

Originally Posted by rob_x2004

Some of us have opposing thumbs. By what measure do you make the r9 ....ergonomic?

Ah that must be it - I've got two left hands. Come to think of it though, I've got fingers as well, which I also use.

I've shot with an R 6.2, though I don't own one - and with an R8 and an R9 - of which I own both. The latter two suit me better, that's all. They obviously don't suit you better - that's fine - I was simply making the point that not all people would subscribe to your view, and that Bill would be well advised to try both styles and not dismiss the R8/R9.

[bill]

Although I have held an R8/R9 before, I have never held an R3/4/5/6/7. Ergonomics is a funny and very personal thing; I have large hands with long fingers and have an Abrahamsson Rapidgrip on my M7, a Luigi case on my M2 and IIIc, but absolutely nothing on the smallest of the lot - my IID.

This is why I think from all of the above what I am taking away from this thread is that I need to actually go into a... thing... whossname... er... "shop", and compare and try, rather than just pressing the button on an interweb transaction.

Thanks again.

Regards,

Bill

[tobey bilek]

All R4 models and R5 lack a decent mirror dampening system. I got sharper pics with my Leicaflex, SL, R3, Various R6 and 6.2 and R7`s.

All the rest are gone except the R6`s R 6.2`s and two R7 `s

The R4 went back with vibration complaints. Leica claimed there was nothing wrong. Yet I had noticeably sharper pics from the R3, same lens, same speeds, same f stops, same time, same subject, exact same roll of film.

Obviously I did not do the test without first suspecting a problem. Actually even tripod shots were not sharp.

R7`s have a much improved electronics over the R5

[garyp]

I wouldn't mind if my R8 bodies were lighter, but the lay-out and size is fine for me. I much prefer them over the smaller R bodies [I've owned most of them].
Of the smaller R bodies, the R7 was the one I liked the most, even tho' I had an R4 which went 7 years with no problems [I traded it, it may still be going for all I know].